>>97877554
Wait for the new Ravenloft book, it will be peak.

Ravenloft is a shitty setting that was literally created with the same philosophy as Tomb of Annihilation;

By bitter, butthurt gamemasters going out of their way to make everything as oppressive, unfun, bad faith, and bullshit, because they were sick and tired of their players winning.

The entire setting is edgelord doomwank personified. Written by idiots who hail "subverting expectations" and "Things suck, just like the real world!" to the most absolute, grognardian extreme. All of the villains and problems are written to be ultra edgy unbeatable bullshit that would make Darksteel the Hedgehog blush.

I'd rather play Warhammer Fantasy during the End Times. Fuck Ravenloft.

>>97878106
Lord Strahd must have killed this guy repeatedly.

>>97878124
Grimdark and doomwank suck ass and I'm tired of pretending otherwise.

>>97877554
My opinion of Ravenloft is largely shaped by grimderp russian DMs, who I suspect posted about Ravenloft on TRPG forums a lot more than they've actually DMed it.
Like, I remember one of them posting his ideal Ravenloft adventure
>The party is traveling through the misty forest and encounter a camp of goblins. They kill them and move on. Then they encounter the same camp of the same goblins, somehow alive and in their way again. Then it happens again and again. Eventually the PCs will be overpowered numbers and die.
Or I remember
>I dislike how the players can just summon light with spells. Could the Dark Powers make the Light spell into a light-sucking vampire that attacks the party when summoned? Can I do something like this with all other spells I don't like?

That, and redditors basedfacing about how queer Strahd and Escher are.

I don't actually know how Ravenloft is supposed to be.

>>97878168
Ravenloft doesn't have to be grimdark or doomwank. It's been a lot of things besides that.

>>97878253
Oh, another one wrote an erotic BDSM splatbook domain for 3.5, it had a flesh golem that has an orgasming ability.

>>97878271
Like and ability to cause others to orgasm with a touch? Or is this flesh golem capable of orgasming? Come to think of it, what stops flesh golem from being able to orgasm in the first place...

That is indeed a cool cover

>>97877554
I feel the same about Ravenloft that I feel about any D&D product or property, that I want as little to do with it as possible.

Ravenloft is pure kino and always has been. At least it's different from your normal d&d settings and it encouraged you to fuck over the players with every unfair advantage there was. And the monsters were fun. Pretty sure the Blood Golem first appeared in Ravenloft.

>>97877554
It's not for me. I had a 2e boxed set I got from a friend (I think that's how I got it, but I can't rule out the cool box art didn't seduce me), but the fear checks and such turned me off. The inability to triumph over the oppressive darkness and not being able to escape isn't the experience I want from D&D, or at all, really.

>>97877554
I like a lot of the ideas but the market is currently flooded with grim settings so I'm more inclined to hit the brakes on the much darker stuff. I like FEUDAL JAPAN levels of tragedy, not Warhammer 40k levels.

>>97877554
I wasn't expecting a Ravenloft thread, so I'll ask while I'm here- is there a common throughline in female PCs that look at Strahd and say
>I can fix him
Or
>I like him just the way is
Or even
>I want to make him worse
I like doing character studies and this seems like the time to ask: Things I can do to make him more appealing so that the dumping is that much more brutal, for instance.

>>97878106
This is some advanced baitposting

>>97877554
The biggest issue in running a Ravenloft game today is that the players already know the major twists. How you address this shows your quality as a DM.

>>97886335
Hm. Interesting. I wonder how I will hold up.

>>97877554
There's multiple Ravenlofts at this point, between the "everything is new" of 2ed, to the "everything is detailed" of 3ed, to the "let's explore diversity politics and genderswapping" of 5ed.

That said, Curse of Strahd is neat provided you understand that it's basically "what if we took that old tournement dungeon, fleshed out the surrounding countryside a bit, and then just let GMs run with it?" And the secret to running with it is to play it as a mix of D&D and those old Hammer Horror flicks. Villagers are ugly and dirty and scared, monsters are big and powerful and compelling, it's always storming and dark, there's a weird-ass grell in that basement for no reason (hint: he's a spy for Blutespur! Which, sadly, never went anywhere since my group was done with Ravenloft after Curse ended), and the heroes are there because -somebody- has to kill the vampire!

Anyway, I'd look into running Curse of Strahd. The "shiny happy Vistani" stuff is overblown, and you can still just play them as the Hammer Horror stereotypes they're intended to be if you want. Beyond that, don't be afraid to twist and warp the adventure to reflect the players' attention, and you'll do fine. ("You rip off the vrock's wing-" "Yes!" "-only for him to fly away, a ring on his finger glowing brightly." "!?!? Why the hell did a vrock have a ring of flying?!?!" "Why indeed...")

>>97886225
Doesn't really answer your question, but I figure you'll find it interesting:

https://www.dmsguild.com/en/product/369197/she-is-the-ancient-a-genderbent-curse-of-strahd

It's basically a really really slick looking product, that has no real consideration of the material or reasoning behind it when it does its swapping. Like the author will genderswap a character with a Slavic name but then won't properly swap the character's name too. There was some other stuff, but it's been a long time.

Having said all of that, I don't recommend the product. Just knowing it exists (and is genuinely a good looking product!) is enough.

>>97877554
I love ravenloft in each edition. As someone who is very familiar with 2e Lamordia and Falkovnia, I much prefer the 5e reboot of them.

CoS is ths best 5e module, and VGtR was fine, but disappointingly shallow with its mechanics and adventures.

I am excited for this new release. It looks like they are including Darklord statblocks and at least 10 Ravenloft set maps. Also looking forward to its DMs screen.

>>97886225
He's rich, powerful, handsome and is willing to murder the dipshits around you to keep you handcuffed to a radiator in his basement. Catnip for underage teen nerdy girls.

>>97878689
Semi-serious guess: in Ravenloft they'd be mockeries of life. Their process of creation a blasphemy to nature, and existence a disconnect from humanity. As such, I suspect their ability to orgasm would be nil, since it's idealized as a thing that brings people together. On the flipside, I think flesh golems being able to misscary, conceive stillborn babes, and birth terata nightmares might be fitting too.

In WotC 5ed Forgotten Realms I'm sure they have perfectly happy, healthy babies. Just with multi-ethnic/gender patches across their bodies.

>>97886443
Jesus, you crybabies never stop complaining about things you made up.

>>97886432
>CoS is ths best 5e module
CoS might be one of the worst modules ever released for this edition, are you retarded?

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New book's preorders are live!

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Tristessa liiiiiives! Apparently there are 17 one shots in the new book.
Bummer that they probably won't have the Artificer class in the book, so I'll have to grab that to use the Reanimator subclass.

Whats with all the faggot shills ITT?

>>97886866
I'm sorry. I thought people posting in a Ravenloft thread would enjoy hearing about the new Ravenloft info that dropped today. I forgot that you all are miserable contrarians.

>>97886385
Ah, thanks for the advice. I might run CoS at this point. I've only ever heard good things about it.

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>>97886903
OP here. I appreciate it at least. Thank you, anon. I knew new stuff was coming out but I haven't really checked into any of it yet. The art looks sick. Ty again.

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>>97887757
TY anon

>>97887900
Np. I'm not a hateful, snivelling little bitch like most of tg.

>>97886432
>As someone who is very familiar with 2e Lamordia and Falkovnia, I much prefer the 5e reboot of them.
>Falkovnia
Why would you choose 5e's zombie apocalypse over Gondegal and his rebels fighting against the not-medieval Nazis with super soldiers and Hitler the Impaler?

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>>97877554
my favorite setting. it sucks wotc fucked it up so bad. Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft came out on my birthday too.

the 3e gazetteers were the best. Domains of Doom was solid too and much cheaper to get physically.

>>97889433
Huh. I might have to get those if the lore is so good.

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>>97889433
>the 3e gazetteers were the best.

>>97889433
Ironically, for all their depth and world building the Gazetteers made me realize that Ravenloft simply doesn't work as a realistic setting. It's something that'd been staring me in the face since the old Domains of Dread for AD&D, but it never clicked (me being a decade older when I revisited Ravenloft probably helped).

"Where does their building materials and supplies come from? Where does their food come from? Where do the people come from?!?!" The books make it out to be almost a dream realm that holds the Dark Lords captive, with the food and houses and people simply existing as quasi-illusions, but if that's true why care what happens to any of them. "Strahd killed my family!" "So? They weren't real and neither are you."

I still love the setting, but the metaphysics of it need help.

>>97891133
I think that the dreamlike nature of the realm plays into its strength as horror, but I do think something like the following works well:
>Barovia is a perfectly happy little nation you pass through onto your way to somewhere more important
>One night you get a weird feeling as you go to sleep
>You wake up in the middle of the night in a horrifying reflection of the quaint village you fell asleep in
>All of the stuff is there, but none of the people are, all replaced with soulless pastiches and hellish monsters
>Everyone unfortunate enough to be here is trapped in their own personal hell (whether they deserve it or not)
It even serves as a justification for a modern party to get dragged into Ravenloft, with the double whammy that since they're presumably traveling instead of being born there, they don't have any of their personal resources to pull on and cell phones/technology don't work because no shit.

Honestly it seems fine. I personally don't care for the, "oooo this place inherently sucks and must always return to the status quo no matter what happens because "dark powers."" I get grim setting and morbid undertakings.
However the weird mix of power and powerlessness annoys me.
Like in CoC you have very little power you may manage to temporarily thwart an eldritch incident but it will cost you. But you never really powered up to do that.
In Dark Sun the world being screwed is both an environment and a couple of evil people. While it can't be stopped it can be fought against.
In Dark Heresy you can't fix the Imperium but never is your goal to do so.
Ravenloft? I slowly level up to eventually kill some evil guy and then he just gets better. You can't stab him enough, imprison his soul, force him to another plane, or even help him work out his issues as the dark powers will prevent anything that breaks the cycle.

>>97891942
I mean, you can change the status quo in your group. The only reason why the status quo even exists is for consistency across game books, I reckon. You can completely fuck up Barovia if your DM lets you. I let my players take over Verbrek when one of their party became a werebear. It was fun. Everyone had fun, including me.

>>97891942
In a lot of adventures they had the built-in good ends where the PCs actually win properly, but I think as >>97892091 said, maybe they wanted to keep things consistent in revised boxes and still give parties to use the older adventures.

>>97886225
Figure if the adventure is DM'd properly, every PC ends up just wanting to plant a stake into his nards soon enough.

>>97877554
2e Raveloft was peak.

>>97891942
>Honestly it seems fine. I personally don't care for the, "oooo this place inherently sucks and must always return to the status quo no matter what happens because "dark powers."" I get grim setting and morbid undertakings.
>Ravenloft? I slowly level up to eventually kill some evil guy and then he just gets better. You can't stab him enough, imprison his soul, force him to another plane, or even help him work out his issues as the dark powers will prevent anything that breaks the cycle.
This is mainly an issue with 5e Ravenloft, multiple darklords in pre-5e Ravenloft were removed from power and/or were permanently killed. Camille Dilisnya, original darklord of Borca, was assassinated by her own daughter. Baron Bakholis, original darklord of Invidia, killed by a half-Vistani girl he was about to murder. Claude Renier, original darklord of Richemulot, assassinated by his granddaughter. Duke Gundar, original darklord of Gundarak, staked by random adventurers after he was betrayed by one of his servants. Only Strahd, and maybe Azalin, seem to get special protection from the Dark Powers because they seem to play key roles in the Dark Powers' plots.

>>97878168
I'm inclined to concur.

>>97893361
Even Azalin was out for a bit at the tail end of 2e.

>>97877554
Admittedly, the setting as a whole is very interesting, it's just not one I had the occasion to explore much in my earlier days with 3.0/3.5, mostly because my autist friends were immediately smitten by Eberron, which admittedly is amazing. Returning on Ravenloft, the various Domains of Horror seem very interesting, and the idea of anything that involves Lord Soth is based as fuck.

But I ended up in a 5e CoS campaign like two years ago, it went at a very sluggish pace and it was a generally painful experience. The DM did a good job but due to there being relatively inexpert players he decided to run the whole thing borderline RAW and holy shit, I don't know who thought the game design of this thing was acceptable. The encounter ratings are shit, nothing seemed downright unbeatable but we either fought deadly odds or things so comically weak it killed any hope to be horrifying. Incredibly annoying were the gotcha traps and ambushes and moments that apparently didn't even ask for Perception/Investigation checks, they just happened. Also, from what I've been told, the handbook switches between forgetting and remembering about passive perception, sometimes using it for traps, sometimes going "Tee hee, if they don't actively Perceive, they spring". Like, why is it there as a stat then? I started rolling Perception at every corner at that point, fortunately it didn't slow the game down because I keep everything relatively neat on my side.

Regarding plot, fuck, the NPCs are unbearable, and most of them are literally soulless, how am I supposed to care? It's not even a matter of them not being cool noblebright rebels ready to help us against the oppressive vampire, they were just genuinely lame people devoid of any respectable traits. Strahd himself has motivations that just don't work nowadays. Maybe it was cooler when it was originally written but even if you don't find his rapist obsession "problematic", it is still inherently pathetic.

>>97893923
The more I hear about cos, the less I find that I will ever play it. It just sounds terrible all around.

>>97877554
It’s probably the best attempt anyone is ever going to get in terms of bringing horror to D&D. It’s still obvious the base game just isn’t built for that kind of thing, but it’s a valiant effort.
Strahd himself is surprisingly weak, however. When I ran Curse of Strahd, he went down in about two rounds in the final fight. Admittedly the party had gotten the Sunsword, but even with me trying to play smart, he was defeated fairly easily.

>>97877554
> How does tg feel about Ravenloft?
It’s ultimately a very, very bleak and cynical setting that has it baked into the fundamental core of the setting that there are no happy endings and your character will either end up dead, having accomplished nothing, or twisted into something you, the player, don’t even recognize or want anything to do with, generally accomplishing less than nothing as they’ve instead become yet another part of the overall problem.

So as I said, it’s a very depressing, very cynical setting that’s not for everyone, or most well-adjusted people. I will grant you 40k is very much the same, but 40k can get away with it because 1) it’s upfront and very open about being extremely, cartoonishly, grimdark. And 2) it supplements this with gratuitously over-the-top weapons and armor that’s gonna hit you with a near-lethal dose of testosterone. Point is, you’re neither being blindsided, and at least you’re gonna have a fun time on your character’s fall into damnation.

>>97894682

The thing a out 40K/WHF though is that the setting still celebrates and champions "the little guy."
Like unless we're playing Necromunda hivescum or something, the setting still tries to make and pastiche your characters actions, even if theyre just a lowly guardsman, as heroic and valiant (even if they may be largely irrelevant.)
Ravenlofts problem is that it really loves to rub the players face in the fact that nothing they do matters. It underlines it over and over to the point where it pushes any normal person into the "Why even bother" mindset.
Meanwhile in 40K, there's a sense that you belong to something bigger, so even if your stuff "technically doesnt matter" you can still feel like a hero, even if its just those in your immediate sphere of influence.

>>97893923
>I don't know who thought the game design of this thing was acceptable. The encounter ratings are shit, nothing seemed downright unbeatable but we either fought deadly odds or things so comically weak it killed any hope to be horrifying.
CoS is infamous for this and I dont know how its become lauded as "the best module ever in 5e."
The amount of stupid Rocks Fall You Die levels of bullshit in that campaign is backbreaking. Id never let a new player within 50 miles of that campaign with just how much the DM has to overcommunicate not to do something because otherwise the party will fucking explode.

Your point about the NPCs is also 100% on point. Theyre so fucking unlikable and shitty that it quickly pushes the party to not give a single fuck because why would you bother helping assholes who will just as quickly sell you out to Strahd? Its also infuriating how Ireena becomes an MMO style "Game Mandated Escort Mission" and you have to spend most of the campaign with her on a fucking child leash otherwise you lose.

And yeah, like you said, Strahd sucks. The old lore, though a bit campy, is actually kinda funny and more enjoyable, because he has motivations outside of being an incel (and my GM got really bitthurt everytime we openly reffered to le coll and edgy vampire as such). I like some of his possible motivationa in the old one more, they included escaping Barovia himself by body swapping with someone, making an artifact to survive sunlight, or finding and destroying the sunsword before you found it.
Way more fun than a case of Cosmic Oneitis.

>>97895131
>>97894524

Like, it's not even a matter of "I went into the campaign not expecting it to be a gothic horror", I brought the most gothic horror character possible, a scholarly dhampir who searched in nature and in the "highest spheres" an answer to his cursed existence and found peace in the fact that in the great scheme of things he was an acceptable, if not bizarre coincidence.

Barovia did not challenge any belief of his nor made him feel bad in the slightest about his vampiric condition, the horrors there had nothing to do with vampires, they had to do with the fact that Strahd genuinely fucking sucked, there was even hype from my character thinking there might be some absolute 5D chess from some incredibly complex and ancient being and instead it was all about some woman. For a guy who more or less underwent Lovecraft character levels of "we're minuscule specs in a dark universe", it felt so irrelevant and pathetic he just felt bad at the idea he got trapped in a planar bear trap by the saddest of undead simps.

If anything the average Barovian made him think "some people really are just sacks of blood to be consumed, and they're not even tasteful as a drink, because Strahd has zero taste and can't even keep his own cattle clean".

>>97886177
This guy usagis his yojimbo

>>97895131
>>97895830
My interpretation of Strahd is that he really wanted to be Sergei (young, handsome, apparently free of doubt or worry or obligation) and his hangup with Tatyana is based at least partly on the fact that she had eyes for nobody but Sergei at the time of her death.
I, Strahd presents him as broadly successful in his initial seduction of Tatyana's reincarnations, she just keeps dying before he can make her his eternal possession. He visualizes himself dancing with her as if he were Sergei, and substitutes himself for Sergei when he "informs her" of her past.
He doesn't really (in practice) act as though he has eyes for nobody but her (see his seduction of Dagmar), but he might convince himself of that.
He's more in love with the idea of being perfect than he is with her, I think. In I10 Ravenloft II, the Alchemist Strahd has a fixation on removing the evil from the human soul (his soul, obviously), which I think informs his major malfunction.
>Many nights did I work in the darkness of my secluded laboratory, my mind fevered with the immensity of what I would accomplish. Yet did success elude me! Failure after fallure did I suffer. The key to the banishment of our darker self was ever hanging before me, without shape or substance: Ever In a haze of taunting obscurity.
>One night my tortured soul boiled with hate and anger. I cried out! "Why had the Gods man so? Why must we be tormented by contrast in this life, facet constantly wlth the choice of light and dark?" I would conquer this if I could. I would defy such law!
Keep in mind that this is the Alchemist, who has a listed alignment of Neutral Good. This is Strahd at his BEST.
He's Lawful Evil, profundly arrogant, and a control freak who refuses to accept human imperfection and probably hated Sergei of envy because Sergei basically was (in his eyes) the perfect man- a Dio Brando/Jonathan Joestar bit, if you will.

>>97895967
Yeah honestly if you focus him more on that side of things, he becomes much more interesting, but I feel DM input is needed to move him away from a guy who honestly not only has an embarrassing motivation, he's even milquetoast about it. Like, to follow your Dio-Jonathan comparison, Dio might be the pettiest bastard possible, but he's driven, he has presence, he's unrepentant in a charming way. And most of all his choices are influenced by himself and himself only. He's in control of his own destiny and that makes him scary beyond all the camp.

Like, imagine how lame Stardust Crusaders would have been if at one point the gang discovered the disaster all happened because Dio wanted to bang Irina and got sulky about it.

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>>97877554
5e nu-Ravenloft is shit, 2e and 3e Ravenloft was great

>>97897242
>sidecut
Lmao everytime

>>97896156
Milquetoast is probably the best way to describe it, and I think that really has to do with design-by-committee and a desire not to be "problematic".
Like, if it were me, one idea I'd consider is having him go full Bluebeard and outright collect "Tatyanas", whether they had her soul or not. At least then his unhinged obsession crosses over from simpering to downright insane.

>>97895106
Fair point, 40k can still sometimes give you those “it matters to them” moments.

Which would imply that Ravenloft is more cynical than 40k. And if that doesn’t make you stop and ask “what are you doing man?” And “what’s wrong with me?” I don’t know what will.

>>97898207
Yeah exactly, it could have gone in two opposite directions, either make him far less attached to something so emotional and give him some deeper motivation that can be actually understandable by anyone who isn't drunk on AI-generated dark romance novels or go out all the way and make him batshit insane enough to make a VtM Malkavian blush.

But that would require actually trying to write something interesting I guess.

>>97898338
Another way to cut the difference is to have the Curse of Strahd literally be his inability to avoid dropping everything for Tatyana, and have it be something he tries to plan around or otherwise despises about himself because of how much it's cost him personally. Have him be possessed by Tatyana herself, who hates him and wants to make him suffer for destroying her would-be idyllic life.
>She taunts me! She taunts me!
What if that was true?
Strahd trapped her in a literal godforsaken shadow realm, so make her an agent in her own narrative. She wants Strahd to suffer as she suffered, but will absolutely take a path out if it means she is relieved of the pain his dark deal tied her down to. Freeing Tatyana doesn't free Strahd, but it does lift his curse. He can't free Tatyana because of his compulsion, but if some outlander did it...

>>97897242
Ravenloft became Innistrad, 50% black

>>97898403
Something like that would actually make the anticlimactic puddle scene where Ireena just disappears into something interesting. Her remembering about Tatyana and realizing she too became a thing possessed by revenge and corrupted by Barovia would be an actually interesting plot twist, and a Strahd that actually suddenly feels freed from that obsession, yet still broken by the centuries of toil under it, would be interesting to deal with. Perhaps a neutral or evil party might actually parley to not care about the deranged vampire trying to think about a new raison d'etre and parley their way out of the mists since at that point loverboy wouldn't really care about playing with them anymore. Like, honestly ANYTHING would feel more climactic than what they offered. And it certainly would offer more player agency, which the module probably considers a slur.

>>97898437
I think her venting her fury at Strahd for his four centuries of selfishness is entirely in-character, and so would her feeling suddenly guilty and afraid that she's become worse as a person as a result. I think she would sincerely thank any party that freed her. As for Strahd, I don't think she would forgive him so much as hope he lets go.
Strahd might go berserk and fight the party regardless because of his compulsion, especially if Tatyana leaves right in front of him, but I think if they survive for long enough, he'd let them leave with an apology and perhaps some gifts- maybe make that the result if the party gets wiped.

>>97877554
>How does tg feel about Ravenloft?

I like the general concept that the setting is split into dozens of isolated micro-realms with different themes. I like that in each one there's a clear overall baddie that causes all the problems, and the players will slowly ramp up to deal with.
I don't really care for the rest of it.
I guess I just like campaigns that work like a videogame.

>>97898338
> make a VtM Malkavian blush.

This, anon. You should do this. Be a thorn in everyone's side at WotC. Fuck them.

>>97898546
Yeah, exactly, she'd feel like an actual human being instead of the maiden devoid of any volition and options she happened to be. In my game the characters got somewhat affectionate to her and were utterly shocked of what happened, not to count Ismack was incomprehensibly pissed because duh, the DM obviously made him react like a normal human being. My character being an "expert of the planes" tried to explain to him that she's probably beyond the Mists and probably in some Upper Plane with Sergei now but obviously the poor guy wouldn't exactly listen to metaphysics that are just rambling for a guy who lives in the mist.

>>97898654
I would definitely do that but I doubt I'll ever run Strahd. To be completely honest I don't like running modules, I have my setting and I like using it. To be fair I don't like playing modules or playing 5e in general, but I have the blessing and the curse of having friends and you gotta make compromises. It is fun to play with them, of course, it's the system and the module that absolutely fucking suck.

>>97898987
I'm convinced you would make it fun, no matter the circumstances but yeah, I've been in your shoes. To me, my homebrew stuff is way better and more fun than any official material but players being how they are, are always going to ask for "official" material first. Hell, I used to be the same exact way but I've had some really great DMs that have a better creative output than say, anything monte cook ever even thought of. I still don't understand for that fucking hack got hired for anything besides being a cockroach collector. I love to play in fr but I'll play in a how l homebrew game and have just as much fun, if not more. Ppl change everyday; books don't.

>>97893361
"This is mainly an issue with 5e Ravenloft"

Is it though? Not counting fanmade stuff (not saying it's bad, but it doesn't/shouldn't count as canon), have there been any adventures released where a Darklord hasn't been perma-killed by the end?

You're absolutely right about the power shifts previously though! Also, the world was changed quite a bit between the initial Raveloft module and the end of 3ed (I feel like 5ed has been a bit of a reboot to be honest, not really part of the same continuity anymore, which is a shame).

>>97899104
It definitely is a shame. It seems like the continuity should go forward but not so drastically that it changes the entire tone of the setting.

>>97894546
Too many variables to consider here (e.g. like if you had 6 PCs at level 15 and loaded with magical items), but...

Strahd's first action in combat is to cast Greater Invisibility. If the PCs have whittled him to half strength that first round, he uses his Legendary action at the end of the round to make himself able to pass through walls, and then runs away. Assuming the fight's going bad that is.

But more likely he's still kicking and fighting with plenty of hit points. So while still invisible he runs up the walls onto the ceiling and starts lobbing fireballs into the room. He's also almost certainly smarter than the PCs. As such it's reasonable for him to assume the ugly fighters have low Charisma, and target their shadow with a different (and free!) Lair action to animate it and have it attack them. Rinse and repeat, with Strahd running around invisible, lobbing fireballs and trying to animate shadows. The party may get some hits in, but the sunsword does radiant damage, and Strahd can heal that after going a turn without being hit by more radiant damage. Except Strahd's going to soak the first 50 points of radiant damage using the Heart of the Castle anyway, so the players (whose characters at least haven't read the adventure!) should be concerned when this super special sword doesn't seem to do squat. Plus, it's his home. If the PCs start putting up a really good fight, he's no moron. He flees, gathers some minions (Rahadin, those 4 red dragon wyrmlings guarding the entrace, and a few dozen Strahd zombies, with Strahd's brides and a mob of spctres or shadows make a good start), and then starts using his own stockpiles of treasure (Rings of Flying are always handy to have!).

tl;dr - if the party killed Strahd in two rounds, the GM did something wrong.

>>97899282
You sound like an awesome DM.

>>97899282
Yeah this sort of autistic powertripping incel rant is exactly the type of archetype of person I meet whenever I find someone who idolizes Curse of Strahd.

Its fucking Rick and Morty all over again and retards who idolize Rick Sanchez.

>>97899767
Vampire tactics are incel now. Huh. Good to know in case I run into any vampires. I must stay a virgin lest I get bitten by the big bad vampire lord!

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>>97899792
> Incel Norwood Reaper Dracula is actually le 5D chessmaster brilliant tactician that would put Bruce Wayne to shame.
>He does everything absolutely flawlessly because he's Literally Me and I, as the Gamemaster, am God and cannot lose.

Yeah yeah, whatever tough guy. Don't ruffle your trench coat.

>>97899816
And how does being an incel play into this, hm? I'm not dating babies can't make mistakes because they do but I'm failing to see this "incel rant" that you speak so b disparagingly of honestly.

>>97899767
Smart monsters should be played smart. If the players are smart, they'll do smart shit to counter him. It doesn't take all that much - just knowing he's a wizard would make the obvious choices VERY OBVIOUS to anyone who was fighting him.

>>97899855
Saying vampires* can't make mistakes

I've been up for awhile, pardon me

>>97899885
You must be a virgin and fight him! That's the important issue to the Culture Wars mavens. Oh and also be hateful to women.

>>97899104
>have there been any adventures released where a Darklord hasn't been perma-killed by the end?
If you mean in general, several adventures have multiple endings depending on a course of action, or the results of a Tarokka reading. Often the PCs are supposed to make some kind of deal with them and end the adventure with a bad aftertaste.

>>97899104
Oh wait, you specifically talked about 5e, my bad.

>>97891133
But the players shouldn't know that. Also, the Domains are a prison for their lords. Everyone and everything else in them is collateral damage trapped in stagnation they aren't aware of. Nothing matters, but no one realizes it, and are just trying to survive in vain in their pockets of Hell.

>>97895830
Strahd was locked away due to his potential for cosmos shattering evil. He was willing to kill love and death itself in the pursuit of it. The lengths he would go to were seemingly without end in his obsession. He is more evil than he appears on the surface.

>>97899816
>Incel Norwood Reaper Dracula is actually le 5D chessmaster brilliant tactician that would put Bruce Wayne to shame.

Yes, yes, he is. Strahd's INT is 20 in every statblock of his that I've found. He is literally superhumanly intelligent and if you don't play him like he is, you fucked up.

I really don't want to run that Ravenloft game now.
I
Hath
Been
DEMORALIZED.

I have players that would be into it, absolutely. I just don't feel like wading through years of crap to make something that going to feel half-assed. I either hover around 3.x's iteration, which isn't bad, it I update everything to 5e to avoid players inevitable questions Scott why a thing isn't a thing anymore or why sometime even is a thing now. I just feel like making my own setting, which I've done before, but then there will be absolutely no surprises for me. It's all my stuff. Ig I could adapt anything I want to, I assume most of us do that anyway but then I'll have another two boxes of nothing but notes that won't mean anything to anybody but me. I still would love to run a Ravenloft game but I don't want all the retarded package that comes with it. My Vistanti are going to be unscrupulous at best and unrepentant evil assholes at worst and I don't give a fuck if it pisses off the entire table. It's all so stupid and futile. D&D might not be the best game to use for horror but I can and have made my games scary before because I have a pretty firm grip on the horror genre but I'm not sure it would even be worth it for a bunch of 5e babies. I already have to modify 5e so much that it's basically a whole new game and while that might be fun for some ppl, it's just kinda meh to me. I'm so used to running games at any level that I will fund the fun in it regardless but damn, it's just not fun to run this mess anymore. I'd much rather play and I can't find a DM that even gives a fuck about the things I do. I could literally show up without a character sheet, make up all my stats, change them on the fly, fake every die roll and they won't even notice. System mastery is a meme. I could run a flawless 1e, 2e, or 3.xe game but in my group I'm the only one who can do so. My 4e dm was excellent but

. My 4e dm was excellent but he has no time for it anymore, he wants to play not run. I have one 5e DM who's finally shaping up to really be good (his pacing is impeccable) but everytime we play I can tell her would much rather be running something else and I don't blame him one bit. I don't hate vidya but it cannot scratch this itch. I'm going to have to bite the bullet and find a group of newbies at a lgs and start All over with the basics. I'm going to have to teach them everything from the ground up. I'm not looking forward to this at all.

>>97903402
Some people are butthurt Strahd doesn't just stand there and let a bunch of murderhobos murderhobo him.

That said, it's actually a pretty freaking common problem when monsters/NPCs are statted as super-intelligent but played as morons. It doesn't help that Strahd (in this case) is smarter than the GM running him, which is why chances are the GMs could stand a refresher on tactics now and then.

For me Keith Ammam's "The Monsters Know What They're Doing" blog posts were a great eye opener. He doesn't have one on Strahd, but he does cover the Kraken, which is -smarter- than Strahd, has Lair and Legendary actions. (Don't know the guy, and his posts are free.)

>>97903738
"Calm down. Have some dip."

Ravenloft as a setting is an option, sure, but you can get plenty of mileage just telling the players "it's gothic horror in the style of the Hammer Horror films. Brooding castles at night, buxom young women, creepy old Vistani fortune tellers and their shifty sons, bloody skeletons walking towards you, and melodramatic villains behind it all. But instead of English upperclassmen as heroes, we have a gnomish bard, a human paladin, and a dragonborn barbarian." Then from there just run a premade adventure; 1ed, 2ed, and 5ed have plenty.

You don't need to worry about the trade exchange rate between Barovia and Falkovnia, the crop rotation patterns of Blutespur (it's a brainy matter to be sure!), or what Azalin is up to this very second (he's probably dead. For real this time! Again. Until he isn't. Again.).

Honestly, as much as I love Ravenloft as a setting, it works great as a place for PCs to visit, stomp on a Darklord, and then leave entirely. And as such you don't need tons of prepwork fleshing out the world.