I also wanted to ask (but not put in OP) why anime/manga is able to have synergy and not comics/cartoons. What is it about their business model that allows for it? Is it something about unions or executive heads? Is it because of contract issues? Does something like DC Comics and DC Animation not able to share the same resources for some reason?

I want to know on a business/production level why this happens.

>>152635951
because when the cartoons and comics do a lot of synergy fanboys get really mad

Like the peak of the MCU when there was the Avengers Assemble and GotG cartoons that had the movie casts and told stories inspired by the movies and comics, and the comics also changed their casts and tone to fit in

>>152635964
Ask yourself this, at the peak of The Walking Dead's popularity can you seriously imagine AMC adapting Invincible into animation?

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>>152635978
But that would be an instance where everything tried to have synergy with the last possible adaptation and therefore the most "basterdized" version (in the eyes of fans of some comics).

So the comics are still doing their own thing while cartoons and live-action movies are just using them as a foundation and making big chances along the way.

>>152636005
Not AMC but some company would with capeshit getting popular in movies

>>152636005
With Amazon doing The Boys and all the changes its made, I'm genuinely surprised Invincible is even animated. I didn't even think they had a 2D pipeline to outsource to, and now seeing how poorly production is going with later seasons, I can't imagine them wanting to do 2D ever again.

Anecdotal note, my nephew is super into Invincible and got the comics because of it, so I feel like that's a successful advertisement (Not that adaptations exist purely for advertising, but it should help).

>>152635951
A lot of the things that happen in comics don't make sense; made sense for the time it was published but doesn't hold up now or wouldn't be considered appropriate for the audience the cartoon is aiming for. So, the adaption has to change things.
>>152635964
Anime and manga don't always have synergy, though there's been more focus on synergy in recent years.

An argument could be made that some of the anime that went and did their own thing instead of following the manga had better endings than the series they were based on, but that's a discussion for /a/.

>>152635964
I think there are two main reasons:

First, western comicboon adaptations have always been loose adaptations and that has carried over to the modern day. Remember Joker killing Batman's parents in Batman 1989?

The second one is that a lot of these cartoons are made for kids. This is, for instance, why the Teen Titans animated series is so different from the 1980s New Teen Titans comics. They realized an adaptation of the latter wouldn't appeal to kids.

>>152635964
Anime literally, LITERALLY exists as commercial for the book. You can look at popular shounen anime but there are COUNTLESS anime that exist on a massive cliffhanger or unresolved plot in order to push the source material. It's especially bad with light novel adaptations.

>>152636085
>Remember Joker killing Batman's parents in Batman 1989?

That reminds me how Steven King fucking hated Kubricks The Shining for some reason. And Lawnmower man. Maybe it has something to do with Hollywood adaptations in general. No one really expects things to be 1:1

If you enjoyed the original Teen Titans cartoon and wanted to jump into the comics these are your options
>40+ year old NTT stories where everyone is drawn like adults
>random Titans stories that feature different characters with only some from the cartoon cast being in it where half are adults and the other half are teens
>A failed Earth One Teen Titans series where Robin isn't even in it
>stylized Kami Garcia and Gabriel Picolo OGNs focusing on the cartoon cast (and Damian Wayne for some reason) but more about romance than superheroes
That is so awful. The original cartoon was early on the anime/manga style too. How is there no modern series with them as teens that takes inspiration from manga? It feels like it would be an easy sell.

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>>152636141
I feel like in the latest run DC actually realized the Titans in the comics actually had to resemble the Titans in the cartoon. Like, sure Wally and Donna are still there but at least it's the same line-up.

But DC is dumb, so of course they are undoing this line-up in favour of a "New Titans" with failed characters they want to push like Job Kent, Yara Flor and Stephanie Brown, while they are pushing a new Teen Titans with literally who OCs. DC and their writers really don't understand it's not a good idea to keep diluting the Titans brand.

>>152635951
in japan they do a nonsensical retarded pointless thing where every adaptation is a strict retelling of the exact same story with minor nuanced differences, the intention is trying to present the exact same thing.... in a new medium. And the fans are so autistic they actually like this and prefer it. So a lot of the times they make these awkward adaptations that are an entire season or arc compressed in a short period of time and it doesnt click for them this is pointlless and stupid they just assume it must be recreated. Whereas these cartoons see the ideas of the original as a baseline from which to create something new out of artistic expression. If you want to read the real orginal Teen Titans then you can go read it, its preserved, the cartoon is a wester anime mimic focused on style and comedy with mostly isolated stories per episode. Its not the soap opera of the comic storyline. It would not have succeeded with a mass audience if it was a strict recreation of the comic. For example theres like 20 Dc animated movies that are direct adaptive recreations of new 52 storylines and they are boring generic crap no one even thinks about.

>>152636043
The Boys season 2 is literally 90% hiding out in their bunker and talking. They wait till the last 2 epsidoes to do superhero action. Cant do that with Invincible it has to be animated because of all the main characters with powers.

>>152635951
Them lacking synergy is a good thing, imagine if we had double fucking forced MCU-styled synergy but for animation too where something like teen titans 2003 cant exist because it goes against the ugly ass designs (not all of them are ugly but alot of them are) of the original comic

Leave this kinda of shit to comics that are guaranteed to end so its easier to justify no changes

>>152636214
Nice coat.

>>152636240
thank you I appreciate it

>>152636239
Infact most of the best animation based on superheroes in the last idk 30 years has been very loosely based on actual comics, the issue is that they dont do really good cartoons based on comic characters anymore aside not necessarily that the model doesnt work

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>>152635951
>Why does the animation and comic industry lack so much synergy? Animated adaptations are so different they're basically new things that attract audiences who don't care for the comics because "I think the cartoon is better". Teen Titans is probably one of the more popular examples of this.
TV cartoon writers and producers are too impatient. Or they think the child audience is. Take Spider-Man for example. Every adaptation always wants to go immediately to Spidey fighting Venom and Carnage without making the audience deserve it by making them suffer through Jackal and Hobgoblin stuff first.

>>152636057
>An argument could be made that some of the anime that went and did their own thing instead of following the manga had better endings than the series they were based on
Name five examples

>>152636466
>>An argument could be made that some of the anime that went and did their own thing instead of following the manga had better endings than the series they were based on
>Name five examples
The only one I can think of is Bunny Drop not adapting lackluster second half of the manga

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>>152635951
if you haven't noticed the people who run these companies are incompetent and can't see past 5 minutes from now. They don't seem to understand synergy, demographics, target audiences, or anything you need to understand to run a successful company. They exist entirely on the strength of the IPs that built up goodwill in a different era. Sometimes they stumble into something decent but a good system with one product enhancing another is out of the question

>>152635951
>Why does the animation and comic industry lack so much synergy?
Not really sure. Kinda annoying that every new DC cartoon show has to be its own continuity

>>152635951
>Why does the animation and comic industry lack so much synergy?
Cartoon writers treat DC and Marvel characters as action figures instead of part of some bigger narrative.

>>152635951
different audience

>>152635951
Americans don’t team up

>>152636214
/co/pe

>>152635951
fuck animation

>>152636057
More synergy between manga and anime seems more a recent thing. The only example I can think of Boruto anime having female ninja that appeared in it first and then appearing in the anime.

>>152636200
I'm also convinced someone at DC really hates Cyborg in blue

>>152636239
>ugly ass designs (not all of them are ugly but alot of them are)
Which would you say are the best and worst? I'm curious.

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>>152635951
More straightforward adaption of Teen Titans means no Kino Raven

>>152637851
>>152638152
I'm not seeing why this is bad thing. They ARE their own continuity. What do you want? just your comic panels but moving?
sometimes trying something new with a concept can come up with good innovations. Look at what BTAS did for Batman the comic

>>152635951
Writers guild requirements mean they can never adapt anything 1:1

>>152638841
Not at all, the times /co/ does the same strategy it doesnt work which is evidence that its not cope to say a direct adaptation that just copies without trying anything new is always bad. Youre just mad because I specifically noted japan does it more.

>>152641237
elaborate

>>152640344
Fuck off

I don't think I want more literal adaptations. If I want to see the comic story I can read the comic and I don't see why it would be improved just because you're not reading it. Cartoons have a unique opportunity to tell their own more interesting stories that make use of it's medium. I think you should certainly match the spirit and the core of the books it's not free reign to just do ANYTHING but still

>>152635964
There's so many LN/manga adaptations that start before the source material is finisehd and don't have the popularity to become perennial so they just make uip and ending

>>152635951
Because there are 20 years of difference between the examples you are providing. Even more, there wasn't even a TT book when the cartoon was released.

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>>152641645
which is funny because the book the cartoon took most of its tone from did turn into a TT book which immediately then stripped it of said tone and tossed back on all of the melodramatic shit TT is known for

>>152636123
I dunno know why people are always saying this. Original anime isn't advertising a manga, some manga are turned into anime by somebody other than the publisher, and unresolved stories also happen when the anime didn't meet sales expectations and stopped being made or stopped being made for some other reason.

>>152636057
>>152636214
I think synergy here means just directly and quickly turning specific manga into anime instead of loosely using the same characters and plot points over decades.

>>152641645
Yeah, New Teen Titans is very 80s, which wouldn't have translated over very well.
>>152641675
>which is funny because the book the cartoon took most of its tone from did turn into a TT book
That's a myth. Teen Titans 2003 was more inspired by FLCL than Young Justice. The YJ inspiration was mainly in a version of Teen Titans pitched by Peter David that didn't get made.

Also, Sam Register was right that kids would be more interested in independent characters like Beast Boy, Raven, Starfire or Cyborg than the classical DC sidekicks like Kid Flash, Wonder Girl, Superboy, Aqualad. The latter would just leave you wondering why aren't you just watching the real adult heroes in Justice League instead.

>>152635964
If you want an actual answer here is how the process of most anime adaptations goes.
First a Light Novel or Manga get popular, this causes larger business interests to take note and invest in the IP, often interests that the works publisher is already part of the machine of.
This leads to the creation of a council that manages the IP aspects of the work by representatives of those involved interests, the original creator is sometimes part of this council sometimes not but the original work is generally respected as the core and soruce of the endeavor.
This council then goes on to allocate resources to extended marketing and merchandising.
From there a anime studio will get contracted to make a season. Most anime studios are ostensibly mercenary companies who take commission work on a season by season basis and so its a toss up if they will get to make another given season for any given show depending on if the council decides its profitable enough, and if not may move to a cheaper studio for future seasons or consider the 1 season made to be acceptable marketing for the IP they are responsible for.

This is contrasted in the West where firstly basically all the "mercenary" studios died off by the late 2000s leaving only those supported by a network or who mange selling their own IP to channels and secondly that there is no consistent pipeline of adaptations to set standards.

>>152642490
that's a heck of a coincidence if it's a myth. I grew up with 03 TT and it was jarring when I finally got around to ntt but when I got to YJ it felt just like the cartoon. It's like they took story elements and characters from ntt but everything else is yj from tone to personalities to how they bounce of each other

>>152642490
>Yeah, New Teen Titans is very 80s, which wouldn't have translated over very well.
that being said, the 2003 show adapts a lot of the first volume of new teen titans fairly well

HIVE being their first enemy in the show is pretty spot-on to the new teen titans, where HIVE was their first real challenge as a unified team
their actual first adventure and origin, rescuing starfire, is referenced later on with their origin episode

>>152642983
>>152642490
>>152641675

iirc Teen Titans actually did start production as a Young Justice cartoon and got turned into Teen Titans later

>>152636009
You cannot adapt something that spqn more than 50+ under 3 movie

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>>152640698
Like:
Beast boy
Starfire
Robin (hes fine when not wearing that blue vest, but a tad goofy)

Dislike:
Raven (her face annoys me alot from an otherwise ok design)
cyborg (his best design til this day is still 2003)
Jinx
Most of the new villains just looked better in the cartoon

Its not really some kinda of specific sin of the comic but just the style of the time that i really really really dont think works at all today aside from some. Its the most iconic teen titans series and defined for alot of people who the titans are and how they look and i really dont understand why titans fans try to deny it (especially when alot of them started only being aware about the existence of this group thanks to the cartoon), its like if batman purists tried to deny harley quinn just because she didnt came from the comics.

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>>152643226
Is there anyone fanboy enough to defend classic Cyborg? I mean come on

>>152643770
Black cyborg superhero if he was designed by Richard Simmons

>>152635951
>Why does the animation and comic industry lack so much synergy?
Because writers in the West think audience wont notice, cause they are 11 and disinterested in reading actual comics

>>152643226
> Robin (hes fine when not wearing that blue vest, but a tad goofy)
You mean the first Nightwing design?

>>152635951
>synergy
Fuck off. We've seen how bad this can be. Let cartoons and comics be different.

>>152642490
>Sam Register was right that kids would be more interested in independent characters
That is kinda bull because Robin is not an independent character an is the focus point of the show. And Kid Flash was popular in his brief appearance.

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>>152636214
I think you're just an idiot who doesn't realize most anime fans are anime-only and never even touch the manga. I also think you're just an idiot who'd want them to adapt an IP in name only rather than adapting the story everyone already loves. Imagine if Peter Jackson heavily deviated from the mainline plot Tolkien wrote. Oh wait, Amazon did that with Rings of Power and it sucked balls. lmao

>>152636271
Hobgoblin is awesome though.

>>152645408
You only think that because the comics are forced to synergize with the shows/films instead of the other way around.

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>>152646264
>That is kinda bull because Robin is not an independent character an is the focus point of the show.
Batman and Robin are the dynamic duo, and Robin the quintessential sidekick, but the reason he stood out from the wave of sidekicks in his wake is that he's not just a junior version of Batman.
He has his own look and theme, unrelated to Batman, A similar, but different origin which gives him different skills. Batman is based off an animal, Robin is (originally) based off Robin Hood

>>152646471
>Hobgoblin is awesome though.
I don't have a beef with him personally. But you often hear Spider-Man fans complaining about Hobgoblin, so issues with him are a drag for some

>>152636214
> the intention is trying to present the exact same thing.... in a new medium
Yes, that's the point of changing the medium.
If you want a different story just read/watch a different story.

>>152635964
>I also wanted to ask (but not put in OP) why anime/manga is able to have synergy and not comics/cartoons.
I don't think this is an accurate statement at all. The GITS movies and animes cherrypick parts of the manga. Part 1 of Jojo has never gotten a full adaptation, part 2 was edited to make Joseph less of an ass, part 3 took 20 years to get a full adaptation, part6 was raped, etc.

>>152638790
That's not Jung that's Schultze-Naumburg.

>>152641538
You fuck off.

The anime industry is historically connected to the manga industry while American animation isn't to comics. That's it.

>>152635964
Anime is meant to be a tie-in, they exist to sell the manga. Cartoon adaptations do not have that limitation due to being based on decades old material, and are therefore free to shake things up.

if cartoons adapted comics better, comics would be better

>>152636057
>An argument could be made that some of the anime that went and did their own thing instead of following the manga

Most of the best anime do this. Anime the strictly follow their manga are rarely that great, most of the best ones are highly original and either very loosely adapt something or are unique productions with no outside source material.

>>152635951
Lol I dunno

>>152636141
… why would you not just go get the comic based on the fucking teen titans cartoon?

>>152652083
I think the best way to describe that is the "Manga/Anime Industrial Complex". The anime industry largely exists to adapt existing manga or LN IPs. This concept of an anime industy mostly dependent on other IPs doesn't seem to exist anywhere else.

>>152655288
Because those are shitty.

>>152656879
So the thing you wanted existed, but you still didn't like it. Okay then.

>>152656879
nah they;re pretty solid. No worse than the cartoon.

The primary audience for cartoons is children, but the source material has been made for adults for the past few decades. The adult audience is going to get very upset if the story they're reading suddenly gets retconned into kiddy shit, even if that's "better," They have taken some of the good ideas from the cartoons and put them into those comics.
DC had a chance to go full cartoon with the Titans back in 2011, but there were still too many adults who had no attachment to a kids' cartoon back then and wanted to do things their way.

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>>152656957
>DC had a chance to go full cartoon with the Titans back in 2011, but there were still too many adults who had no attachment to a kids' cartoon back then and wanted to do things their way
This reminds me I was watching reruns of the Teen Titans cartoon in my local CN back in 2011. I was also getting into Marvel comics at the time.

So kid me wondered "what do the Teen Titans look like in the comics now that DC is rebooting?" and they looked like pic related. Just completely unrecognizable in any away. So I never picked up the comic. At least the Spider-Man or X-Men comics I read were somewhat recognizable.

>>152635951
Simply because comics suck and cartoon chads want to do better. Comics are extremely limited not only be the medium, but the type of "people" who are attracted to the medium. Only lazy retarded motherfuckers choose to create comics because they don't want to put in the effort to make real books or animation and they're too fuck dumb to understand the shortcomings of trying to do something in between. Anyone with a brain can see that comics don't have any of what makes either medium special, nor an identity of their own. People who work in animation however actually put in the effort to become real artists and so not only have the right, but the obligation to change and improve things.

>>152658231
Both mediums have been trash for over a decade. It's also much easier to improve on an existing idea than it is to create one from scratch which is why comics have become a convenient low-cost test bed for new ideas.

>>152635951
>Why does the animation and comic industry lack so much synergy?
Unironically, it's because most people working on animation want to make their own shows and they do not simply want to adapt Marvel/DC comics that have probably been adapted a thousand times already by now.

>>152660067
>that have probably been adapted a thousand times already by now.
This is a big factor. How many times has the Black Suit Saga been adapted? The Dark Phoenix Saga? Judas Contract? At some point you have to do a twist to gain people's attention.

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>>152661582
well they could just adapt some of the other good stuff...