//g/
"Everything is a file" is a retarded and unintuitive concept in the context of graphical operating systems. It made more sense in the 60s and 70s when computers were just overglorified typewriters and manipulating files and interacting with the operating system was simplified under a purely command line environment, but once directories became abstracted as folders it made less sense and just made it feel more needlessly complicated instead of having dedicated registries and configuration interfaces. The UNIX world has spent the past 30 years trying and failing to implement similar abstractions to their interfaces and hide the ugly filesystem hierarchy standard just to keep up with Windows. You know deep down it's true
Showing all 69 replies.
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and? what is your solution to all this??
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has nothing to do with GUI. to get memory page size (like 4096) on GNUnix, you need to.. read files? wheres memory, where are files? very different.

similar goes with other stuff, like IPC, GNUnixoids like to do.. sockets? really? where is network where is IPC.

it is also not really about unix philosophy being wrong, ive read those principles and they often go across GNUnixoid practice.
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>>108997433
>what is your solution to all this??
OS/2, Windows, ReactOS, anything that isn't UNIXSlop has already solved these issues
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>>108997440
>has already solved these issues
All those you mentioned use the term directory and folders interchangeably. What exactly did they solve?
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>>108997468
They traded the "everything is a file" paradigm for a centralized registry and dedicated configuration interfaces distinct from the filesystem itself
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>>108997481
Why does the windows registry look like a directory tree, tho?
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>>108997438
I/O registers
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>>108997494
To make it easier to read. Regedit just makes it look like that, in reality they're even less readable but you're not meant to directly interface with it anyways
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>>108997368
What difference does that make, when everything they built on top of Cutler's lovely kernel was a massive pile of shit?
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>>108997530
You say this as if most modern Linux distros aren't just failed attempts at abstracting the kernel and filesystem hierarchy standard behind loads of bloatware desktop environments, init interfaces, package managers etc
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>>108997440
And all they do is objectively shit and much much worse.

So your solution is something that is complete bullshit and a technological regression.
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>>108997508
the windows registry is nothing more than a virtual filesystem
>they made it a directory tree with files because its easier to work with
doe
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>>108997549
do you have a better solution?
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>>108997368
>Linux
>want to get the memory map of a process
>need to open some bullshit in /proc/pid/blahblah/map or something
>parse some TEXT FILE (lmao) to get the data you want
>what happens if the map of the process changes while you're reading halfway through the file? who knows lol
>Windows
>want to get the memory map of a process
>call VirtualQuery a few times
>each call is guaranteed to be self-consistent
>all data is returned in a struct you can directly use
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>>108997701
>map changes while VirtualQuery does god knows what
>*blue screen*
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>>108997721
Each call to VirtualQuery is guaranteed to return self-consistent data (for that one call only). The kernel acquires a lock while it is reading the data.
>does god knows what
the source code for the Windows kernel is publicly available on github
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>>108997737
>its self contained and aquires a lo..ACK
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Not everything is a file. When I new some dynamic memory, I work with pointers to data, not file handles. Syscalls like reading the time talk direct to the kernel and don't work like files.
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>>108997737
anon, windows VirtualQuery is known to randomly crash your shit
https://cplusplus.com/forum/windows/94627/
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>>108997440
>ReactOS
Lost me there anon. Not going to buy what you're seeling.
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>>108997762
>is known to randomly crash your shit
you just hallucinated this info
you can scroll to the bottom of the thread and find that the program crashes not because of VirtualQuery, but because he incorrectly assumed that a guard page is safe to read just because it has the "readable" attribute.
If you access a guard page in a way that is compatible with its other access protections, then your application will receive a STATUS_GUARD_PAGE_VIOLATION exception, which you need to handle. If you do not handle the exception, as with all other exceptions, the app crashes.
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>>108997368
Yes, I agree but oh well. I'm still using Linux regardless.
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>>108997800
>you just hallucinated this decade old forum threa... ACK
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>>108997824
>linuxtrannies are this illiterate
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>>108997368
>The UNIX world has spent the past 30 years trying and failing to implement similar abstractions to their interfaces and hide the ugly filesystem hierarchy standard just to keep up with Windows
You mean Smalltalk?
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>1990s OS design is superior to 1970s OS design
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defend this shitty system.

It's so bad that kludges like SELinux and Extended ACLs are needed just to make Linux as secure as baseline Windows NT SIDs and ACLs.
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>>108997906
any form of multi-user isolation on a shared system where users are allowed to run arbitrary code is just security theater and always has been
see spectre and meltdown
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>>108998193
>>108998203
there's code in there to detect how gay the user is, since it's pride month and they want to give gay users a rainbow flag desktop background
but you're too gay and the integer overflowed :(
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>>108997368
>why does Linux do *stable thing that just works with decades of uptime*?
>why don't they do *thing that crashes constantly* like Windows?
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>>108997433
Stop pretending everything is a file.

A file is a file.
A directory is a directory.
A printer is a printer.
A mouse is a mouse.

All deserve their own specific interface if you want your operating system to be intuitive (for both developers and users) and reliable.
Using file interface for everything is laziness, it's giving up and using a shitty leaky abstraction for things when vastly better interfaces already exist and are proven to work great in other OSes.
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>>108998242
a file system is just an abstract hierarchical tree of byte stream nodes
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>>108998358
On Linux maybe.
Other operating systems provide vastly richer abstractions.
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>>108997368
I don't understand what this thread is about. Yes, "everything is a file" is a UNIX philosophy, but neither Linux nor macOS follow it, they at maximum follow the "everything is a file descriptor" philosophy, which is not the same at all because you don't actually use read/write with those file descriptors
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>>108997368
I heard from a friend of a friend who knows a janitor at Microsoft that every time an NT build failed he pressed a flaming gooey marshmello on a stick onto the offending developer's back and drew the windows flag out of their burning flesh.
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>>108998390
Based if true. The weak should fear the strong
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>>108997610
amazing... is like if files within a file tree were easier to conceptualize and work with for humans...
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>>108997530
imagine windows 12
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>>108998492
>Microsoft announces Windows 12
>They decides to backpedal on all the slop they added with their previous OS' to try and salvage their reputation
>Windows 12 continues the Windows' cycle of every other OS version being good
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>>108998512
I don't think we can rely that anymore. The state of the industry is much worse today when even GPU drivers are vibecoded.
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>>108997696
Stop acting like there is a "better choice" between Windows and Linux? That would be a good start.
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>>108998412
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>>108997368
everything is a file, history proved him right
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Text is the universal interface. Everything being a file is a joy, you only need something like fprintf to control and watch the system. It also make things simpler.
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>>108997368
I like how Linux works. You're wrong, fuck you.
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>>108999792
>Linux works
>Linux
>works
Ha ha, nice one.
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>>108997368
let's replace "everything is a file" with "everything is a bit stream". do you accept this solution?
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Plan 9 actually shows Unix sin was actually moving away form the EIF philosophy (ioctl, sockets, ...)
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>>108997368
What about everything is a pointer in memory like god intended?
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>>108997368
>It made more sense in the 60s and 70s
It didn’t make much sense even back then, wasting cycles parsing text when your CPU was running at 4 MHz was a total waste.
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>>108999861
It runs all the servers you use to watch your slop, and probably the vibrator your wife uses to satisfy herself because you cannot get your dick hard from decades of tranny porn. Being filtered by loonix when it was made as easier as it can be in $CURRENT_YEAR it just means you're retarded, but worry not, it's /g/ and it's a safe place for your kind.
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>>109000098
The plan has failed.
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>>108997440
>ReactOS
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>>108997530
Flounder ass looking plane.
>>108997701
I agree that procfs is shit. I agree that Windows does some boutique things better. That being said, both are a race condition. Just trap the process.
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>>108997368
everything is a file is still great and the guy in your picture is a retard
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>>108997368
Guess what retard, the future of computing is autonomous typewriters
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>>109000998
No it isn't. Linux adds more ways to work around files with every release. Files are shit. Note a file descriptor is not a fucking file.
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>>108997368
And it works.
As opposed to clueless zoomers reinventing everything the most retarded way just because they refuse to learn any existing standard, because peak mt stupid dunning Kruger after intro to cs 50.
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>>108997368
Yes, everyone with a brain knows that.
Lisp machines and oberon were peak.
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>>108997610
It's a relational database.
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>>109002086
no you vantanigger it doesn't have indexes
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>>109002293
Not sure if retarded or just pretending.jpg
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>>108997433
everything is a movie
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>>108997440
>windows
but anon, on Windows NT everything IS a file: devices, partitions, pipes, events etc...
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>>108998203
>>108997824
>>108997749
I haven't had a blue screen in years. Windows can recover from GPU crashes even.
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>>108998389
>neither Linux nor macOS follow it
linux does. you can use read() or poll() with data files, sockets, pipes, fifo queues, hardware (eg: /dev/mouse), ... but a nocoder wouldn't know that.
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>>109004481
Most of that shit aren't files that are actually present on the filesystem somewhere, they're just file descriptors created by some syscall, which is not compliant with the "everything is a file" idea
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>>109004432
>Windows can recover from GPU crashes even.
I can't speak for Nvidia but as far as AMD is concerned no it fucking can't but I also can't really blame Windows when AMD releases absolute dogshit drivers

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