>>97832773
Still dont get why Jeff has such a hate boner for Elmal. Let people enjoy their cult of the loyal thane rather than Yelmalio if they choose so.

>>97832836
I swear it's like a God Learning disease specifically for Elmal. I know that elmal only existed as a stop gap measure for possible fire rune orlanthi so they don't have to worship an enemy god for their light but c'mon. So what, now every fire rune nigga has to just leave the clan, town, tribe he was born in and saunter on over to be taught a foreign belief structure contrary to all his kin ?

Any new and exciting JC release ? Nochet Noir, Rhigos doko ? Is Ian Thomson done with his Pavis grand plan re-release project ?

>>97832958
I couldn't tell you. I've only recently started buying the new books for glorantha after realizing I was behind by several years. The cult books specifically. As far as I can tell, their still working on the Gods of Glorantha book and I hear people constantly meming on the "coming soon" tm statements.

How was Runequest Warlords
I was hoping it would attract new players to the ttrpg

>>97834047
Probably one of the worst tactical rpg of the last decade. They should have backed another David Dunham game instead.

>>97832836
>Why creator has his favourites and playing them?

>>97834047
If anything, that game did a fuckload of damage, being barely functional mess

>>97834410
Honestly even if he was his favorite, There are already Praxian Yelmalians and Esrolian ones out there. Why does a prominent local cult have to suffer for an obvious foreigner cult ? Humakt is seen as a foreigner since he kut his kinship ties but is still a proper orlanthi god. I don't see why Yelmalio couldn't be written the same way.( in Sartar at the very least)

Give me a rundown because I keep hearing people complaining about two gods being the same in the new edition but apparently they weren't for decades
I don't feel embarrassed for asking because glorantha lore is fucking dense and hard to find in one single place

>>97838878
Basically, Elmal was the sun-god worshipped by the Orlanthi; he is originally a member of their traditional enemies, the "Sky Gods" or "Fire Tribe" of the Dara-Happan pantheon, but was befriended by orlanth, and became his thane.

There is also another fire-tribe god called Yelmalio, who left the fire tribe proper, and lost his "heat" in a fight with the Trollish demon-god Zorak Zoran; in some versions Zorak Zoran ganked him after he had already lost a fight with Orlanth.

They had similar portfolios, though Elmal was never denuded of his fire, and the cult of Yelmalio tended to organize itself as independant temple-communities, the most famous of which are the sun-domes.

Some bright spark developer then decided to come along and declare that Elmal is actually just an Orlanthicized form of Yelmalio, and reduce his cult to something that's been pushed out and largely subsumed into irrelevance, leaving the Orlanthi without a -proper- sun god of their own, which a lot of people think sucks.

Elmal was a cool god; he is the patron of watchmen and the fyrd, and is associated with the spear, and because of his fire rune affinity, also horses, though his affinity for them is not as strong as many other fire-tribe gods, and most (but not all) Orlanthi cultures are indifferent horsemen.

>>97832836
Yeah, I've never got it, either; I'm a bit of a late comer to all of this, but, going back through old forums posts, and dredging up old articles, even back in the day, Jeff seems to have this hype-focused hate for the guy. Pretty much everything else, he's normally pretty diplomatic, and very much focused on "Your Glorantha Will Vary", but Elmal? There's always this undercurrent - or just current - of "You're fucking doing this wrong, and you should feel bad for doing it." Hell, almost every time I've seen him talk about it - even decades ago - he seems to go out of his way to emphasise how 'wrong' people are for liking Elmal, while also doing everything he can to misinterpret peoples arguments or statements.

Has there ever been any explanation for it? I know he's said quite a few times how tired he is of people asking about Elmal, but, again, even going back two/three decades, he seems to fucking detest the fucker.

there is a episode or two dedicated to Elmal in the Godlearner podcast

>>97832773
Eh, they made Elmal gay, I just can't care about Glorantha at all, they can't even have Orlanth and Elmal be bros anymore (that's just to tumblr ghoul behavior). I just will play King of Dragon pass and ungay the cool parts of glorantha and strip them of the commiefornia and the rest of post-modern stuff. A pity because Glorantha had lots of great ideas, but hte execution of them all is just shit.
Also posting in 4chan is a pain, this stupid captcha and I can't even post pics because some one in my op range must be posting some wicked shit.

>>97832773
At least he got some kind of writeup for RQG, unlike most Darkness, Water and Chaos gods.

>>97834741
Well I took a second look at his works and it looks like Yelmalians don't have to leave their clan if they initiate to yelmalio.

"Religiously, the average clan's 600 adults typically follow a distribution of 200 initiates of Orlanth and 200 initiates of Ernalda, with smaller numbers dedicated to Yelmalio (30)"

At least they aren't completely divorced from the basic building block of orlanthi society.

>>97841338
From what I have read, Elmal is not completely gone as he once was in the Runegate area of Sartar, so at least they threw the sun thane a bone in this way I guess. If anything, if the different ages of Glorantha show anything at all, Yelmalio gets butt fucked and mostly disappears pretty frequently so maybe this is just another highpoint of Little Yelm

>>97842282
* He's not completely gone since he is as we was for Orlanthi in the Runegate Area. OOps. Not ESL I swear.

>>97842282
they do end up being a bit of 5th collumnists

Newfag speaking. What are the real world cultural analogs for peoples in Glorantha? So far I know Orlanthi = Celtic/Nordic, and Lunarians = Grecco-Roman but also Persian? or something

>>97844921
Doesn't matter much because they changed it all, the Orlanthies of Dragon pass than started were different as the orlanthies of KoDP than are very different as the orlanties of whatever is than they are doing now (micenan/minon/hindu).
As an advise, I would just make my own shit inspired in the cool bits of glorantha.
I make my own images using what I find it cool of the cultures of glorantha and porting them to my Hyborian age inspried setting, like the Rams in Ride like the Wind.
As a setting glorantha just has to many drawbacks.

>>97844921
I think malkioni people are supposed to feel somewhat Orthodox byzantines now ? Loskalm excepted, which has retained in part the flavor of an Arthurian utopia mixed with a more modern meritocratic social order.

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When it comes to aesthetics, I do prefer the original 90's view of them but I can also see the rational for wanting something more unique in order to stand out.

>>97850739
It's not only the aestethics, wich is a grave sin already, but the whole vibe of the religion even in the only place than is been explored (dragon pass). It's all a bad, uncleaned mess than they try to cover with your glorantha will vary, wich is admiting you better take it as a kit for your own setting than using it as it is.

>>97852641
You drunk, bro?

Kinda surprised some people didn't like multi armed Orlanth. I thought he was cool. Very Indra.

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This guy comes to your stead and slaps your local Earth Priestess on the ass. What do you do?

I'm gonna try out King of Dragon Pass

>>97864478
It's good.
Apparently the GOG version is superior, as the Steam one is based off some newfangled Mobile version that's almost but not quite feature complete to the original, though the details elude me.

Peace clan is the easiest route, and you can get information on what choices to make in Heroquests by reading the ingame myth compendium, which is worth installing the game for in and of itself, but success in the act also depends on the Heroquester's personal attributes and suitability for the task; if I remember rightly some quests can also be "won wrong", which can lead to alternative secondary rewards, but usually counts as a fail condition for the ritual.

>>97863551
Challenge him to a series of contests.
Trick him into a confrontation on the Hero Plane where I, playing the role of Orlanth, reenact the slaying of Yelm with him as proxy, which inadvertently leads to a localized miniature Storm-Age.

Elmal turns up as a local variant of Yelmalio in A Darkness at Runegate.
Which is about the best we can get.

>>97869133
It just occurred to me that it could be as simple as Elmal's name being too similar to Eurmal.

>>97832773
What is runequest like?

>>97874156
Depends on the edition, and your DM.
But broadly, it's more mythologically oriented than D&D, and most magic comes from spirits or gods.
The world is a cube floating upon the primordial waters, the underworld is beneath, and the sky world is above, and outside that; primordial chaos.
A few thousand years ago the Godtime ended due to a deific fuckup, and the gods and mortals were separated by The Great Compromise, which had to be made to keep Primordial Chaos out of the world.
It's an old as fuck setting, and you will run into things that you recognize conceptually from Warhammer; know that Runequest, specifically the setting Glorantha did it first.
That is - ripping off Moorcock's "Chaos" but less shamelessly, and also some feature creatures like "Broo" who's old metal miniatures were made by GW, and became the first line of Beastmen once that contract ended and the molds were repurposed.

The company running Runequest right now is Chaosium; very woke people, and the current edition is sorta over-elaborate in the first releases, when Greg Stafford was still alive, then after he died I think the quality of products fell, and they began putting more overt woke shit in the books.
Greg himself was a 20th century liberal, not a woke.

I'd get the reprint of "Runequest Classic" myself.
Glorantha really is a great world and RQ a great system, and it has decades of detailed materials to explore.

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>>97874941
>That is - ripping off Moorcock's "Chaos" but less shamelessly,
To be fair, so did D&D. Elric was huge back then and Moorcock is in Appendix N if I remember right. D&D just added some Poul Anderson spice to alignment stuff, while Runequest went straight to Moorcock. But yeah I do agree that Warhammer got Chaos stuff filtered through Runequest first, considering they were literally publishing Runequest in the UK.
>and also some feature creatures like "Broo" who's old metal miniatures were made by GW, and became the first line of Beastmen once that contract ended and the molds were repurposed.
I also think broo are way cooler than beastmen, but I'm just not a warhammer guy

Another thing I think Warhammer got from Runequest is dwarves with guns, but I'm not entirely sure.

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Isn't RQG also compatible with the first two RQ editions?

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>>97879217
>>97879220
Warhammer also loves making everything big and gruesome, I prefer the generic stereotypical broo: some goat headed man in normal armor. Feels more menacing, like running across a wild animal while walking in the woods and it staring at you, because you know what they're capable of doing.

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>>97879220
Not entirely, I think the main RQ gamebook has conversion rules. Something about hit locations or armor was the main difference, iirc.

>>97839654
I think it comes down to just Yelmalio coming first. Didn't Elmal first appear in King of Dragon's Pass? He probably is just seething over secondaries engaging with and trying to exert control over the setting, but it's a losing battle since Elmal is just cooler than Yelmalio.

>>97833247
My understanding was that the Gods of Glorantha books have just been cancelled so we will be seeing no more from that line.

>>97834047
Not terrible, not very good, not really anything to really pull new players into the setting. Sold poorly from what I understood and the developer pretty much abandoned it soon after release.

>>97864478
Make sure to check out the Six Ages games if you enjoy KoDP. They are made by the same guys and are pretty much the Prequels to KoDP. Six Ages 2 is probably the best in the series.

>>97882015
I believe Cults will resume once RQ lite has been released, but given how much of a trainwreck RQG publishing schedule has been since 2018, nothing is guaranteed.

Again, I don’t understand what the fuck Jeff is doing with RQ - starting with the 2 -> 10 Cult books when anything RQ-related is already difficult to sell.

>>97880221
I think Elmal is just the rallying point of people who appreciated that weird era of Greg going full anthropological mysticism with a myriad of alts and sub-cults for each god, and Jeff just hate the thane on principle because he thinks a ‘simpler’ Glorantha would sell more.

>>97880221
I don't get it. Six Ages came out just a few years ago and they didn't seem to change anything to emphasize Yelmalio over Elmal. If he really didn't like it why didn't he mandate a change?

>>97882015
Also, Six Ages 2 has a great take on flesh man/ginna jar and the end of the world, back before the lifebringers quest.

>>97883356
He wasn’t involved.
David Dunham has a long history in the fandom (he had his own Gloranthan fanzine, back in the 90s), and I think he negotiated the rights to use the setting directly with Greg.
I believe Greg’s name was associated with A sharp legal status, not sure if it has changed since his death ?

>>97883396
No, my mistake : Jeff is credited as consultant on both episodes of 6 Ages.

Even with the Elmal erasure, I take consolation in the fact that thanks to Six Ages 3 being cancelled, the duology we have is the biggest, most blatant Elmal epic in the entire Glorantha canon.

In the first game you follow a culture wholly dedicated to him, and the second game is beat by bear a retelling of Elmal Guards the Stead upgrade to a cosmic scale, bringing you right to the end of the world and its rebirth. Like, what the fuck Yelmalio or even Orlanth got in comparison? I really hope that Jeff is aware of this forever and ever.

>>97880221
Elmal came out of the game Greg was runnignabout the KoDP era of Sartar being founded. The notes were used verbatium for Hero Wars/Heroquest.

Thereby Elmal goes from being a historic thing to being a modern thing.

Not getting SA3 means we never get to see the Jeralong Dynasty and how the cultural fusion of Rider/Wheel-Orlanthi/Pelorians spin off into weird groups.

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>>97879217
The unicorn headed one makes me think it's supposed to represent Ralzakarks
And that tapir looking guy looks like a Morokanth thrown into the broo batch

Runequest has elves, aldryami
Dwarves, the mostali
Durulz were made to fill the hobbit niche in Glorantha, but as ducks
What are the orc equivalents? The evil chao rape goats like the broo? Or the tapir guys who can remove sentience from humans and enslave them?

>>97883505
those games made me a Elmal worshipper

>>97883505
I never bought Six Ages 1 or 2.
I was afraid of what Nu-Chaosium's writing and art departments were gonna do to it, and some of the initial feedback gave me cold feet.

>>97885199
nah man. It feels like old chaosium. except one-two events

>>97885206
>One or two events
I got personal reasons to be sussy about 'em, since it was before they came out I had an argument with the developers about some content in the equipment book, but this was thoroughly discussed in previous editions of /rqg/

>>97885233
dont think they had much to do with the vidya

>>97885199
If it makes you feel better it's not Nu-Chaosium who wrote and made it. It's the original guys who did KoDP and it feels very much in the same boat.

Honestly Six Ages 2 is probably the best thing to come out of the setting.

>>97885047
Trolls and tusk raiders. The morocanth don't really go around enslaving and removing the sentience from people anymore than the other Prax nomads go around enlightening animals. They just have a very bad reputation for being on the winning side of the survival covenant.

>>97886205
Pretty sure there's some lore of them using magic to turn regular humans into animal ones.

>>97886561
There is, but it's the exception not the rule. The community has generally got it in their heads that they are running around Prax snatching people and turning them into glorified mules. That's not supported by the lore. Their priests and equivalents have limited access to the rune magic that would allow them to do it as it reflects what happened in the Survival Covenant. Herd men are not people they are animals that look like humans.

Remember that the other Prax tribes are able to remove the enlightenment from intelligent animals too, but they aren't really doing that either. (They could also return the intellect to their herd beasts but won't). And human equivalence intelligent animals do exist in Glorantha.

>>97886959
Adding on to this the animal/ human divide in Glorantha is kind of fuzzy and not very well explored. If you were to speak to the Huschen people who are arguably the first people they would usually tell you that they are their totem animals and are also sometimes human. That there is no real difference. Their usual myths is that humanity eventually forgot that they were animals when they started listening to the Gods and adopting things such as agriculture and bronze working. They can still communicate just fine with their totem animals and sometimes with others too.

Orlanthi are Proto-Indo-Europeans

>>97893360
Correct.

>>97893360
They are Indo-European. Some mix of Mycenaen and Celtic. The Pure Horse People are more Proto-Indo-European.

>>97897505
Correcter.

Can ghosts retain sorcery they knew in life? If so, can regular spirits learn it?

>>97899194
Good question. I am skewed towards no. Westerners don't see ghosts and shades as true human souls, and they either ignore or are outright hostile towards the spirits. Sorcery is supposed to be this intellectual human achievement, mind over matter, expression of the will of the sorcerer, and spirits and ghosts don't really have it. The mindset of the sorcerer and that of a shaman are in direct opposition to each other

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I don't know guys, having god learner philosophies, draconic mystic knowledge and arkati insights alongside orlanth powers doesn't sound like a good idea....

>>97886205
Trolls aren't really inherently evil like orcs are usually characterized, not in Trollpak at least
While at best broo are just shock troops for the Lunars