Weird simplification of the base concept that children take after their parents.

>>153240923
This highlights that Jonas deserved his fate and far FAR worse than that.

He was talented human garbage, we should be thanking Rusty for ruining his legacy.

He probably would have been best pals with a lot of Epstien like figures, if you gave him enough time to fall into his own degeneracy.

>>153240993
wouldn't it be "over-complication", not simplification?

>>153241191
I guess

>>153240993
Eh, i mean the series is literally about the imperfections and missing pieces of cloning so it's apt

Wait is the monarch confirmed to be a Venture too? Was that in the movie?

>>153242480
Yeah, in the movie, they reveal that he's a clone of the original Rusty who, like Dean and Hank, died on an adventure. Monarch was given to Blue Morpho and his wife (with a small addition of baboon dna to make him not go bald) because they wanted a child of their own.

>>153242577
This pretty much makes Rusty and Monarch their own Dean and Hank, because the kids take over their father and uncle traits instead of their mother who was rule63 epstein.

>>153242649
Is this true?

>>153240923
Jonas Sr. was not a good man. The man was evil, anything else is a delusion.

>>153242649
the real venture brothers were the clones we made along the way

>>153242728
Here we go

>>153241146
>Best pals with a lot of Epstein like figures
This isn't even speculation, did you see the scene with the keychain party? Col. Gentleman alone is a Diddy/Epstein tier motherfucker.

>>153242728
>The man was evil, anything else is a delusion.
are we now forgetting what rodney did now?

>>153242728
>The man was evil, anything else is a delusion.
are we now forgetting what rodney did now?

>>153240923
...How did Rusty consume Jonas Venture in the womb if they are both clones?

>>153240923
>>Jonas Junior has the talent and charisma of Jonas Senior but does not use it mask any true nature and mostly seems genuine about wanting to be a boon to the world.
More importantly he lacks all of the physicality of his tall, handsome, strong father.

>>153240923
The monarch is considerably more charismatic than rusty, and almost all of Rusty's character is being obsessed with bullshit. Rusty isn't some bitter realist, he's a silver spoon sour grapes shitty nepo baby.

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>>153243983
Hank and Dean grew in an artificial womb, not too crazy of a stretch that Rusty and JJ did too.

>>153244553
The one missing piece of the reveal of Hank and Dean's origins in the movie, in my opinion, is that we don't actually learn why Rusty wanted children of his own bad enough to do this. Him finally having sex and getting stuck alone with the end results seemed a lot more apt.
It'd be one thing if the aftermath of getting shut out of Nikki's life after getting her pregnant left him longing for fatherhood, but with Dermott's age and the boys missing a few years from cloning delays, the timeline doesn't add up in that regard. The original boys would've already been toddlers by the time he fucked Nikki.

>>153245105
Rusty's sex diaries don't make a whole lot of sense; he says he didn't lose his virginity until he was 24 (implicitly after he left college in 1987) but he also apparently genuinely told Dr Quymn that it had been 19 years and change, which doesn't work for Dermott but does kind of work for Myra (who he also definitely said he'd had sex with); he's supposedly in his early 40s at that point which somewhat implies he had sex one time, or with one person in a relationship when he was 24

>>153243983
Ben mentioned the problem of "fetiform teratoma" when examining Dean, which irl is a kind of tumor resembling a fetus (portions of tumors often resemble structures found elsewhere in the body, due to misfiring genes in the cancerous cells); so the problem of JJ was at least known to Ben and presumably to Jonas Sr; Jonas also mentions getting the cloning program up and running again when he's trying to break out of the PROBLEM, but doesn't know who Hank and Dean are (he calls them Boys Brigade but shows no awareness of any relation despite having hooked into the VenTech systems), which suggests the cloning program was shut down when he was still alive, potentially over the problems they couldn't iron out

>>153242728
Comparatively, Brock and probably Rusty too are more evil than what we see Jonas do. Brock murders tons of people for no good reason, where Jonas 'pulls his punches' against villains like Scaramantula. Team Venture in general kills lots of people, but what we see of that it doesn't appear to be Jonas's intention typically; mostly it's Action Man being a psycho.

Basically, if Jonas is evil then so is Brock, Rusty, and everyone else in the cast. Even Hank and Dean get a bunch of people killed.

Alright.

>>153240923
Does Jonas Jr not have a doctorate's?

>>153243434
>>153241146
I wonder how they would have clashed it they'd met? I think Epstein would have wanted to add Jonas to his collection of blackmailed public figures, grossly over estimating his own ability to get some compromising dirt on him. He invites Jonas out to Little St. James via the Lolita express.
To his surprise, Jonas agrees but says he'll just take the X-1. He arrives to much fanfare from Epstein and his associates, gets shown around and plied with alcohol, yet he doesn't seem to get as sloppy drunk as Epstein would like.
Finally, Epstein decides to see if he can get some black mail material. He starts talking with Jonas about how boring things can get with a lot of money, how he has found himself needing more...interesting diversions, and how he's sure Jonas can relate.
Jonas laughs, agrees and then starts telling Jeffrey a story about a good time he had with a few years back.
As he's telling the story, Epstein begins to recognize that he's not even slightly drunk. This increasingly uncomfortable story about sexual acts he hadn't even dreamed of are being told to him with the clarity and casualness of a man talking about going shopping for cars. Jonas is telling him all of this deliberately and amicably, he wants Jeffrey to know about the most depraved shit he's been up to.
Jonas ends his story, Epstein's white as a sheet and shaking, looking at Venture with a new degree of fear.
"Hmmm, you're not looking so good there Jeff. Maybe I'll take a rain check and let you get some rest. We should get together again real soon though! If you feel like life's getting a bit dull, just give me a call and I'll show a party that'll make your head spin".
He gets back in the X-1 and flies off.

>>153244553
>not too crazy of a stretch that Rusty and JJ did too.
Rusty? Sure, if we're talking about original Rusty. Though I doubt it considering Jonas Sr. had no problem getting sex. JJ? No, absolutely not. JJ is directly a result of the then imperfected cloning process. He's a side-effect. They spell it out for us that he's a teratoma that developed into a person rather than staying as a benign sack of flesh filled with bile, hair and teeth (that's what they actually are in real life).

>>153249381
He got several while "Doc" (no actual doctorate except maybe from some sketchy diploma mill in Mexico) was on his bender after the boys died, between S1 & S2

>>153244553
That would imply Jonas let it happen or worst, caused it cause Super Science experiment gone awry....

>>153246702
It's different with Dean and Hank in that Rusty had multiple clones of them. When it comes to Rusty, I think Jonas only made him without any backups (Malcom was done as a favor).

>>153250743
Rusty must have had backups and deaths causing developmental delays in order to still be roughly the same age as Malcom in the mid-1970s when they were photographed together, because Rusty was at least 5 years old when Malcom was born in 1968

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I think the whole idea of Rusty being a clone of the original Rusty was due to timeline discrepancies they couldn't just justify with Hank and Dean being clones.

>>153250887
>not today, Rusty, not today

>here's shomething, Rodney killed a baybeh

>>153250818
Malcolm's age could have been sped up during the cloning process. Yeah, I know that this doesn't really work well given what Rusty had to do cloning that one kid who was mauled to death by a Gorilla at summer camp but Malcolm had Baboon DNA in him so it's different

>>153251158
The dialogue in this show is fucking impeccable.

>>153251456
There's a picture of him as a baby held by his mother in 1968 in one ep I think. And he's 8 when his parents die in the crash in 1976, and about 19 or 20 or so when Movie Night happens and Rusty leaves college in 1987.

>>153251512
Right, well Rusty did have all those cloning tubes for the Hank and Dean clones. Rusty tried pawning off his Fathers work as his own a lot so chances are he got the idea of cloning kids of his own from Jonas Sr and tweaked the cloning process to be better. Turned the power back on in the cloning room and got to work
That's why Hank and Dean have hair but also aren't super aggressive baboons either
The Ventures also figured out how to transfer souls into machines and clones but that's rarely touched upon. It's just a thing they're capable of doing

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Cigar?

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>>153251626
MINIONS!

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>>153251772
Cigar?

>>153242577
>with a small addition of baboon dna to make him not go bald


I just realized this is a reference to the baboon uterus transplant joke early on in the series

>>153240923
rusty is his cynical side
jj is the dreamer
the monarch has his charisma and capacity to make friends

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>>153240923
Why doesn't Monarch have an eaten absorbed twin if that's what Rusty did?

>>153251869
If we take Ben's word for it, the teratoma thing is simply an error in the cloning process. When gene-editting the Monarch, Jonas probably noticed it and got rid of it. We know that Rusty (who seemed to have perfected the cloner) can completely spruce up someone's DNA in a couple of minutes when he clones them, so I'm sure Jonas was able to remove a potential teratoma.

>>153243983
I interpreted that the "eating from the womb" thing was incorrect and that Jr. was a clone/tumor gone ala Basket Case.

Jr. isn't his twin. He's a Rusty clone.

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>>153251774
I'm not gonna eat the pennies!

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>According to Jackson Publick: "The kid in the Boy Scout outfit who looks like a cross between Amelia Earhart and Valerie Solanas is based on my friend Howard Bloom. I wanted an awkward, skinny, Jewish Boy Scout who quietly didn't fit in with the WASPy, all-American group. Howard Bloom is a friend, neighbor, scientist, and writer who has actually inspired a couple elements of Venture lore."
... But Phantom Limb isn't a WASP, he may be a snooty upper class douche but his name is Fantomás. He's not an Anglo-Saxon, he's a frog (and probably not protestant either).

>>153255411
oh the original Fantomas (in the novels, tho Limb is based at least in part on the 1960s movies) had a mixed background, he might have been a Brit, it's never really clear I think

>>153249428
Sounds plausible

>>153250818
>Rusty must have had backups and deaths
He didn't. The entire point of why he is the way he is is because unlike Hank and Dean, he had no backups after being cloned. From 1965 on he had to survive EVERYTHING. Every near death and traumatic experience is why he's a pill-popping blob of PTSD, fear and self loathing. What other clones there might of been, like Monarch, were also just prototypes that Jonas and Ben were working on to perfect their cloning tech.

>>153251565
>The Ventures also figured out how to transfer souls into machines and clones but that's rarely touched upon
Because they gave a clear explanation. The learning beds recorded synaptic data (I.E., the little electrical pulses in your brain that make up who you are) and stored them in a computer to backup their memories to be imprinted into new clone-slugs. It containing their "souls" is just the kind of supernatural side of that coin that was not meant on the machine's design because Jonas and Ben paid no heed to such things.

>>153243983
>How did Rusty consume Jonas Venture in the womb if they are both clones?
Because he didn't. JJ. isn't a twin. He's a teratoma that grew into a person as a result of the then imperfect cloning tech because the Rusty clone that we've known all this time was a prototype.

>>153252606
>We know that Rusty (who seemed to have perfected the cloner
Rusty did no such thing. He merely inherited the completed cloning tech from Jonas.

>>153240923
No, the show is about FAILURE.

>>153257582
>From 1965

Rusty clearly wasn't 3 during Spanakopita! (which explicitly dates itself via discussion of the X-2 to 1968), and he was 12 no earlier than 1976 (because anti-porn Linda Lovelace was at his 12th birthday party)

if he was 12 in 1976, then in 1987 when Movie Night happens and he leaves college, he'd be 23; but in Pomp and Circuitry its revealed he never graduated; it's not even clear he has an undergraduate degree, only the honorary doctorate he got in Tijuana

but also you're not a clone unless you're cloned from an original; if Rusty wasn't a clone (and he is a clone - Ben calls him one, and Ben would know) then he'd be an IVF zygote raised in a nutrient tank

also the existence of a clone (Monarch) named "R-22" implies numerous prior clones; Hank and Dean are the 14th or 15th clones of themselves, and both significantly older than they believe according to their driving license birthdates

Monarch seems to think that the Guild EMA levels were introduced after "50 years ago" when Turnbuckle tried to arch Rusty on the Venture compound in "A Party for Tarzan" which would put Rusty already walking around as of 1966, meaning 1965 can't have been his year of birth; but Monarch was definitely born as a baby in 1968 (and 8 years old in 1976 when his parents died) and yet is roughly the same age as Rusty when they're photographed together; this is impossible unless Rusty is a clone, as we know Rusty was walking around and quite developed in 1968

finally Rusty's letter to the Herculoids, calling them cowards for not fighting in Vietnam, places his 10th birthday between September 1967 (the Herculoids debut) and April 1975 (end of US involvement in Vietnam)

>>153257831
why would they spend 20 years making a show about yer da

>>153255411
I mean, WASP is a lifestyle just as much as it was a legacy/family thing. And Phantom Limb certainly carried himself with the attitude of a "high society" type, thinking himself too good for those around him.

>>153257831
It WAS about failure. FFS, did you ever even watch the show or drop it after like the first two seasons?

>>153259481
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-sLtporEeYw
It's a reference

>>153243876
Turnbuckle had it coming

>>153259639
> a schweet little baybeh

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>>153251792
Fuck me, is that what TF2 has jokes about monkey uterus/organ transplants?

>>153244015
no he has that (or would've), he's just a crippled midget
rusty and malcolm definitely don't have it, so it must be jr. that has it

>>153240923
I like that Rusty acts spiritually gay it adds a lot to Urbaniak’s performance

I always liked how Venture Bros showed old retired heroes. You don't often see that. But also:
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/IZiJw1F08Do
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/yOmbQNi56Fw
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/7mWWH9vCYqw
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/AaEATWzdLqg

>>153241146
What's with the obsession some people have with hating Jonas? How many fans of this show have daddy issues?

>>153261650
>why do people hate the abusive bastard?

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>>153260222
It's a leftover of Rusty intially being actually gay for Brock, which you can infer from Dia De Lose Dangerous, because haha Race Bannon and Benton Quest were totally gay lovers dood. They dropped that pretty quick as they were developed into their own unique characters instead of simple parodies, but it still bled into the portrayal.

>>153263631
Yea, if the series hadn't gone on as long as it did, the joke certainly would have lost impact. But having it be an early quirk because of early production ideas helps make it funnier. Plus, you can probably attribute it to whatever Rusty was on during season 1 before he gave it up cold turkey. Guy was acting like a froot loop the most early on before becoming just a bitter dickhead.

>>153263946
>Plus, you can probably attribute it to whatever Rusty was on during season 1 before he gave it up cold turkey
Rusty never gave up his medications. You could argue he just supplemented them briefly in the season 2 premier with actual fucking narcotics, but Rusty has never stopped self medicating himself.

>>153263946
>>153264252
I'm not sure if he ever completely stopped, but later on in the series they don't really show him popping pills anymore.

>>153264303
We know he was still medicating when Dr. Killinger tried to motivate him into supervillainy since his costume had pouches for his medication. So he seemingly didn't stop after S1.

>>153264252
Pretty sure he did since he barely popped anything during season 2 outside of maybe taking some shit at that rave party. Seemed like he had just settled for drinking his problems away, and maybe some alternative methods of stress relief like the vacuum when he and Brock went back to New York for that science expo

>>153264354
Season 3 isn't what I'd call "later on", especially not the second episode.

So Billy is a Venture right

>>153264403
Who isn't a Venture?

>>153264423
Pete, probably. It's funny that he considers Rusty his friend even though Rusty doesn't care about him but what Pete considers friendship might just be wanting to mooch off others

>>153264403
>So Billy is a Venture right
No. Just a functional hydrocephalic.
>his mom was associated with Team Venture
That doesn't necessarily imply that Jonas fucked her.

>>153264485
>That doesn't necessarily imply that Jonas fucked her.
Jonas didn't impregnate Monarchs mom to have him either, I just assume Billy is another Rusty clone. How? I assume Rose wanted a kid and Jonas whipped out a quickie with her DNA mixed with Rusty's and that's why he came out like that

>>153257582
Rusty most certainly did perfect the cloner, because otherwise Jonas would have made back-ups of HIMSELF. There's no way in hell that a selfish jackass like Jonas would have perfected cloning and NOT had Team Venture just cook-up the Jonas Mk II body in the event of his death.

>>153264403
It's possible, but far as we know, he isn't.
There's definitely some possible hints (namely his hair and his mother being associated with Team Venture), but for all we know, it's just Doc and Jack shitting around to make fans speculate.

>>153264507
He might have been planning it, but probably didn't have a body ready yet, hence the PROBLEM protocol. It's possible that was his plan along.
>In the event of death, stash body in PROBLEM
>Start cloning a body
>When body is ready, open PROBLEM and swap brains
Would explain why he was so quick on the plan he was dictating to Billy and Rusty. He had the general idea filled out, just adding the step of using Morpho's body to regain mobility until the cloning was ready.

>>153264494
That's even more retarded than saying he did fuck her.
>>153264507
>Rusty most certainly did perfect the cloner
No he didn't.
>There's no way in hell that a selfish jackass like Jonas would have perfected cloning and NOT had Team Venture just cook-up the Jonas Mk II body in the event of his death.
Whose to say he didn't and Rusty just aborted the slugs because there wouldn't have been a point in them since there were no backups of his mind? Not to mention he had no idea about the Problem on Garganuta 1. And there's no way Rusty would've perfected it because he is constantly shown to muck up anything left over of his dad's and has been shown to be so innept at Super-science that only TWO of his own inventions actually worked. The second of which only got working correctly because the GCI worked out the kinks after Phage got sent to Coma Town. Ain't no way Rusty had a hand in the development of the Cloning tech beyond being a test subject. He inherited it completed by the hands of Jonas Sr. and Ben.
>b-but Ben said in the halloween special
He was talking about the application of the tech, not it's development. The cloning tech was developed by Jonas Sr. and Ben and nobody else that we know of. But it certainly was not Rusty.

>>153259749
It looked like a ocelot. He was doing it a favor.

>>153264592
>Jonas making a Rusty clone baby for Rose is retarded even though there's already a precedent for it via The Monarchs existence
Fag

>>153264629
Seriously. I can get that there's plenty of reason to assume he fucked Rose, and for all we know, he might have given how he got around with just about every woman he crossed paths with. But acting like he couldn't have done a similar charity with Billy is just being flat out ignorant.

>>153264592
I think you're confusing "perfected" with "actually created". Rusty obviously became aware of the cloning tech once he inherited the compound. He came in, unwittingly replicated what his own dad did to make Hank and Dean, but then made it work reliably. Hank and Dean don't have any of the assumed genetic fuck-ups that Ben and Jonas predicted/observing the clones having.
When Rusty actually GIVES A SHIT about doing something, he tends to follow through; its just that, in this case, the work was already 90% done for him.

>>153264629
>Fag
That would be the case if it Jonas giving Rose a baby from splicing their DNA. Why would Jonas give her that instead of just fucking her and get her with child? He doesn't have that option with Mrs. Fitzcarraldo because she was infertile and he used it as a vehicle to dump a defective prototype clone. Seriously, do you not know the character? Did you not put any thought into this?

>>153264685
He gave the Fitzcarraldos a kid because even though he's a massive narcissistic bastard, he does have some heart. Do YOU not know the character?

>>153264685
>Why would Jonas clone a baby for Rose if he couldn't have just fucked her
Because Rose wouldn't date the Action Man for being what he was, she probably also wouldn't let Jonas fuck her because being close enough to Jonas as she was she would know what he's really about
This is the same man who "resurrected" Blue Morpho into Venturion because it was his warped way of being a good person. He's a son of a bitch but he does like the people he hangs with. He could have fucked Rose or he could have made Billy via a Rusty clone at Rose's request with possible strings attached, either way in his mind he's "being a good friend"

You're not just a fag but an idiot who thinks he's smart

>>153264681
>I think you're confusing "perfected" with "actually created"
No, I know exactly what's being discussed. Rusty did not perfect the cloning tech. Jonas and Ben did. Rusty inherited it as a finished product and used it for the same reason Jonas intended it for. The only thing they had in common with it was it's application.
>Hank and Dean don't have any of the assumed genetic fuck-ups that Ben and Jonas predicted/observing the clones having.
Because Jonas and Ben worked out those errors before Movie Night.
>When Rusty actually GIVES A SHIT about doing something, he tends to follow through; its just that, in this case, the work was already 90% done for him.
It was 100% done. The whole thing was made so that he would not have to worry about if Rusty died adventuring and could just pull a spare clone out to avoid a PR disaster because Jonas loves his public image more than anything else.

>>153264715
Yes, which is why he wouldn't do some convoluted shit like splicing his and Rose's DNA where he could otherwise just do the direct way and just fuck her. But in the end it doesn't matter because Billy isn't related to the Ventures.

>>153260054
No it's because it refers to when a baby was given a baboon heart to let it live for a week instead of a day
It's what the movie's subtitle refrences
Since then the idea of replacing things with baboon parts has been a thing in fictional surgery
Medic already replaced all the mercs hearts with baboon hearts for the uber

>>153264746
Maybe. Maybe not. We don't know for sure since the show is over and they never brought up Billy's father.

>>153264746
Again, this just cycles back around to the question of "If the cloning tech was already perfected, why wasn't there a back-up Jonas ready to go?" There zero reason to believe that he wouldn't have had back-ups of his own mind if he had a perfectly good, mostly successful cloner ready to be fired up at a moments notice. The PROBLEM protocol pretty heavily implies that it was imperfect. While PROBLEM was obviously meant to revive him with his whole body intact if they were able to his corpse in it, it seems very implausible that the cloner wouldn't have the immediate option #2 that he would have had Team Venture aware of. There's no post-it note saying "In case the light doesn't come on, tell Ben to rev up those tanks"?

>>153264795
>Again, this just cycles back around to the question of "If the cloning tech was already perfected, why wasn't there a back-up Jonas ready to go?" There zero reason to believe that he wouldn't have had back-ups of his own mind if he had a perfectly good, mostly successful cloner ready to be fired up at a moments notice
Unless, of course, it was that nobody WANTED him back. After movie night and sticking Jonas in the Problem Team Venture and Ben probably just went "fuck it" and aborted what potential clone slugs there were and deleted backups of his synaptic data because Jonas was a toxic element in all their lives, despite the good times he brought them.

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>>153264403
in the way that Hector and Swifty are, sure

>>153264539
Triple Threat (Rose Whelan) is a redhead

>>153264624
he really does look like an ocelot

>>153264592
>it certainly was not Rusty.

Ben's still around and still on the Venture compound when Rusty comes back from college; whatever happens then, whether Rusty comes up with the idea of cloning the boys from birth or whether that came later, after they died for the first time, really doesn't matter; Ben is clearly aware of what's going on (unlike OSI, excepting Brock who leaves it out of his reports)

>Have a kid one day, Dean. Hold its lifeless body in your arms, and then tell me how wrong it is.

>Your grandpap and I perfected genetic engineering because god or whatever gave us a perfect map to do so.

>Jonas, me, and, yes, your dad saw it as nothing more than a fuckin' band-aid for a really big boo-boo.

>>153264830
Honestly, that's probably the most honest answer. Team Venture had a habit of only remembering the aspects of Jonas that enabled their own insanity.

>>153264860
Yea, but we didn't see her until the fifth season once she was properly introduced. Unless the show comes back and we get insight into Billy's past, so it's really up in the air as far as anybody should be concerned.

>>153264942
nevertheless I feel confident in saying a red-headed woman can have a red-headed child without that child having a red-headed father

>>153242728
His contributions to super-science advancement still did a lot for humanity, thoughever.

>>153264423
I'm not... :(

>>153265582
So did Edison, Ford, and Hughes, but it's common knowledge that they were charismatic douchebags most people would hate if they knew the real men personally.

>>153266477
That you know....

>>153267168
you absolutely know there's a pit or a bunker somewhere on the Venture compound filled with the corpses of electrocuted elephants