File: 1769543285892397.png (1.2 MB)

1.2 MB PNG

>>42196601
Previous thread >>42074476

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_NkZqqlzcM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tq_9ejRzFfQ

https://annas-archive.gl/md5/cd048f5e379b5bc1854049f9d765e7cb

What've you fellas been reading lately and what've you gotten out of it

File: Origen hashtaglegend.jpg (2.2 MB)

2.2 MB JPG

Anyone else here the ascribes to the mystic mythicist view of the Bible?

Basically just an extreme version of Origen and Gregroy of Nyssa's allegorical readings of the Bible.

I don't believe that anything at all in the Bible literally physically/materially happened, including the entire Jesus.

However, I do believe that that are valuable spiritual truths that can be gleaned from the stories within.

As you can problably imagine, this viewpoint doesn't exactly allow me to be on friendly terms with most modern day Christians.

>>42197817

*that ascribes to

*including the entire Jesus story

*that there are

sorry for my stupid typos

File: 1774068418844246.jpg (582.8 KB)

582.8 KB JPG

>>42197817
I lean this way, but I only occasionally glance at these threads because my impression is that the OP wants them to be for orthodox Christians

>>42197817
>I don't believe that anything at all in the Bible literally physically/materially happened, including the entire Jesus.
The Jesus events being historically viable are what makes Christianity literally true and separates it from other religions.

>>42197688
I've been rereading Angelomorphic Pneumatology, trying to square ancient Christian traditions with Christian Cabala and later theosophy
>>42197817
David, John the Baptist, Jesus, James, etc... are real historical figures, for example Josephus speaks of them, how do you explain that eith your mythicist view?
Adam and Eve aren't historical, you could say they're meta-historical or whatever, the fall of Adam explains how humans fell from eternity into time, from eternal spirits like the angels to beings that have a beginning and end with our birth and death
And most stories are double, for example Israel and his sons come down to Egypt both literally, and the Angel Israel (the Prayer of Joseph makes Israel the Son of God) comes down with the the angels to the material world, Adam and Eve are Jesus and the Church, Cain, Abel and Seth then would be their offspring, we have a lot of exegesis like this, from Philo to Origen (where the Israel one is from) to Böhme
>>42198141
Yes without the literal victory over death, our faith is nothing

>Prompt for AI:
There's a book by Jeremy Royal Howard titled "Christianity and Quantum Physics". It's about the use of the Copenhagen Interpretation and it's relation to Christian apologetics. What do you know about it? It feels like a culture-war-coded pushback against some of the excesses of the Fundamental Fysiks Group and their co-travelers...and I'm here for it. Are there other critiques of the FFG, similar that Subliminal Jihad episode? Preferably in book form? Doesn't Philip Ball's book "Beyond Weird" contain a criticism of the Copenhagen Interpretation?

File: Gregory.jpg (125.3 KB)

125.3 KB JPG

>>42198141
And this is why I don't align with any modern Christians. Because I completely disagree with you on that point.

It doesn't need to have literally happened for me to find value in it.

Look into the primary sources for any religion or any ancient history and you'll see it all completely falls apart.

This is why an allegorical interpretation like that portrayed in Gregory of Nysaa's writings, combined with mystical approaches (direct experiential knowledge of god/the divine, rather than "blind faith"), is the only honest way to approach Christianity.

Have you read Gregory of Nyssa or practiced any of the experiential techniques of the mystics?

>>42198165
>Josephus

Have you examined the provenance for Josephus's writings that mention these figures?

For example, have you looked at the chain of ownership and historical record regarding the manuscripts of his writings?

Once you do this, you'll see that they're clearly not reliable.

In most cases, the primary sources were "lost", "burnt", or "discovered" in the 1800s.

>>42198200
>It doesn't need to have literally happened for me to find value in it.
For your value to be real and not just in your head it does
>Look into the primary sources for any religion or any ancient history and you'll see it all completely falls apart.
How so for Christianity?

>>42198216
For Josephus specifically, we've got multiple manuscripts from the 11th century onward in different languages, latin, greek, slavonic
>>42198222
Yes that's how Christianity is superior to most other religions, belief in Christianity can be justified with the resurrection, whereas for example Islam, what's the reason to believe in it?
The resurrection is a miracle, whereas the Quran? It's a book, I don't see what makes it miraculous, I don't know how muslims even justify it, genuinely i mean, because i do know their tricks and lies, how it's perfect and the most beautiful work and how it's perfectly preserved right down to the letter

File: Sinaiticus.png (560.1 KB)

560.1 KB PNG

>>42198222
>How so for Christianity?
Identify the texts that are claimed to be historical sources for the events that happened in the bible (or any history from a similar time period).

Find out what the original manuscripts of these texts are meant to be.

Find where they are now held (if they even still exist)

Find out what the official provenance is for the manuscripts

Judge for yourself if the information you have found is reasonable

For example, do you think that this discovery story regarding the Codex Sinaiticus is reliable?

"He wrote that in 1844, during his first visit to the Saint Catherine's Monastery, he saw some leaves of parchment in a waste-basket. They were "rubbish which was to be destroyed by burning it in the ovens of the monastery", although this is firmly denied by the Monastery. After examination he realized that they were part of the Septuagint, written in an early Greek uncial script. He retrieved from the basket 129 leaves in Greek which he identified as coming from a manuscript of the Septuagint."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codex_Sinaiticus

>>42198258
>For example, do you think that this discovery story regarding the Codex Sinaiticus is reliable?
It doesn't need to be, in order to be historically valuable. The Septuagint also has miracle stories attributed to it that aren't necessary in order to use it in a case supporting Christianity.

>>42198252
So the official story is that you have manuscripts dating from roughly 1,000 years after the events supposedly took place?

If this is the case, just be honest with yourself. That obviously isn't proof that these events took place

>>42198270
When you have dozens of manuscripts in different languages from different time periods and different places, all telling the same story, the same story mentioned by other manuscripts are within a certain text, then it probably is proof it happened
I know you want to play skeptic, but like that you can deny everything

File: Rolle.jpg (78.4 KB)

78.4 KB JPG

>>42198303
I do deny all history.

I understand that I hold a relatively unsual stance on these sorts of things.

The only point I'm trying to make with all this is that it's still possible, at least in my opinion, to be a Christian while not believing that any of these events literally happened.

Allegorical readings, and direct experiential knowledge of the divine are why I believe.

For others, they may prefer something else. But for anyone else like me who is highly skeptical, you may find my style useful.

This is also a good stance to hold against atheists or anti-christians who will rightfully point out the flaws in the historical record regarding the Bible.

Researching occult and esoteric stuff (books and online) brought me full circle back to just trusting and having faith in Jesus
I don’t want to devote much more time to anything else. It’s funny, all the Reddit atheist fags I knew growing up have seemingly gotten into gnostic chaos magick luciferian bollocks, all of them critical of Christianity but never of Judaism or Islam

>>42198330
Your perspective renders (reduces) all points of view equally viable. There is no reason to believe your experiences over my own or over a random schizos
It is tranny ideology, evil.

>>42198330
>who will rightfully point out the flaws in the historical record regarding the Bible.
To say there are flaws implies there are parts that are true
You selectively cherry pick the deconstructive parts to build your worldview on. There is nothing wrong with saying either "I don't know what that part means" or "there's reason to believe that part isn't true" like the early Christians did with Mark 16. But dispensing with the whole biblical narrative over it is throwing the baby out with the bath water

File: Baron Roman Ungern von Sternberg.jpg (316.2 KB)

316.2 KB JPG

>>42196601
Thread theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jl40sYGDAlk
>I know that only the restoration of kings will save humanity corrupted by the West.

>>42198338
>There is no reason to believe your experiences over my own or over a random schizos

I agree, you shouldn't believe my experiences. You should believe your own, using your own reason.

If your experiences have led you to disagree with the points that I have raised, then you should believe that.

Why do you believe in the literal historical story of some parts of the Bible?

Have you ever looked into the primary sources?

File: Screenshot_20260403-133733(1).png (444.8 KB)

444.8 KB PNG

>>42198409
Yes I find certain important texts like Mark, Luke, acts, and 1 Corinthians to be imminently historically viable documents, and the secular consensus seems to agree. They just aren't Christian because they don't see miraculous events as viable on principle, but it sure seems like miraculous events are the best explanation there is to explain Christianitys origin, the conversion of Paul, and the religions wide spread amidst persecution

If you have something to substantial to share, please do so and stop teasing

>>42198407
Baste. Can anyone recommend a good entry-level monarchist book? I've tried to watch two podcast interviews with Charles Coulombe on the topic, but find him insufferable, which makes me not hopeful about his book. Also, is Bloody White Baron worth reading?

>>42198421
So you believe they are historically viable because an AI overview told you that scholrs believe it was written around 55 AD?

Or have you actually looked into this yourself?

>>42198347
>There is nothing wrong with saying either "I don't know what that part means" or "there's reason to believe that part isn't true"

I do know what the stories mean

and

There's reason to believe that none of the Bible happened. Of course, I don't know with 100% certainty, but I think it's much more likely than not that none of the events took place.

>>42198550
You're being condescending. If you have anything substantial to share, please do so.

>>42198575
>There's reason to believe that none of the Bible happened.
What reason is that particularly for the events of Jesus
Preferably a direct answer that shares information with me as opposed to asking me "have you looked it up?!"

>>42198586
I started a discussion about allegorical readings of the Bible, and Christian mysticism.

My intention was for people to pick up on any of those topics.

Gregory of Nyssa, Origen, Rolle, St Julian, St Teresa, St John of the Cross, The Cloud of Unknowing.

These are the sorts of things that make me believe.

I would like to hear what other people think about this.

Please, anyone jump in with your direct experiential knowledge of the divine and/or your allegorical readings of biblical events.

File: Screenshot_2026-04-03_161135.jpg (428.7 KB)

428.7 KB JPG

Fuck you bitches I'm going to kill every single one of you with the word of God and you shall die and you will know your sin

>>42198617
Yes there's a mystic science across all religions that one can tap into, but only the Jesus event is where spiritual mysticism crossed into a historical reality that can actually be examined as viable
Otherwise there's no metric with which to discern the mystic experiences of Christianity against those of Hinduism or satanism or schizos on the street. If you don't care to know that your truth has actual value as real truth then there is no point in having any sort of discussion

>>42198597
Because we don't have any verifiable primary sources from the time.

Which specific source convinced you of the historicity of Jesus? I'll look into it with an open mind.

Or, genuinely asking, why do you believe in the historicity of the Jesus story?

>>42198650
Why don't you see any of the documents I mentioned as historically viable? Virtually the entire new testament, with minor possible exceptions like 3 John or 2 Peter, were likely written within the lifespan of believers immediately following Jesus. This is the historical consensus, not Christian revisionism.

>>42198660
I already posted the dubious story regarding the discovery of the Codex Sinaiticus, one of the most important early surviving new testament manuscripts. (found in 1844)

The Codex Vaticanus is another important early surviving manuscript, that can, at best, be traced back to 1481.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codex_Vaticanus

Obviously, I'm not going to believe either of these sources that purport to provide evidence for events that took place many hundreds of years before their traceable provenance can go back to.

Which specific manuscripts/sources for Mark, Luke, Acts or 1 Corinthians convinced you of their reliability?

>>42198704
>Using the study of comparative writing styles (palaeography), it has been dated to the 4th century AD.
From the opening paragraph of your link

>>42198704
>I already posted the dubious story regarding the discovery of the Codex Sinaiticus, one of the most important early surviving new testament manuscripts. (found in 1844)
If I found some documents in a cave that dated back to the second century, and then came up with a nonsense story about how they were given to me by angels, that does not render the documents historically useless

>>42198617
None of those authors are historically reliable, all their manuscripts were discovered in the 1800s, we can't take them seriously

>>42198704
Also we have richer manuscript evidence for the NT than any other texts of antiquity. It's very easily verifiable but here is one for Mark
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papyrus_137
Keep in mind we have hundreds/thousands of these depending on the book, plus quotations from church fathers

>>42198725
I agree, as historical figures they are not reliable.

However, we can agree with the writings that are ascribed to these characters, whether they literally existed or not.

>>42198732
>Also we have richer manuscript evidence for the NT than any other texts of antiquity. It's very easily verifiable but here is one for Mark
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papyrus_137
This comes from the infamous Oxyrhynchus Papyri.

"The Oxyrhynchus Papyri are a group of manuscripts discovered during the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries by papyrologists Bernard Pyne Grenfell and Arthur Surridge Hunt at an ancient rubbish dump near Oxyrhynchus in Egypt"

Found in a rubbish dump in the 1890s.

>>42198755
So what? Why does that affect their dating or historical value

>>42198768
Because if they were only found in the 1890s, we can never know for sure when they were actually originally made.

For all we know, they could have been made in the 1890s. Essentially, they could be complete fakes.

They could also be genuine.

Neither of us know for sure.

I believe leaning more towards not reliable is much more reasonable given the circumstances

>>42198748
No we can't, if we don't ever know their author what can we say about them?
And they conflict with my personal experience

>>42198789
>we can never know for sure when they were actually originally made.
No but we can make informed guesses through analysis
https://ehrmanblog.org/what-the-new-fragment-of-marks-gospel-looks-like-the-so-called-first-century-mark/
This is a blog by Bart Ehrman, an agnostic professor of religious studies speaking on the papyri and validating the competency of the experts involved in dating it. Unfortunately his link to the analysis 404s, I can try to find something else if you aren't able, but hopefully his unbiased expert opinion counts for something.

>>42196601
Videos on Gnosis, its various types (SPG, UPG & VPG) and Gnosticism:

https://youtu.be/0F7knBtLsNs
https://youtu.be/260L-DEZVQ0
https://youtu.be/diHf_Tup6tE

What has happened to x? This is the only good thread I've seen so far while scrolling.

File: Jesus is beautiful!.jpg (48 KB)

48 KB JPG

Jesus died for our sins but will rise again on the third day to fulfill the prophecy he will descend into hell to free a few souls and then reunite with his disciples

>>42196601
15 hours 40 minutes to the resurrection timeframe (~2hours). Then 7 years and 11 days

File: the black hundreds.jpg (98.3 KB)

98.3 KB JPG

>>42198427
Manual of the Monarchist – Black Hundreds (Rukovodstvo monarkhista-chernosotentsa, 1906) by Vladimir Gringmut
Reflections of a Russian Statesman by Konstantin Pobedonostsev
On Monarchist Statehood by Lev Tikhomirov (former revolutionary who later ideolgically converted to extreme monarchism).
Die Konservative Revolution in Deutschland 1918–1932: Ein Handbuch by Armin Mohler
Die Herrschaft der Minderwertigen by Edgar Julius Jung
The Decline of the West and Prussianism and Socialism by Oswald Spengler (he praised prussian authoritarian values and "caesarism" and was influental on monarchists
Considerations on France by Joseph de Maistre (blistering attack on the French Revolution as divine punishment and a call for restored monarchy and papal authority as the only path to order.)
Théorie du pouvoir politique et religieux dans la société civile (Theory of Political and Religious Power, 1796, 3 vols.) by Louis de Bonald

>>42201814
So awesome. Thank you!

>>42201814
De Maistre was also a Martinist

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NH_rjA2AuGg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlDXdPSEtgk

File: rose_among_the_laurel.jpg (937.6 KB)

937.6 KB JPG

https://holystonesandironbones.com/2025/01/05/the-rose-among-the-laurel-rosaries-and-catholicism-in-appalachian-folk-traditions/

>>42202204
Ah yes the traditional islamic values of child marriage, homosexuality, cousin marriage, polyamory, dressing their women in hijabs causing vitamin d defficiency, and waging jihad against the infidels

>>42202204
This ridiculous big tent coalition thinking is a result of the americanist mind disease.
It’s a democratic habit of mind, even when dressed in anti-democratic clothing: everyone at the table as equals, bargaining, compromising, forever adjusting the tent poles to fit whoever shows up.
Sometimes people forget that some alliances profane the cause itself.

>>42202204
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/l9P4b77ZV2k
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/jHJdK2Rfa4E

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrBgSzjSvZE

>>42196601
https://x.com/tsidpod/status/2028856609313575127?s=20

File: 1515747053165.jpg (57.2 KB)

57.2 KB JPG

Quick reminder: ideas don't die, ideas don't die, ideas don't die, ideas don't die.
No matter how fiercely the modern world tried to stamp it out. The throne and altar simply waits, patient as the old empires themselves, for loyal hearts to carry it forward once more.
Old loyalties are awakening, the idea lives on, because hearts like yours, anon, keep it breathing.
Ave Christus Rex!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkTRrRB_U_o
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qyuHZdzfYQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=idkLsFP6KSU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3IF7Rt0NmE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BftJRonmRWY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRnBiLQMx14
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKlXRlDnJjI

Ive decided to make my own Christian denomination called Northern Orthodox (NOX) In which Christianity, barring its history, is relived from an entirely european pagan origin for europeans. Because if God is universal then he should be reachable by everyone whether or not they knew the middle east existed, and should be reachable from the context of my own people and their culture without the demonization of my culture that came with the church. We can look to Thor or Donar and applaud them for their strength and protectiveness but refrain from worship and make note of their failures. Honor thy father and mother and their father and mother

>>42198338
>>42198586
that anon is probably in (living) purgatory, buddhist tier, yet instead of meditating he's bugging us with the relativist schizo nonsense
at least he's got the decency to reddit space his posts so we can avoid him, we must thank him for that

>>42204242
>In which Christianity, barring its history, is relived from an entirely european pagan origin for europeans
interesting. from what I remember, if Snorri Sturluson didn't convert to Christianity, he wouldn't have given us the most rich repository of Nordic myths and legends
also a lot of Germanic peoples converted very easily to Christianity while getting nothing in return... which makes me think that there was a pretty strong alignment with the worldview of both (maybe not the exoteric, but the esoteric)
anyway, I'm interested of hearing more

>>42204289
I do agree. Some of the basic ideas behind NOX is the ultimate authority and responsibility to what happens within the home lays on the head of the home. No churches or temples. No popes or authority based pastors. To this day if your house falls apart it is on the leader of the home, not on the pastor, so I might as well ratify that as the position. I dislike the groveling "we are worms" so many pastors induce for control and so i say God reaches down to help us be better than we are, im not denying the scripture but the way its lived really fucking matters. NOX holds that creation of items and art with the hands is a holy act to a Creator God. And that the demonization of past europeans gods, heroes and traditions is inappropriate. While the pagan gods are not worshipped, one should be able to look at Thor and be inspired by his strengths, aware of his failures, and kneel to God at the end of the day. Likewise we should be allowed to remember our ancestors with pride for their good deeds, Christian or not

File: deliverance_ministry_etc.jpg (131.4 KB)

131.4 KB JPG

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oU8j7FZZ-bI

File: Franz Josef praying for his troops.jpg (243.6 KB)

243.6 KB JPG

>>42204242
Basically your basic impulse is 100% correct but actually you don't need to reinvent the Church to honor your blood and soil, Christianity meets you where you are, in your particular people and land, and elevates it and sanctifies the organic whole
I assure you, cobbling together some Christ-Odin hybrid will end up pleasing nobody and satisfying nothing. That’s a lot of work for a result that’s probably going to be intellectually flimsy and spiritually hollow.
Your grandfather's grandfather didn't need NOX and neither do you.

>>42204517
The same argument can be made for every denomination that has been made, survived, and established itself as a cultural monolith for better or for worse

>>42204566
The problem I have with NOX is that it is simply a duplicate effort. Christianity already does what NOX promises.
It is only in VERY recent times that the Church has become a universalist, rootless, anti-national institution and it has gotten that way because the "old european supermen" are gone and now their place, we have democratic republics, EU bureaucrats, and global financial elites.
The solution is to fix society not form endless offshoots that go nowhere. Just food for thought.
If the bishop won't listen, appeal to the metropolitan. If the metropolitan won't listen, appeal to the patriarch. If the patriarch is a coward, then wait. Pray. Build a network of like-minded traditionalists. Do not leave. Do not start a new sect.
Athanasius of Alexandria stayed despite most of the bishops being arian heretics and was able to overcome them eventually and save the Church, so will you.

>>42204625
I maintain my authority in my home. I will not beseech any bishop or patriarch anymore so then I will explain the wrongdoings of another man to his face

>>42204835
You're the king of your living room, congratulations, you have become a hostage. You have surrendered every inch of ground beyond your threshold.
You have lost the Church. You have lost the nation. You have lost the culture, what now soldier of Christ?

>>42204870
No more than even the bishop is only king in his living room. I will live my life and teach others by example

File: magus_1.jpg (474.9 KB)

474.9 KB JPG

https://soundcloud.com/davidbmetcalfe/conjuration-of-the-southern-wind

>>42204322
>mothe
yeah but a village or a city is a collection of such houses and maybe if you concern yourself with work, hunting, and raising your children one other person only concerns himself how to better exploit you, spread rumors, and even training his children in such practices
that's why "popes" etc. are needed
of course it's irrelevant in christian orthodox countries where they are subordinated to the nation (i.e. politics) so worth basically shit... that may confuse you
but with catholicism they just go in parallel and keep each other honest... look at the emperor-pope dynamics

https://davidmetcalfe.wordpress.com/2016/08/05/points-of-contact-evangelizing-with-an-electric-touch-selected-quotes/

>>42204944
Yes there are many examples of pedophile or corrupt popes, that is not a fix either. There is no guarantee that the pope in that circumstance will help you. And he is one man to sway with no more glory of God then the next jack and all the more social influence

>>42204958
you must be mentally retarded
i recommend emigration to india; alternatively just make a vow not to speak to anybody for the rest of your life... I would have recommended you to kys but that's a sin

File: appalachia.jpg (467.7 KB)

467.7 KB JPG

https://davidmetcalfe.wordpress.com/2019/02/01/keeping-the-hearth-fire-burning%e2%80%8a-%e2%80%8aon-imbolc-appalachia-and-traditions-hidden-in-plain-sight/

File: charms.jpg (1 MB)

1 MB JPG

https://withcunningandcommand.com/2026/03/22/st-theodore-tirons-charms-of-household-vigilance/
https://withcunningandcommand.com/2025/12/01/st-michaels-charms-of-spirit-valour/
https://withcunningandcommand.com/2025/07/29/sts-georges-charms-against-the-evil-eye/

>>42204916
>>42204919
>>42204920
>>42204924
I've been telling people about this for ages but snobs aren't interested in anything that doesn't involve smells and bells.

File: ramon_llull.jpg (798.8 KB)

798.8 KB JPG

https://davidmetcalfe.wordpress.com/2021/12/15/thinking-the-machine-ramon-llull-and-the-inner-life-of-advanced-technology/
https://davidmetcalfe.wordpress.com/2019/08/28/a-curious-mental-experiment-co-creation-ars-combinatoria-and-the-infinite-game/

https://x.com/Sophiologist_/status/2040452758814204286

File: golden_legend_alchemy_dreams_5.jpg (515.3 KB)

515.3 KB JPG

https://davidmetcalfe.wordpress.com/2021/12/25/we-that-walk-in-the-nights-midwinter-reflections-on-wandering-stars-dream-incubation-and-alchemical-gold/

Interesting realization. Lucifer was the Angel over Eden and his job was to keep making from touching the Tree of Knowledge and the Tree of Life.

This is why God didn't interfere and no Angel stepped forward to stop Lucifer because natural Law said he was allowed to what he did.

If Adam or Eve rebuked him he would have been defeated simple as but that is not what occurred. Anyway.

Jesus was the Tree of Life this would mean that Lucifer's duty has to do with the Cross. His rebellion being that Lucifer was the one who desired to hang from the Tree of Life and be worshipped by all creation. The duty of Lucifer was to submit and serve under the Tree of Life but he wanted to be the Savior of Humanity. Lucifer twisted by Pride wanted to be the God worshipped by humanity in his arrogant Pride he believed he could steal it but was easily struck down by God.

God's design is perfect.
This is also key.
This also means that Lucifer retained his natural orders to stand watch under the Tree and God allowed it.

Lucifer used it to tempt Eve but by doing so he set in motion the coming of Christ.

When Jesus Hung from the Cross Lucifer was bound to the cross as well. In doing so God forced Lucifer to submit and fulfill his duty to God.

This does not mean Lucifer was redeemed because Lucifer has no repentance instead he was replaced. By Mary who stood watch and Bore the Light of Christ to the world.

Happy Easter Everyone!

File: st rasputin and tsarevich.jpg (7.8 KB)

7.8 KB JPG

>>42196601
Daily reminder: God ordains autorcracy and not contracts with the people. A legitimate monarch is the living icon of Christ the King on earth. His authority comes directly from Heaven, not from any "social contract," not from the Duma or parliment, not from the "will of the people.
A constitution is nothing less than an attempt to limit God’s Anointed with the scribblings of fallen men. Participating in elections means you accept the blasphemous lie that sovereignty resides in the people, not in God. The "will of the people" is the will of the fallen, plebian, sinful mob
But as the enlightened among you know, St. John of Kronstadt already warned that democracy is the path to Antichrist.

>>42209813
Btw even "participating to minimize harm" is a slippery slope. One compromise leads to another. Today you vote "conservative"; tomorrow the system forces you to accept liberal laws because "the majority willed it." No. The Monarch's will, aligned with God’s Law, is the only true law. Everything else is antichristian legalism

File: black hundreds.jpg (264.2 KB)

264.2 KB JPG

>Who, making prayer, honours the people and the Tsar, in whom neither conscience nor mind staggers, who saves Russia from troubles under a hail of slander, he is called the Black Hundred! For Faith, Tsar and Fatherland! Orthodoxy! Autocracy! Nationality!

KRISTUS NOUSI KUOLLEISTA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbXq8jnFK08

Thou shall not evils
>This must be Demiurge
I said thou shall not evils
>A-ha! Demiurge
Lmao

>>42214139
ITT: Look at these retards ov satane "going against the gnostics" by practicing an evil that Jesus (the healer) does not tolerate. I guess you were kicked from paradise because you wanted goodness.

Gl, hf.
Btw, I did practice the actual Christian religion that isn't a larp, Jesus appears in visions and teaches you, and he desires goodness and heals.

Sure is Demiurge.

>What are you talking about
About your super sekrit plans

>>42214170
More news, since it's time you know: we practice demonic gnosticism, not white light gnosticism.
It's irrelevant however since you seem to love Jesus very strongly while simultaneously believing He's an evil dimerge that will reincarnate me but take you to a Heaven, and while you're at it, you also want the rewards of the Dark Messiah of the gnostics.
What in Hell is wrong inside your skull lmao.

Ps. There's a Hell, I got condemned and foorgiven, Demiurges don't do that, they reincaarn.
Ps2. We are demons ourselves, so your retarded plan to make me birth Jesus and he not be a demon is moot.

Jesus came to save us from the demon Yahweh. Christ is King.

File: dion_fortune's_avalon.jpg (337.6 KB)

337.6 KB JPG

https://davidmetcalfe.wordpress.com/2018/11/05/deo-non-fortuna-dion-fortune-psychic-warfare-and-the-magical-battle-of-britain/

https://pansophers.com/creation-myths-of-martinism/

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/eADJ8xykxIM

bump

>>42196601
Some wonderful excerpgs from Oetinger:
https://via-hygeia.art/a-little-friedrich-christoph-oetinger-sampler-part-1-princess-antonias-teaching-tablets-in-bad-teinach/
While the Valentinians believed the Pleroma of Saint Paul to be Aeons, for Oetinger the Pleroma is the Decad and the Kabbalistic Tree, the first three Sephirah are "He who was, is and will be", and the lower seven are the Seven Spirits of God, Christ then is the embodiment of the Pleroma in human form

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKz_v9CTFXs

>>42196601
There is this one catholic goth girl on Instagram that I am enthralled with and I legitimately can't describe why, im never like this with any other girl i see online. Frankly i have a shameful sense of superiority over some, yet not her. She has a cute face, no outstanding curves on her body, but her interest is something i desire, shes so into the faith, and yet has some noticeable flaws in her personality, but that makes me like her even more. I dont know why im like this, I need suggestions on whats going on

>>42221361
Crush/Parasocial relationship, you saw a girl you find cute online and desire her, we don't just want women's bodies and faces, personality, dress, behavior, also affects us, that's it
I don't even know what i need to explain really, but I'll just say, I don't know who she is, she might be genuine, it might be performative for attention, either way i recommend staying away from this
>But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

>>42196601
I thought about making a thread on this question but I thought I'd ask here instead. I recently found out that King James actually had Francis Bacon help with his translation of The Bible. Bacon was well known for being able to hide messages in his writings (he was also confirmed to be gay). Was The Bible added to or altered in any way under him?

Without wanting to start a flamewar, I'm curious what denomination everyone is?

>>42222919
OP is Catholic, we've goten Protestants, Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox and even Mormons on here as well

File: RDT_20260216_1740157247281477459197733-2.jpg (128.6 KB)

128.6 KB JPG

>>42222919
I'm a Catholic lurker

File: Louis XVI.jpg (1 MB)

1 MB JPG

>>42222919
Catholicism
Actual beliefs are Ghibelline Catholicism with caesaropapist characteristics though. I believe rightful kings are the living icons of Christ and are anointed by God Himself, so laws should come purely from above.

>>42222919
Presbyterian - PCUSA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njGINmpaHSI

Hey I don’t know if this is the right place to ask but just wondering if anyone knows of any denominations or types of churches out there that have these qualities:
1. Younger demographics (not all old people)
2. Family oriented with good community
3. Doesn’t teach a bunch of fag shit

I’m not super religious but I’ve been on /x/ a long time and do want some kind of spiritual community for my family. My wife and I are having a baby soon and so we’ve been trying several churches but good lord they are just so LAME. Lame because they’re either full of old people or teach gay ass evangelical, Jew loving or liberal bullshit, often all of the above.

Should we try Catholicism? Aren’t Catholics largely democrat voters? Maybe they’re like 90s democrats so not insane fag lovers? My ideal church would be a 30 minute service followed by a potluck and them hanging out and doing cool stuff with the friends I make there. And ideally the people wouldn’t be lame and actually have a little personality unlike the majority of Christians I know.

File: image_search_1775726386253.jpg (98.4 KB)

98.4 KB JPG

>>42225765
If you want to try Catholicism, try attending a Latin Mass.
These are very conservative and faithful, but you will have to deal with the fact that the entire Mass is in Latin.

https://www.theosthinktank.co.uk/in-the-news/2026/03/30/why-genz-turned-back-to-christianity

>>42222919
Catholic lurker and sad degenerate as well, trying to change and was going good for a while

Any fun works of fiction worth reading for /ceg/ purpose?

>>42222919
I'm a protestant, broadly baptist. I'm discerning Catholicism because I'm considering joining an order though it's unlikely. I don't exactly have my life together and I'm almost at the age limit and I'd probably have to keep a few of my views secret.
Sorry, /blog

>>42222919
Eastern Orthodox

>he claims to like esoteric christianity
>he isn't a pentecostal
what are you doing, anon?

>>42230864
http://www.wittenberg2017.us/uploads/3/0/1/6/30164961/a_short_tale_of_the_anti-christ_-_by_vladimir_soloviev.pdf

File: IMG_20260323_175406_940.jpg (102.3 KB)

102.3 KB JPG

>>42231066
Elaborate. Now.

>>42231066
>the real esoteric christianity are the friends we make along the way

>>42231066
Elaborate

File: 1616872272771.jpg (1.2 MB)

1.2 MB JPG

I've been studying neoplatonism for years now. I've studied islamic neoplatonism and catholic scholasticism. Now I'm starting to take a look at neoplatonism in Eastern Orthodox Christianity.
Is it fair to say that neoplatonic philosophy is deeply integrated into Orthodoxy because the church fathers lived in a period and place dominated by Greek philosophy?
But of course Orthodox Christians don't openly call themselves neoplatonists, not that 99% of "religious" people know anything about their faith anyway.
In any case, I'm looking for resources, guidance, and past experiences from anons who have sought the same answers.

>>42232400
Eastern Orthodoxy is as Neoplatonic as Catholicism and so is inseparable from the religion, yes usually it's not known and mostly forgotten, but Christianity has a double origin in Philosophy and Prophecy
In reality Pagan Neoplatonism is also incredibly Christian, besides much of Middle Platonism being Jewish (Philo) and Christian, much of the developments are reactions against Christianity
What would you like to know?
For a reading list:
>Plotinus-Porphyry related
Origen of Alexandria (also look into Origenism)
Gregory of Nyssa (Jean Danielou has a good book on him, Origen too)
Evagrius Ponticus
>Iamblichus-Proclus related
Dionysius the Aeropagite
John of Scythopolis (he just has some Scholias though)
Maximus the Confessor
Michael Psellos
Ioane Petritsi
>After 1200 Latin Neoplatonism came to the Byzantines, they started reading Boethius for the first time, and later they came to Italy and the traditions basically united

File: 1756844884271757.png (210.7 KB)

210.7 KB PNG

>>42232400
From what I've read (Pseudo-Dionysius, Gregory Shaw), Neoplatonic theurgy is defined as "God work," i.e., the practitioner acts as co-creator with the gods in the ritual via imitation. This basically makes the theurgist an efficient cause, alongside the gods. Man and the universe is not fallen, but divine; theurgy harmonizes the theurgist with the will of God/the gods.

Dionysian theurgy, on the other hand, is defined as the "work of God," and are confined to the sacraments within the ecclesia. Nature is fallen post-Genesis 3, Man and the universe is not divine. God divinizes Man through the sacraments.

>>42233900
Also, with Dionysian theurgy, God is the sole cause, not man.

>>42233900
The theurgist does not co-create, but is identified with the divinity, just as the priest operates in persona Christi

Imagine you're making sandwiches for a bunch of people, and whatever else you may put on them, at the top you've got your onions, then your tomatoes, and then the upper slice of bread. So the sandwiches are all made, and you start handing them out.

But, as it turns out, one person doesn't like onions, so when the get their sandwich they take the onions off. And then another person doesn't like tomatoes, so when they get their sandwich they take the tomatoes off. Sure, fine. Everyone has preferences.

But now a third person comes by, borrows a half-sandwich from each of the previously mentioned people including some of the one person's onion and the other person's tomato, and they put the onion on top of the tomato, in the reverse order that you put it on. Then they walk up to you and say, "Look at this sandwich I made without an ounce of help from you, and it's a million times better than your sandwich. Fuck you and your stupid sandwich, heretic."

This is how I feel about Christian/Neoplatonic syncretism. Thank you for your attention and goodnight, anons.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZpncNjvNCU

>>42232400
>doesn't capitalize "Catholic" or "Islamic"
>capitalizes "Orthodoxy" and etc.
the seethe is real

>>42234414
who the fuck serves onion sandwitches to guests
also why do you put the upper slice on the tomatoes, so the bread becomes soggy
heckin 80 IQ post
don't even get me stared on the dude taking discarded food (as this discussion is way beyond "it's not polite to discard food") and eating it like some gay person at an orgy licking cum off the carpet
it fills me with anger knowing that people like you, writing such disgusting things in all seriousness, exist
you should be ashamed of yourself

>>42234387
The gulf between reason and revelation is as great or small as that between the creature and the creator, depending on your point of view
>>42234414
The real fools are those who exhaust themselves arguing about whose sandwich is better or who originally put in the effort to make them, when the sandwich is intended to be eaten.

>>42234908
Perceptive. It's because I already studied catholicism, sunni, shia, and ismaili islam, and I didn't find what I was looking for (a living neoplatonic tradition).
I remain optimistic and now I'm studying something new.

>>42235098
don't worry, you are guaranteed to find something for your IQ band and preferred self-flagellation method

>>42234414
Holy based. This is more or less my perception of scholasticism and islamic neoplatonism.
It remains to be seen if Eastern Orthodoxy actually integrates and respects Greek philosophy or it's just a GIGA-COPE like Aquinas, Meister Eckhart, and others.

>>42235111
I'm just tired of the constant emphasis on a moralistic and anthropomorphic God.
I don't even accept the historicity of Christ, and I saw that was discussed by other anons earlier ITT.
Orthodoxy seems to understand/place God in the same way as the Sufis, in that he is beyond comprehension. They actually handle the transition from rationalism to God well, unlike catholics.
It's extremely unlikely I could ever "become Orthodox" because they maintain the historicity of Christ, but I'll learn about them anyway to actually see if they understand philosophy or if they just produce masses of retards like every other religion. They oppose the intellectual elitism of neoplatonism, but is their participatory religion a substitute for that? Let's see. In all other cases, including Sanatana Dharma, it isn't.

>>42234414
You are too effeminate to gain significant introspective knowledge at this point in your life.

>>42234414
>my knowledge was discovered first so your knowledge is automatically fake and stolen from me

Can you paganists ever consider that Christianity was just the final answer to every single dwelling question human kind had

>>42235613
I don't mind this take, but WHICH Christianity? Catholics suppressed pagan thought for 1200 years and then got bailed out by Arabic translations. Protestants split from the Catholics who were already scuffed.
Eastern Orthodoxy could be said to have "completed" pagan philosophical traditions, right anon?

>>42235613
You can't explain away the Mayan cross symbol and that they believed in the unified nature of all things, predating Christianity and Buddhism by thousands of years. What? Parallel thinking? The jungle dwelling truth tellers are liars and the litany of dysgenic Jews with palaces were telling the true true? Hmmm. Convenient belief to hold. Especially considering the Arabs painted the hieroglyphics in Egypt, and the indo-europeans invented Hinduism. Oh, and that Solomonic sigils are ripped from the Norse. And that all of this Abrahamic-Roman narrative stuff came about sometime between 1000 and 1600 when 90% of the Eastern lands were kept intentionally in a state of illiteracy and war. Oh and the convenient rise in Freemasonic systems across the Earth. I don't think Jesus taught Luciferianism and building babylon back a thousand times over. The peculiar thing is some truths are so primordial they can't help but slip through, despite the overwhelming odds in favor of the fictitious freemasonic historical narrative we are fed today.

>>42235648
inb4 muh scripture. muh wikipedia. youtube link with phishing append.

>>42235629
Only Catholicism the Church founded by the Apostle Peter is the correct Christianity

>>42235648
Based.
>>42235720
Based on?

>>42198252
>belief in Christianity can be justified with the resurrection
Right, but you presuppose what you should demonstrate: Christianity is true, therefore the Bible is true, therefore the resurrection happened, therefore Christianity is true. It may be internal justification, but that works for every faith.
>The resurrection is a miracle, whereas the Quran?
Again, the resurection is a miracle that you simply believe in, it does not prove anything. Also, for the Quran, look at the supposed prophecy on Rome at 30 : 2 -5. Also, Muslims believe that some verses have scientific explanations that could not have been discovered at the time (embryology or something.)

>>42234414
Impersonal conceptions of God the Father are a shit sandwich. Christianity is better off without them.

>>42236064
How do you justify God the Father being personal, moralistic, and anthropomorphic. How does it make sense to you?

>>42234414
Plato is Moses in Attic Greek
>>42235098
Ismaili are Shia
And how did you not find one when Ismailism is Neoplatonic at its core?
>>42235142
Oh you're just ragebaiting
>>42235182
Please don't spread the "Catholicism is legalistic, Orthodoxy is mystical" false dichotomy
>>42235613
They hated him because he told them the truth
>>42235629
>Catholics suppressed pagan thought for 1200 years and then got bailed out by Arabic translations
Pseudo-history, from Gaius Marius Victorinus up to the 12th century there was a Latin Christian tradition of Neoplatonism dependant on Latin texts like the Marriage of Philology and Mercury and the Commentary on the Dream of Scipio, then the works if the Jew Solomon Ibn Gabirol and the Muslim Ibn Sina got translated and they fit well with the already existing scheme, they did not even have the original texts but the Theology of Aristotle and Book of Causes, Islamicized paraphrases of the Enneads and the Elements of Theology, then from the 13th Century Greek translations came from the Byzantines to the Latins, and Latin translations into Greek from the Latins to the Byzantines
>WHICH
There's just one Christianity, the schisms caused denominations and Catholics and Orthodox are incredibly close when it comes to their thought
Compare it to Islam where their schism happened in their 1st Century, and the denominations are basically different religions at this point

>>42235956
>>42235956
No, I'll go slowly because i notice many struggle with this
The Resurrection is a miracle, a miracle by definition is the least likely thing that can happen
If one follows the methods of secular history, one cannot prove the Resurrection as any other explanation is more probably than it by definition
They asked Richard Dawkins once if he'd believe in God if he saw the stars in the sky move into a formation which he'd read as "Richard Dawkins, this is God, believe in me"
He said no he still wouldn't believe, why? Because it could aslo just be aliens playing tricks on him, he could be hallucinating
Every explanation, no matter how dumb it is, is more probable than a miracle
History works on probability, we focus on what most likely happened with what we know, a miracle, the most improbable thing by definition, is disregarded by definition
We can find a usb stick from 33AD, put it in a modern computer and find a video of the resurrection on it
Jesus can show up right now where I am and where you are
Jesus can show up simultaneously to every single person on earth right now
What's more probably? That that actually happened? Or that we all just hallucinated at the same time?
The latter, because the latter has a natural explanation whereas the former has a supernatural explanation
The system we created is rigged against the supernatural

>>42236294
That's why Christianity, the resurrection is a belief, you choose to believe it, it cannot be proven, and you choose based on if it's reasonable, not probable
The vast majority of scholars believe that Jesus existed and died on the cross, they all alao believe that the early followers of the Jesus movement saw something that caused them to believe that he was risen, as i explained previously, they cannot say that the resurrection happened, so it's your choice
Personally, to me the history only works with the resurrection, there is no better explanation, feel free to debate me otherwise, and if Jesus rose, then Christianity is true
Whereas for Islam, there is nothing like this, the Quran is just a book, there is nothing miraculous about it, you can choose to believe, but there is no reason to, with that logic i can believe in whatever I want
>30 : 2 -5
The romans will lose then they win soon, that's the prophecy...
The Roman-Persian war lasted around 700 years, its the longest war in history, saying one party will lose a battle then win another, is like me being a prophet because I wrote that there will be conflict in the Middle East in the near future
Oswald Spengler in the early 20th Century wrote that the Soviet Union will collapse in 1990, is he a Prophet?
>Also, Muslims believe that some verses have scientific explanations that could not have been discovered at the time
Lies, the Quran has Galenic medicine in it, it claims in Surah 86, ayat 6-7 that semen is formed between the backbone and the ribcage, a scientific inaccuracy

>>42222919
Theozoology

>>42236252
I said "LIVING neoplatonic tradition". Ismailis of today have nothing to do with neoplatonism, most of their population prays using Gujurati hymns that have a completely inverted description of God. They don't read or understand the Falasafia. The IIS sometimes discusses islamic neoplatonism but it's solely an academic endeavor and in practice they abandoned it long ago.
Greek translations did come after the arabic ones, that is true, but before the arabic ones they had very limited access to Greek philosophical texts, you must admit.
With islam, even within one sect, you will have people that believe God is physically present in the material universe and hell is a physical place, and those that believe God is transcendent and our immortal soul "attains" heaven or hell. Those might as well be separate religions even if they're both sunni. Also, nondualists have more in common with nondualists from other religions than dualists in their own. So I don't think it's reasonable to say there is ONE Christianity when their views of theology differ so drastically, especially when you include protestants. Finally, I'm concerned about a LIVING tradition that I can actually participate in. Catholicism today is so watered down. Even Aquinas is mostly discussed by autistic zoomers digging for meaning. Catholics do not have an adequate understanding of the historical events that shaped early christianity or of greek philosophy, and it's ridiculous when they try to discuss God and philosophy from inside their little box. There are a dozen religions that used to be rich with philosophy in the past, that's not the point, I am looking for a real live one today.

>>42236464
I find it kind of funny how a lot of Soviet science fiction directly or indirectly play into theozoological concepts, almost like artists & scientists outsmarting their religious leaders during the Islamic Golden Ages.
Of course today we know that it was without effect, much like the resistance against the Vietnam War that happened in the USA, but at least it was tried.

>>42236298
These "scholars" you speak of are specifically biblical scholars. The historicity of christ is wholly improbable if you actually study the period not because of a lack of evidence, but because of detailed accounts of how mystery religions in Rome intermingled and developed. Christianity is an amalgamation of the Cult of Isis, Mithraism, and a non-historical proto-christianity. By non-historical I mean they didn't have historicized dates for the life of Christ. All that doesn't mean that christianity isn't the best option today as a religion and a culmination of philosophy. But that's what we're here to discuss. Also I denounce the Talmud, in case you question my motives.

Just to be clear, hesychasm isn't esoteric. It's a mainstream practice in Orthodoxy. There's nothing esoteric about it, it's completely heterodox doctrine widely practiced among the majority of the laiety. It's about as esoteric as meditating on the Mysteries during the Rosary.

>>42236751
>heterodox
Orthodox, in the regular sense, I beg your pardon. I don't know why I said heterodox.

>>42236294
The resurrection is a historical fact. The gospels are historical documents like any other and no contemporaneous writer contradicts them. Historians do not normally consider the texts they study with prejudice to the religious beliefs of their authors, but they sometimes make exceptions based on their own personal feelings, which they ought rather to set aside. Such is the case here, but it is far from the only example.
>>42236298
Religious apologists who appeal to "scientific" explanations thereby subordinate the spiritual to the material. Such arguments do not manifest religious faith but a false religiosity. God works miracles to confirm the authority of his prophets, not to demonstrate the truths of the faith, which are indemonstrable by nature. Miracles are not the only signs by which God does this though, as for instance, he manifests his judgments of Israel through their military victories and defeats. For every Christian apologist who prefers Christianity because of its miracles there is a Muslim who says that Islam ought to be believed on the strength of its conquests. Both are talking nonsense; the Spirit breatheth where he will.

>>42236751
This is literally just mantra meditation. Hare Krishna.

>>42236787
>The gospels are historical documents like any other and no contemporaneous writer contradicts them.
Well I'll be damned, I guess Harry Potter is real because I haven't heard a single historian contradict it.

>>42236723
It's ridiculous that you think "an adequate understanding" of history or philosophy has anything to do with spiritual qualifications or the integrity of a given sacred tradition. These are profane studies. Catholicism today is extremely watered down indeed, but not for a lack of scholarship or philosophy, more accurately an excess of it.
>>42236749
The Mysteries are one thing and religion another. The latter requires some kind of historical basis as its whole domain is limited to the human state. This does not mean that the Mysteries, which transmit properly spiritual doctrines, cannot be superimposed on religious faith or on actual historical events that must, as a matter of metaphysical principle, always manifest and reflect the supra-historical truths of the Mysteries anyway.
>>42236818
Exactly like mantra meditation, and there is a distinction between mantra japa as a devotional practice, which is analogous to mainstream "hesychasm," and mantra diksha given when a formal guru-disciple relationship is formed, corresponding to the proper hesychasm practiced on Mount Athos.

>>42236840
An adequate understanding of the history of THEIR OWN religion is too much to ask? If Christians knew more about the history of their own faith then churches would be forced to return to tradition in many cases.
Something I like about Christianity is that they're open to people being spiritual through participatory methods and not just through the logos or rational intellectualism. Platonism is very elitist in that regard. Eastern Orthodoxy does not discourage academic commitment to philosophy and history, it just doesn't demand it either. What I am looking to uncover is whether the exoteric practices actually align with the esoteric/academic.
In my exposure to Sanatana Dharma, Catholicism, and Islam, there is no alignment between the two. The normalfags believe God is your best pal and you can call on him any time and he'll show up to help you out. He's personal, anthro, and if you can understand your parents then you're basically an expert on God, because he's just some guy. Meanwhile the esoteric autists view God, The One, as something beyond comprehension that indirectly emanates our material reality which we can transcend by purifying ourselves to return to the source. The chasm between the two is ridiculous, and that's without even getting into discussions on free will.

>>42236787
>the resurrection is a "historical fact"
So materialist reductionism

>those pesky scientistic Christians
>tu quoque

If the resurrection were historical it would be disenchanted and thus no resurrection

>>42236910
>An adequate understanding of the history of THEIR OWN religion is too much to ask? If Christians knew more about the history of their own faith then churches would be forced to return to tradition in many cases.
It's enough to ask Christians to understand the faith. History and philosophy cannot substitute for this, and where faith is lacking in the first place, their study only results in an explosion of divergent opinions.
Academic study might seem esoteric in comparison to the religion of the common man because it is relatively inaccessible. But there is another level of understanding that is easier for an illiterate person to approach. Sophisticated minds require sophisticated doctrines to satisfy their desires, but a simpleton has no need of them. When he is spiritually ripe, he will have less trash to burn. This is discussed in the Book of Privy Counselling, but the hesychasts also talk about it, as also the neoplatonists viz. "negative theology."
>>42236927
Materialism is an opinion, and "enchantment" has no importance, except that the materialist may feel a certain nostalgia for it.

>>42198252
I love how you always conveniently ignore that you riff your entire schtick from Mayan and Norse religions

>>42236958
I like that you basically said exoteric christianity is on the same intellectual level as illiteracy.
I'll grant that we can downplay the importance of history a little but philosophy is an intrinsic part of esoteric religion.
Studying philosophy does lead to an explosion of divergent opinions, and Christianity should take that challenge head-on. It's almost like having a philosophical framework integrated into your religion is necessary to stop any random guy from picking it apart. I also don't believe that a rational belief in God and a faith-based belief in God are mutually exclusive.
My stance is that "I want to believe," and I'd be totally willing to accept that Christ is mythical/allegorical, because I seem to gel with everything past that point.

>>42237071
>I like that you basically said exoteric christianity is on the same intellectual level as illiteracy.
Literate people tend to be very smug about it, but this is its own kind of ignorance.
>I'll grant that we can downplay the importance of history a little but philosophy is an intrinsic part of esoteric religion.
Philosophy is "ancilla theologiae" in more than one way. Exoterically theological conclusions follow from philosophical ones, but in the domain of esoterism, the spiritual doctrines, in whatever form the master proposes them, are proportioned to the student for the purpose of guiding him beyond them. They are not an intrinsic part at all, only a didactic means, and even in the most dry and univocal discourse their import is chiefly symbolic.
There can be no conflict between faith and reason if they come from the same source. As for the many divergent opinions on this or that matter, why should I, as a Christian, care what other people think, or seek credit for correcting them, when only God can grant faith to a soul? It is only a rationalistic prejudice that teaching is a matter of dazzling someone with your intelligence or eloquence. The literal sense of the faith is absolutely indispensable, and the rest follows from it; so if that is your only hang up, simply ask yourself why you then find everything else agreeable. It may be that your own preferences are founded on nothing.

>>42236723
Mate you're asking for an entire population to be well versed in philosophy, that never has, does, or will exist
Just so you know most pagans believed their gods were people in the sky with superpowers, but a Platonic tradition existed within it that was not like that, and today the intellectual class of religions tend to also not believe in what the common folk believes
>but before the arabic ones they had very limited access to Greek philosophical texts, you must admit.
Also just so you know they never translated them from Greek, Muslims got Arabic translations from Syriac Christians
And during Late Antiquity there was still knowledge of Greek, as that declined and Latin became more rich when it comes to philosophy, the tradition became only dependant on Latin works and translations
>So I don't think it's reasonable to say there is ONE Christianity when their views of theology differ so drastically, especially when you include protestants
Catholic and Orthodox only differ when it comes to the Pope and the Fillioque, yes with Protestants it becomes more heterogenous, but most are still Nicene
Again, what you are looking for exists, but you seem to complain about the common person not having very sophisticated beliefs, you will never find a living tradition if that's an obstacle for you
>>42236749
How is it an amalgamation of the Cult of Isis and Mithraism?
>>42236751
The Sacraments are also esoteric and all Christians are or will be baptized
Esoteric =/= secret, hidden or reserved for an arbitrary elite

>>42237161
>>42236787
>The resurrection is a historical fact.
Is the scholarly consensus that Jesus actually rose from the dead?
Miracles are supernatural events that can be used for justified beliefs, natural events aren't
Islam can't be true because they conquered people, if that were the case we should all comvert to Tengrism because of the Mongols
>>42236840
Catholicism needs a second Saint Francis
>>42236910
Yes better understanding of Christianity by the majority would be a dream come true, sadly today we live in a Secular, very Anti-Christian world
>God is your best pal
>God, The One, as something beyond comprehension
The beauty of Christianity is that Jesus is both

>>42234924
>like some gay person at an orgy licking cum off the carpet
>it fills me with anger knowing that people like you, writing such disgusting things in all seriousness, exist
Is this some kind of meta-humor?

>>42237167
>Is the scholarly consensus that Jesus actually rose from the dead?
Are we talking about currently living scholars, scholars who have written since the 19th century, or scholars who have written since the time of Christ?
Is it the case that what is the more fashionable view among academics at a later time is always based solely on better scholarship and therefore closer to the truth?

>>42237200
Today
>Is it the case that what is the more fashionable view among academics at a later time is always based solely on better scholarship and therefore closer to the truth?
Most of the time, yes
All the garbage biblical studies we struggle with even today come from the 19th Century like Q-source and JEPD, and in the case of Western Esotericism, most early scholarship is so bad A.E Waite wrote better studies and he was a Golden Dawn member

So let me get this straight. The Epistles of Paul are cited as proof of the historicity of Christ, but Paul never met Jesus before his death. OK.
>>42237153
I don't believe God would "grant" faith to a soul. Granting is human act, a material act. It is so far beneath God.
>>42237161
Yeah that's exactly why I said neoplatonism is elitist. Also I believe the disagreement between Catholics and Orthodox is a bit deeper, because Catholics believe you can understand but not conceptualize God, as opposed to not understand or conceptualize him. Also Catholics don't agree that God is essence and energy. They lack understanding of the neoplatonic model of emanated reality, even with scholasticism. I'm hoping that the "unsophisticated" beliefs in eastern Orthodoxy will align with the sophisticated ones, if that makes sense.
Regarding the amalgamation comment, it's first important to understand that a lot of people were members of multiple mystery cults, so the mixture of concepts happened organically without academic oversight. There are many things to consider, the symbol of the mother and child in the Cult of Isis, the personal God of Mithraism, belief in resurrection, universalism. And keep in mind that Christianity also influenced the other mystery cults. People try to say that disproves the amalgamation, but it actually proves there was mixing. They all mixed together and influenced one another.
>>42237167
I need to understand more about Orthodoxy to reply regarding the duality of jesus and the trinity.

>>42237039
>no retort for this
kek

>>42237222
In that case, what counts as scholarly consensus, since it is bound for the most part to change for the better someday, cannot be considered the same as historical fact, but rather a conventional opinion that is subject to future scientific revolutions, which are inevitable. What then even is a fact, except that which is current? And what is a miracle except that which is not yet explained? On this basis, I see no reason why religion ought not also to evolve with the times. Islam is better than Christianity because it came later, and Baha'i is better still. Best of all is Scientology.

>>42237237
>I don't believe God would "grant" faith to a soul. Granting is human act, a material act. It is so far beneath God.
God grants faith to the soul in the same way that the sun grants light to the moon and reality grants knowledge to the mind, simply by being as he is.

>>42237237
>They lack understanding of the neoplatonic model of emanated reality, even with scholasticism
John Scotus Eriugena
The school of Chartres
Saint Bonaventure
The Albertists
Nicholas of Cusa
Marsilio Ficino
Francesco Giorgi
Read them
>>42237250
The Mayans stole it from the Chinese, and the Norse from the Inca
>>42237286
>In that case, what counts as scholarly consensus, since it is bound for the most part to change for the better someday, cannot be considered the same as historical fact, but rather a conventional opinion that is subject to future scientific revolutions, which are inevitable.
Yes those are the limits of all science
>And what is a miracle except that which is not yet explained?
And that's the god of the gaps
>On this basis, I see no reason why religion ought not also to evolve with the times.
Religion is dependant on what is above science

>>42237369
>And that's the god of the gaps
Which is just naturalism. You can say that you choose to believe in the resurrection, but as soon as the scholarly consensus were to turn the other way, and the textbooks repeated that although the science was not yet clear, the evidence indicates that the resurrection certainly happened, then it turns from a "belief" into a "fact" and therefore no longer a "miracle." This will probably happen in your own lifetime, by the way.
Religion is certainly dependent on what is above science. So are facts.

File: theozoology.jpg (17.6 KB)

17.6 KB JPG

>>42236745
Are you sure?
>In 1903–04, a Viennese ex-Cistercian monk and inventor named Jörg Lanz-Liebenfels (subsequently, Jörg Lanz von Liebenfels) published a lengthy article under the Latin title "Anthropozoon Biblicum" ("The Biblical Man-Animal") in a journal for Biblical studies edited by Moritz Altschüler, a Jewish admirer of Guido von List. The author undertook a comparative survey of ancient Near Eastern cultures, in which he detected evidence from iconography and literature that seemed to point to the continued survival, into early historical times, of hominid ape-men similar to the Neanderthal men known from fossil remains in Europe, or the Pithecanthropus (now called Homo erectus) from Java.[42] Furthermore, Lanz systematically analysed the Old Testament in the light of his hypothesis, identifying and interpreting coded references to the ape-men that substantiated an illicit practice of interbreeding between humans and "lower" species in antiquity.

Why does wikipedia refer to the Christ Myth Theory as a "fringe conspiracy theory" but then the article about research into historical Jesus admits the primary source is the Gospels, and non-Christian sources only mention Christ in passing a couple times after the fact, and it's always very generalized, nothing that would amount to specific dates or "proof?" And then there's Josephus which is a known forgery. It's the religious equivalent of "the science is settled." This is not work done by real historians. Also if you search "historicity of christ" on any platform it quickly tells you that "scholars overwhelmingly agree," without mentioning that these same scholars take Jesus appearing to Paul after his death as FACT. It's very exhausting and retarded, it reminds me of the big lie (holocaust).
Why can't Christians just admit Christ was a mythological figure who was later historicized? That doesn't stop you from believing in God. And don't forget all the other Gospels that didn't make the cut but had the same level of authenticity.
>>42237369
Eriugena is pre-schism and heavily favored the Greek Church Fathers. The rest, I don't know. Are they overt neoplatonists?
>>42237410
On what grounds can you say the resurrection historically happened when the there are no first-hand accounts? Something written anonymously in 100 different copies three or more decades later is not first-hand. Come on now. Why does it have to be real? It's like when Indians start talking about Krishna actually being on the Earth. What's perhaps more concerning is that there are no writings attributed to Jesus. So much text survives from the period and nothing written by Christ himself. I'm supposed to believe he didn't want to leave writings behind to prevent idolatry but then people are saving foreskins, bones, and all sorts of other memorabilia and that's OK? I denounce the Talmud.

>>42237449
In ancient history it's rare to have a firsthand account. The historicity of Troy and Jericho were also denied by scholarship until their ruins were discovered. Now they are suddenly historical events and the secondary sources on them are suddenly historical documents. Scholars love to shift the goal posts and some might even say that this is all they ever do. Even when there is a firsthand account for something, that doesn't prevent a scholar from claiming pseudepigraphy or something, and the consensus will change according to academic politics, which I can tell you firsthand (but feel free to cast doubt on it anyway!) are unbelievably petty and unprincipled.
>no writings attributed to Jesus
None to Socrates either, etc. etc.
At the end of the day all this disputation only boils down to "I like this and don't like that" and there is no real reason why, because we aren't intelligent and we aren't honest.

>>42237449
>The rest, I don't know. Are they overt neoplatonists?
Yes

Hey there Jesus people. I need to learn Jesus stuff. I don't mean to piss you off but I'm probably going to. I pre-emptively apologize.

File: 1775935109261990.png (2 MB)

2 MB PNG

>>42197817
>Anyone else here the ascribes to the mystic mythicist view of the Bible?
Yes friendo. Genesis in particular is a powerful mandala/map that explains numerous aspects of the way the cosmos works in narrative, mythic form. The fall of adam/eve is recapitulated in every human life as they fall from newborn unitive innocence into discriminative judgmentalness and separation. Adam (god) creates a lover for himself Eve (goddess) out of his own substance, meaning the apparent two are never separate but of are the same substance and therefore eternally unified, which can apprehended through consistent mystical practice. Which means that creation and creator (whom is obscured by creation [Plato's cave!]), are eternally the same and that through the crucible of lived experience the created returns itself to the creator (itself uncreated).

I'll stop here. God bless.

>>42239669
Yes. I've discovered an interesting parallel between 2 Kings 4:18-37 and Genesis 22:1-19. It seems like both narratives share the same skeletal framework: child dies and gets resurrected by God. Isaac was really sacrificed by Abraham on Mount Moriah, and he was resurrected.

>>42239686
>>42239669
I forgot to also include the interesting detail that in both stories, God (the three men with Abram and Sarai in Genesis, Elisha in 2 Kings) tells the woman that she will bear a child in a year's time.

>>42236121
>anthropomorphic
A personal God is not a projection of human traits onto the divine. Instead, human traits reflect something derived from the divine. Therefore, the direction of resemblance is reversed: we resemble God, not the other way around.

I reject the modern anthropological assumption that God is just a human psychological projection. Personhood is a derivative property. Human form (physical and metaphysical) is patterned after a higher archetype.

The divine is real, personal, and ontologically prior. God is just not just a big mind, a "cosmic field", or an abstract principle, though he includes those lower conceptions of divinity within Himself.

The structure of reality is patterned from above, not projected from below. God is not like us; we are like God. But God is not an abstraction; God is the source of form, personhood, and intelligibility.

>>42240056
God is not just a man. I will say this one time that my Father is a fractal being. God is, not God is in the shape. God has no shape, because All is His shape. You are all constantly lying to yourselves. Think twice and do not reply to me. The same goes for your "opposite" in this argument. You are both in need of thought and consideration of the certainty of increasingly complex patterns.

>>42240203
I was raised with this kind of garbage.

>>42236121
>moralistic
God is relational. Not moralistic. Fuck Moses. Fuck Yahweh. Fuck the Deuteronomists. The Father that Jesus came to reveal is El Elyon. Christ is the new, or greater, Melchizedek.

>>42240603
how did archons get btfo this time

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfS8BECbTyE

>>42236298
Come on, you're being dishonest.
>The romans will lose then they win soon, that's the prophecy..
This is false: the verses were supposedly revealed after a a persian victory and it prophecises their defeat. It's not just "that will happen", because the word used for "a few years" means in arabic up to 9, which apparently fit within Heraclius' reign. Even Gibbon said that it was a surprisingly accurate move from Muhammad.
>Lies, the Quran has Galenic medicine in it
Please actually check out the rest, which muslmis believe to be true to this day. It's not unusal for a sacred text to contain scientific innacuricies when they do not matter (earth being at the center for example), but the Quran is believed to ALSO contain actual accuracies.
Please, you're being really dishonest; and your original question was about the very existence of reasons to believe in the Quran. Funny how you don't mention anymore and instead now attack the reasons you said didn't exist.

>>42244401
>Even Gibbon said that it was a surprisingly accurate move from Muhammad.
Again, Spengler predicted the fall of the Soviet Union and gave the exact date of 1990
I can do the same as Muhammad, within the next few years, I predict that Ukraine will win a battle against Russia!
>Please actually check out the rest
Don't worry, I already know them all by heart, did you know that Allah made everything from water? Did you know that when Alexander the Great went west he found the place where the sun sets in a muddy pool and found people living there?
>and your original question was about the very existence of reasons to believe in the Quran. Funny how you don't mention anymore and instead now attack the reasons you said didn't exist.
I'm just saying that predictions concerning a 700 year old war and scientific inaccuracies claimed to be accuracies aren't valid reasons
The same goes for Christianity, there are dozens of books on the scientific accuracy of Genesis, and none make me believe, same goes for future predictions, usually scholars explain that as the books being written later than when the prophecies took place
I am just upset that I'll never find some sort of steelman position for Islam, I've been trying to create it myself but it's rather difficult

Bump

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/6ZU20JFtWCA

>>42247446
>>42247451
>>42247457
This form of propaganda is made possible for the opposite of the stated reason: neither the public nor Father Gary Thomas, who was likely appointed for political reasons himself, really believe in the devil. They only accept his existence as a metaphor for ideological opposition, whereas the devil himself wants your soul, not your mind, and will influence you to love anything at all, even a theory that denounces him, more than God.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-IW9UpH7rI

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/theglobalcatholicreview/2018/10/the-exorcist-vs-witches-battling-for-the-soul-of-justice-brett-kavanaugh/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYIUjavwqVo

File: joseph_green.jpg (412.6 KB)

412.6 KB JPG

>>42247695
https://podcastaddict.com/subliminal-jihad/episode/183976890

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/AAjAcX-6RGg
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/DfihsBcAoTo

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/A9L48zCb2e4

File: mariavites_etc.jpg (875.9 KB)

875.9 KB JPG

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETK94FAAt_8

>>42240598
Jesus identified himself as Yahweh
"Where Abraham was, I am"
That's why the Pharisees wanted to stone him

>>42240598
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7j4oektx3SY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCGS63LePVw

>>42250168
He's kind of right to associate with Malchizidek because Joshua (Yeshua) takes a jab at Abraham's inferior form of being and Malchizidek is a non-Abrahamic priest.

Isn't the whole basis of Christianity that God passively hates Jews for being materialists who reject his heavenly kingdom and they must accept Jesus else they are eternally damned? And that the new testament replaced the covenant of the old testament precisely because jews are materialists?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTCApptenLI

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/MUbG_yEW25w

bump

can y’all explain some things for me?
namely how Jesus dying on the cross clears our sins? what does it mean to have faith in Jesus?

Also what is the Christian mystic’s take on the problem of evil?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nTlSxcitTQ

Mercy to the cruel is cruelty to the innocent.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/dpBTh8-Oxfk
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/sXKU0YJnAwo
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/THM83WtCWX0

File: nine eleven twenty twenty four yes taylor swift actually owes me money for the shit i copywrited in my notes did you think this was a game bitch.jpg (52.7 KB)

52.7 KB JPG

>>42254374
AMEN ASÉ AHO