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Still working on this sketch. Redid the face of the girl on the right and made her neck shorter. Redid the hair on the other girl. Fixed up the boy’s ear.

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Draw these lesbians.

>>82284305
Why?

this is died camp for artist

>>82285783
We're busy drawing

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>>82284305
Couldn't figure out the heads, so here's two dullahans mixing flame.

>>82283215
Her face was far better before.

Does being depressed/suicidal make you a better artist?

>>82287713
It seems to just stop me from drawing at all so...

>>82287713
No it's just that depressing and suicidal people tend to often be going down the artistic spectrum. Normally as an outlet

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>>82287713
only if you threaten to kill yourself if you don't make it, apparantly

>>82287713
My art got way better after I started getting depressed about being a virgin so I'd say yes

>>82287000
Well shit. Abandoning project.

>>82288734
You don't have to do all that just go with the previous face, it's a sketch after all and you do have the previous sketch that posted in the last thread. just overlay and it should be fine no?

>>82288746
You keep Christmas in your way and let me keep it in mine! Is it taking forever for the captcha to load for anyone else?

>>82288876
eeeeh phooey, well either way the other side of the picture still looks good. What compelled you to change the face?

Also yes there has been some lag going on.

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i mightve overshot

>>82289034
I'd say the overall is good it's weird that it's not just a smooth transition from her butt to her thigh seeing as she does seem planted on the ground. Beyond that it doesn't feel like her torso is long enough (Replace everything I said with He if it's a dude) beyond that again good stuff.

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Is this a decent drawing?

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Fuck this slow captcha

>>82290693
Homie I gotta ask, what do you want out of art? Are you like looking to improve? Do you have grand aspirations? Just drawing for fun? I ignore you constantly because I can never glean your energy from looking at your work.

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More cat slop
We're on a roll today guys

>>82291942
Uhhh....who knows... I'll find out eventually

>>82291983
Then I can only say that the drawings you make are the drawings I expect you to make. Every single one of them reminds me of the last one. In truth I kinda assumed you were autistic and weren't really going to make too much movement outside of this beginner stage.

>>82292045
Ahh shut up. The last thing I need you parroting what my own brain tells me already.
I just need to figure out what to do. It works out eventually just watch or don't I don't care

>>82292112
That's why I asked you what your god damn goals were man. There's gotta be a reason you started, you're literally just drawing to draw and you don't seem to have enough direction for that method to actually utilize the amount you ACTUALLY draw. I rarely see people as persistent while making so little progress or no progress.

Often times people suck and then give up, I can at least praise you for going strong and respect you for it as well, but like to what end my man? What are you aiming for. This shiftless attitude to your artistic progression is holding you back my man. You literally have the energy for so much more.

>>82292152
If you asked me a few years ago in this general I would have answered you with excitement that I want to draw the ideas brooding in my mind.
Though I have been doing so quite rarely I never felt skilled enough to do them justice so I kinda resigned myself to this existence of nothingness where I never break a daily streak of drawing for years.
If would make a food analogy with little sense its like jumping if a bridge with an apple or something hehe.
Funny I know.
Im just crawling until I find it out

>>82292216
Well no like, I mean everyone generally has the goal of bringing SOME idea to life, whether it is their own or the ideas of others. I'm asking who was your inspiration. Why did you start, what was the thing that you saw that made you want to draw in the first place. Why are you in the drawing IMPROVEMENT general. What even is your goal for improvement, what is your IDEA of improvement. What does good even look like to you. What are you making the steps towards.

I hate to see you just walking in place for the year that I've been here. Please, for the love of god, do some soul searching, find artist you like and want to be like find a standard of good that is beyond where you are right now so you actually have something to WALK towards and make "Bad" drawings in an attempt to recreate cause this right here isn't cutting it chief and I dislike that for you.

>>82292271
Well the reason I stated is because of boredom and because I have not a single talent.
In general don't have a inspiration really.
I'm only here because I saw this place exists and I wanted to join for some reason.
And I honestly don't know what even improving looks like.
And my idea is of a good drawing is when I'm satisfied with it, and I know it's a arbitrary measurement that can't be achieve because I can't be satisfied with my own work because I always hate something that I did in some kind of way.

I just figure it out somehow

>>82292416
Then don't worry if a drawing is bad, don't worry if a drawing is good, don't even worry if a drawing is decent. You don't have a measurement for your own desired quality and anyone else's will be heavily based on their own and it will persist until people realize you simply don't improve and then begin to ignore you as that one glue eater in the corner.

You have no "talent" because you lack direction and you lack direction for some reason I do not truly understand. Once and if you find some direction, some place you want to be, or some artist you want to draw like, you'll most likely start moving automatically based off of those aspirations. Until then. I hope you don't keep spinning your wheels forever.

Now that I've said my piece, I can finally stop feeling some type of way when I see your art.

>>82292516
Good night

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messing with anatomy, trying to go for a ferret look and while I think I got it down well I am still open to criticism.

>>82286258
it is kind of a shame that we have to languish here on a fast board, always at risk of getting shitcanned because art takes time, still better than /ic/ though

>>82287713
your mileage may vary, but I think the nature of being an artist lends itself to having some kind of mental abnormality

blump

>>82292774
The furry thread on /ic/ would be okay if it didn't get less than a single post over multiple days

>>82292774
The biggest question mark for me looking at the current design is where you intend to fall on the anthro-to-feral scale.

Be clear where on the scale you want the design to sit. For feral you want small t-rex type arms with a very long body and short legs at the body's base. For anthro, you need to adapt the proportions closer to humans. I think currently you have struck a somewhat uncanny middleground. the legs are too long to be the animal version but too short to be anthro. The arms look very long because you opted for a ferret body but making them end at the hips like a human. I think you have to commit closer to one look or the other. Short limbs and long body, or average limbs and humanoid body. Definitely try to find references for how to stylize this body type. Adding a tail would also provide some more balance i think.

>>82290693
no
the face is classic symbol drawing

Remind me to not engage when drunk. I don't even want to look at the word salad I spewed last night.
Sorry about that

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>>82294380
That, and you can't show the explicit goods on it. I suppose you could always catbox it, but that's always a bit of extra hassle for both uploader and viewer.

>>82292774
>>82295096
The problem with human anatomy is that, unless you stylize it heavily into something cartoony, it doesn't tolerate a lot of proportional distortion before it starts looking wonky to our eyes. Human faces are the prime example of this, since that gives you the absolute least amount of leeway, but the human body only cuts you a little bit more slack in comparison, at the end of the day.

The ferret-esque long-body-short-limbs configuration is an especially bad fit for a creature that walks upright, since it's a bodyplan built for crawling and climbing about, and a combination of a long body with short arms isn't very fit for purpose on a bipedal frame, as I'm sure you've realized because you left the arms disproportionately long here. Instead of shortening the legs, try elongating just the torso. This will likely result in a disproportionate look as well, of course, so it may be worth considering lengthening the legs too if you want to create the impression of a long and slim character while maintaining relatively believable anatomical proportions. Not entirely anatomically verisimilitudinous to the target species' look, but that's a compromise of the sort one often has to make in the interest of aesthetics when it comes to anthro designs.

IT’S TAX DAY!

>>82296727
Pay up goym

>>82295506
What, which one?

>>82299138
The cat schizo
I do make unsound decisions when intoxicated. I shouldn't have lashed out at him

>>82299138
The cat schizo
I do make unsound decisions when intoxicated. I shouldn't have lashed out at that anon

>>82299412
Cat schizo kind of deserves to get some flak, like you said, he hasn't really improved and doesn't seem to want to. We've all given some advice, but he doesn't seem to apply much, if any, of it. Giving him a bit of shit might be the wake up call he needs.

>>82299933
if he doesn't want to improve, why would he take advice? No reason to give him shit if he doesn't care about getting better

Rendering is impossible. My mind just wants to paint, but it feels like I'm always fighting the tools instead of having them work for me. It's really tiring to work on something for days if not weeks, and at the end of the day have nothing to show for it. Like when I do lines, I can just shut my brain off a bit, sculpt lines a bit, and be done in less than an hour. It's nice and simple and fun. But rendering? I can't load the gun fast enough.

I don't want to just stop at flat colors.

Also my image doesn't seem to want to post so I'm just going to post text and see if that works instead.

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>>82300220
Ah, it finally went through. Was wrestling with it a bit.
Anyways, rendering drives me nuts and I can't wrap my head around it.

>>82299993
Then he shouldn't be in this thread

oh great, make the thread even more dead

>>82300278
Don't speak for me.
>>82299993
Well, he was asking if his drawing was decent, which is a pretty good indicator of someone wanting to improve, no? Or am I reading too much into it?

>>82300867
I think it should stand to reason that anyone posting in the "Drawing Improvement General" should want to improve. I don't think that's a baseless assumption.

>>82300278
I am the anon that was grilling him in the first place and this is pretty much the sentiment I have.

>>82300867
Issue is that it's not decent and it hasn't been decent for the amount of time that i've been here. It WOULD have been decent if I assumed he had only been here for like a few months and he's a beginner artist. But someone dedicating the amount of time that he's has SHOULD be better than where he is right now. So it's not decent, it's actually abysmal anyone who spent 2+ years of drawing only to remain at that level I would have told to search for other hobbies for THEIR sake.

Damn, people here are negative. If you're aimless, just quit cause im tired of seeing you?

>>82301330
This place is motsly /ic/ refugees so no surprise there

>>82301330
People? Nah not people. ME. I'm negative and it's not about being tired of seeing them, it's about being worried that this hobby isn't for them, but realistically it's more about the general we're in currently. I'm like looking at a picture from them 2 years ago and this shit is bleak.

>>82301544
>it's about being worried that this hobby isn't for them
That isn't for you to decide.

>>82301597
I equally have no power of making them stop or not. I can voice my opinion and they can choose to ignore it as well. You confuse me.

>>82301544
>I'm like looking at a picture from them 2 years ago
Repost it I wanna see the comparison to now

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>>82301697

>>82301752
I mean, yeah, improvement isn't linear. The idea that improvement is a linear, easy to follow path through an artist career is the most malignant and poisonous line of thinking that the dregs of /ic/ have posited. I'm not saying you're wrong to critique the artist but the position that you're critiquing from is flawed. The image you posted shows improvement in some areas, stagnation in others and regression in some. This is not an abnormal way for an artist to grow

Can I post?

>>82301624
You can choose to ignore my comment on you. You confuse me as well.

>>82301898
I get where you're coming from but like why coddle? What's point? Sure if he's happy then he's happy right? No need to improve if he just likes to draw, but again the whole "/dig/" thing. The whole asking if an image is decent thing. People were just going to ignore his ass or tell him that's shit. If anyone dedicates the time to point out the flaws he'll most likely acknowledge the fact that he does indeed need to do something but always eventually never in the now.

>>82301953
The part that confused me wasn't the idea of ignoring my comment or not. The part that confused me was you assuming my advisory notion was a definitive statement. It's not like I said. "Art is not for you and you should quit right now" though, to be fair it's not like I'm above making that statement.

>>82302059
So why are you even confused if the comment isn't out of your own vocab? Are you saying random shit for fun? That's essentially what you told them. No need to sugarcoat it.

>>82302345
Because surprisingly I do not think that he has some innate inability for the arts. I actually do believe he could get somewhere if he simply applied himself. There is a specific type of person that I tell to give up (You normally find them in IC) and he's not it.

>>82300261
hi i'm a rendermonkey, what level of "rendered" are you aiming for? Any references?
Also how experienced are you with celshading?

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>>82303092
I try to do celshading, but I like gradients and soft shadows as well, so I try to incorporate that too. Oftentimes I don't really do scenes, so I'm less interested in light source and more in just making a piece more cohesive.

I've done rendering in the past that I'm proud of (reposting this because it's one of the few pics I am really proud of), but it's always a gamble. I have no technique, and the process can be quite frustrating. I can post what I have for the flat-colored piece I posted above if you'd prefer, but I really just don't know how to learn from the process.

I'm sorry if that's really vague. I know I need to practice, but it's so difficult for me to get a grasp on that I don't even know how to learn from my mistakes in the first place.

can i post here?

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Anyone know software for making good perspective lines? I've considered taking screenshots in blender.
Picrel really opened my eye to how useful they can be.

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>>82301914
>>82303309
If you were testing if you're banned, it looks like you aren't. If you're asking for permission to show us your work, you don't really need one, but consider it given.

>>82303346
Most drawing programs have various perspective tools built into them these days. Ain't made much use of them myself, on account of rarely doing background scenery or complex scenes that'd really benefit from it, but the little experimenting I've done with Clip Studio Paint's tools confirms that you can make your brush strokes follow the perspective lines of the grid you set up automatically to make drawing straight lines easy as pie. Probably a lot of other cool shit you can do with them, but I wouldn't know about it.

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>>82303269
If you're comfortable with celshading, you're already like 80% of the way there. The only real difference between celshading and something more "rendered" is edge control and maybe some ambient occlusion if you're feeling it.

I did a quick and dirty demo of how I'd render something like your previous image.

1. Block out shadow shapes, I like Linear Burn but you can use whatever layer mode you want

2. Refine shadow shapes

3. Repeat steps 1 and 2 as many times as you want, working smaller and darker each time. In this case, I mostly did it to define more cast shadow darkness or to emphasize form shadows.

4. Begin to refine midtones and edge control. I like to grab some color that is directly between your shadow and light shapes. I use this new color to paint in details along the terminator shadow. You can also add a few additional shapes within your light and shadow shapes, but leave most of the detail close to the terminator's edge.

5. Draw the rest of the owl. In this case I saturated the colors with an Ovlerlay layer, added highlights, demo of painting over your lineart if you want to go that route (time consuming so only did a bit of it), ambient occlusion. Feel free to add gradients that are brighter when facing the light's direction and fade darker when moving away from it.

I wanted to find some happy medium between draw-the-rest-of-the-owl and just straight up finishing the image for you. Hopefully this can give you some pointers.

>>82303722
First, I really appreciate all the effort. Thank you. It's good to know I'm not too far off, but it still feels strange to me how chaotic the process feels to me when I do it myself. I'm not sure how to change my mindset.

This is what I have so far. I'm noticing a few key differences, but a lot of similarities too, which is reassuring. It's getting to that point where it's starting to spiral out of my control, and I'm not sure if I should just start over. I would love to understand my program more to get that painterly look you've achieved. I doubt it's as complicated as my brain makes it. Feels like a Huey situation to me...But could you explain what you're thinking about when you do that?

I know that's really vague and might not even make sense to you, but it just feels like there's this mental block in my mind that prevents me from enjoying the process. Am I just overthinking things? How did you learn to enjoy rendering (if you do)?

Also fuck 4chan, pain in my ass today...It's not cooperating at all. Here's a link to a catbox if image uploading isn't working.
https://files.catbox.moe/eeqv6u.jpg

>>82303722
4chan is really testing my patience today. It keeps eating my posts, and it won't let me post images. 50 minutes later and my post is just...gone. Let me try and remember what I said. God fucking dammit.

First of all, thank you very much for going to that extent. Looking at what you did, we're actually not far off in terms of overall method, but it always just feels so awkward for me. It takes me forever to get anywhere with shading. Maybe I'm just thinking about each individual part too much, instead of blocking everything in messily and then refining. It might be a "pet the dog" situation, where I just need to render the fucking pic.

How do you achieve the painterly look you have going on with the later thumbnails? I big issue with my pics is that I feel like I'm constantly wrestling with the program(s) I'm using. When did you notice that you got comfortable with it? Or is it always slightly awkward with digital art? Maybe I should just stick to lineart, which is much more pleasant for me, comparatively...

Anyways, here's what I did do the other day. I'm noticing a lot of similarities with where we chose to place shadows, and some differences as well, which I will take note of (like on Cairn's upper arm there). Thank you again for trying to help. I fear I might be a bad student as well as a bad painter.

https://files.catbox.moe/eeqv6u.jpg

4chan is broken. I apologize in advance if a bunch of my posts appear at once and all say the same shit.

I fucking KNEW that would happen HOLY FUCK I hate this website

4chan is fucking bullshit I’m joining BlueSky!

>>82304430
the catbox link doesn't work either

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>>82304572
I FUCKING TESTED IT
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

HERE
FUCK
https://h.uguu.se/UyVOGDjo.jpg

>>82304644
well at least now i know its not just me
>>82303346
krita has a fine perspective tool

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This took me way longer than it should have, and I'm still not entirely happy with it. The actual shot of the bed looks right, and the camera is good, but everything around it is kinda messy. I'm also very unhappy with the muscles for the figure on the right.

>>82303854
>>82304043
> I would love to understand my program more to get that painterly look you've achieved. I doubt it's as complicated as my brain makes it. Feels like a Huey situation to me...But could you explain what you're thinking about when you do that?

Part of it might just be that i'm using a textured brush when i'm not using a round circle brush. Other than that, I tend to think of everything as shapes. The highlights are shapes, the shadows are shapes, the midtones are shapes. Each shape has a design that you can make more interesting or be broken up.

Two things that do a lot of heavy lifting when rendering for me are cutting into the shapes (like I did with the highlights), and making sure the edges of most of my light-to-shadow transitions are interesting. In the last image with the ear fluff, I'm just picking the shadow color, drawing at around 50% opacity into the white, and sampling that new color. I then use that new color to add a border around my shadow shapes. I think it adds a lot of extra form to the shapes, but it's a stylistic choice.

>Am I just overthinking things?

Probably. If you're not intimately familiar with shading primitive forms like cubes and spheres though, it might require a lot more critical thought and not be quite as second-nature. I'm able to autopilot a lot of decisions with my current skill level, most of my critical thinking winds up being in how I'm going to design shapes so that the composition is readable.

> How did you learn to enjoy rendering (if you do)?

I do! I don't know if it's really something that I've had to learn to enjoy. I've always been kinda enamored with light and color and rendering, and they've always been my favorite thing to draw. I can empathize with not liking some parts of the drawing process though. I hate lineart. I just try to use new brushes and try new things every drawing so I don't get bored. That helps me grind through it. Having friends to sanity-check you is good too.

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>>82283098

>>82304836
>I tend to think of everything as shapes
how so? just as they are on the canvas, or following the forms?
>Each shape has a design that you can make more interesting or be broken up
could you expand on how you determine what that design is? when is the point where breaking up a shape is too much?

>>82304836
Thanks again for answering. And you do it all on one layer too, it looks like? Maybe I should challenge myself and stop fucking with a million layers with different modes. That said, what kind of textured brush is that? I love textured brushes but they all feel kind of bad to use, and I don't really know how to configure them properly.

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>>82305257

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>>82304043
>When did you notice that you got comfortable with it?
Some a-ha moments came with watching Marco Bucci's youtube videos. I always glaze him whenever I post about rendering, but his 10 Minutes to Better Painting series really helped me grasp some color and rendering processes. All I can recommend is that you keep trying different things until you can find a way to make it fun for yourself. Whether it's watching a movie in the background or streaming it to friends or trying different brushes and methods.

>>82304644
I think a lot of your shadow locations are perfectly fine. I think the thing that I'd change is how you have a dark shadow terminator that is defining your shadow shapes, and then you have your light seeping into that.

Try and make sure your shadows are defined and aren't getting too bright. I try to contain the shadow shapes here in the first image. Images 2 and 3 are two different ways to design the same midtones/terminator.

>how so? just as they are on the canvas, or following the forms?
As they are on a canvas, specifically when it comes to designing shapes of light and dark.
This video's a good example of what I mean. https://youtu.be/-ZknWKTpc90?list=PLLmXZMqb_9sbNLM83NrM005vRQHw1yTKn

>could you expand on how you determine what that design is?
The above video goes into it, but you can think of shapes as a flat design that should have push and pull to it, but in a way that flatters the image. Maybe it follows the forms of your character, or leads the eye somewhere. But a rhombus will always be more interesting than a square.

>>82305008
I used multiple layers for blocking in my shadows on Linear Burn layers, and then once I got everything in place I just painted on top of it.
>what kind of textured brush is that
A chisel-ish pencil brush I downloaded like 7 years ago. I use it for sketching and sometimes I'll just scale it up a bunch to paint with it if I'm feeling like it.

>>82305693
As a continuation, you might not always want to paint on top of your lineart, especially if you enjoy it and spend a lot of time on it. It's pretty hard to both show off good, clean lineart and good rendering at the same time though. Not impossible, just hard. I find that there's not a good reason to spend a lot of time on your lineart if you just plan to paint over them anyways though.

>>82305670
Ty

>>82305693
I mean, it's been years now and rendering still makes very little sense to me. Anything I've ever rendered that turns out half well is a fluke. That's how it feels anyways. I'm just getting good at pretending. Also, I don't have any art friends to bounce ideas off of.

Everything you've said makes sense, but also reaffirms that it's just a skill issue. Whenever I ask for rendering advice, the response is always a simple, "Oh, just do this!", but it never works out that simply for me. I guess all I can do it keep bashing my head against the wall. Maybe it'll get easier in another five years.

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>>82304644
I can't help you with rendering, but I feel like Zhao needs some more detail around her eyes. Maybe an eyebrow too, but I don't recall if you're okay with see-through hair.

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Oh boy, pretty good start to my week id say. Could have done more but I started pretty late tonight.

Hey, so uh...does anyone here got any good tutorials for drawing hair and/or fur? It's one thing I still consistently struggle with.

>>82305865
It might be boring but focusing on rendering primitives really does help. Spheres, cylinders and cubes, and do more than just the bare minimum. Add bound lights to them, rim lights, cast shadows, cast shadows on top of boxes and spheres and cylinders, highlights, material studies. Material studies on boxes and spheres and cubes. It's definitely what helped me the most.

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the anon's cat from last thread
i dont think it really worth finishing with how poor the forms are, drawing on my laptop is kinda uncomfortable but i think im getting the hang of it.

>>82306606
Hair and fur are the place, of all places, to flex stylization. I don't have any good tutorials on hand not least because most "tutorials for hair" are "here's how I - one very particular person - draw hair."

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>>82305693
I went back and messed with it a little. You said something in another post about lowered opacity, and so I brought my hard round to 50% and that helped a lot for a few areas. I was able to 'brush in' the shade I wanted, and then adjust off of that. Felt better.
A lot of this was just kind of copying what I saw you do, but even so I think it turned out a bit better. I'll see how I feel about it tomorrow.

>>82306296
You're right. I added some. Not sure how much it helped. The eye socket is tough.

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Drew my hubby/WIP fursona today and it's a massive improvement to when I first started last month. Lines are fucking awfully wobbly and asymmetrical and I don't think I'll ever fix that for a while yet, but I'm happy I've got something passably cute. Drawing him from other angles is going to be a nightmare and I'm scared.

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would (you) tongue her ass?

>>82311179
Who would stop me?

>>82311376
Nobody

Any guides for water markers? I bought a pac recently and tried them out today.
They make me feel absolutely retarded.

>>82311614
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WIYo6rjoKI

>>82311179
Cute maned wolf. Would slobber all over them cheeks on my way to the grand prize.

>>82311179
Some I don't think you drew this 2 month old piece

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drawing?

>>82314838
No