Shill me the lightest iii+ ceramic sapi plate that can stop .308, m855 and m81.

/gq/ Infographic Emporium:
https://imgur.com/a/gq-infographic-emporium-1-00-1lZ5xw6
Legacy Infographic Reserve: https://imgur.com/a/k-infographic-reserve-AIKzwWF

>Last time on /bag/ - uh I mean /gq/, anon used TITANIUM to make knights a thing again. I went on a rant about how awesome AlMgB14-TiB2 is, and anon still doesn't trust Hesco. Rachel.

>QUICK ARMOR GUIDE 2.165
CODE: * = active NIJ-cert, ^ = NEEDS SOFT ARMOR, DND = do not drop, ** = military.
>Special Rifle Threat (M855A1, no M80 <44mm BFD):
Budget: Hesco T212 or L211
Mid-Range: Hesco M210
High-End: Hesco U210 / U211, LSAPI**, or Tencate CR-6450SA.
>CONUS Minimum (M80, M855, M193):
Budget: Expired Hesco 3611C, surp SAPI**^, or Gilliam 6001
Mid-Range: Hesco 3612* or 3810*
High-End: Hesco 3811* or 3811LV^DND
Elite: Used Cercom CER-EMH**^
>CONUS Medium (M80 + M855A1 or BZ API):
Budget: Used Protech 2120-5
Mid-Range: Hesco 3411* or LTC 19513
High-End: LTC 28780**
Elite: VelSys PBZSA** or LTC 28791** or Hesco SC3812
Elite-Plus: Used Ceradyne MH3 CQB**^DND (10x M995) or used Cercom CER-SOPS**^
>CONUS Optimal (M855A1 + M80A1):
Budget: Highcom 3S9 (SAPI-cut)
Mid-Range: Used LTC 28550** / 28590** or Highcom 3S9M* (SAPI-cut!)
High-End: Used LTC 28595**
Elite: Used LTC 28570** or VelSys TSA**
Elite-Plus: Tyr XHA4/S6/T(DND) or GEN 6 LTC TSA**
>Level IV / CONUS High (.30-06 M2AP):
/pfg/: Used Protech 2014G or Gilliam 1023
Budget: Hesco 4403* (bare minimum)
Mid-Range: Hesco 4601* (+ Level III) or surp ESAPI**^ (REV. G-J preferable, adds M995 / 3x M2AP vs 1x)
High-End: Hesco 4800(DND), 4800LV^DND, or Protech 9812-R1(DND)
Elite: Tencate CXP-800 SA or Ceradyne SOF ESAPI MK.II**^DND
Elite-Plus: Ceradyne SAEC**DND(??)
>Level IV+ / CONUS Extreme (Various)
Budget: Protech 2230 (fast M2AP, $300/set used)
Budget-Tungsten: Gilliam 8002 (.300 Winmag Swiss P AP)
Mid-Range: Adept Colossus (7.62x51 Swiss P) or REV. C XSAPI**^ (M993)
High-End: Rev. D XSAPI**^ (M993+)
Elite: ECSAPI** (M993)
Elite-Plus: Ceradyne 96034** (7.62x51 Swiss P)

>>65059594
Assuming you mean M80, lightest white-side is Hesco 3811. NIJ cert as a III and 3.6lb SAPI M or 3.4lb 10x12. If you've got the connections or get lucky, the 3.5lb LSAPI or USMC Lite SAPI are tougher plates but run higher BFD.
Absolute lightest is a 2.2lb polycrystalline diamond plate prototyped by Diamond Age, but that's an experimental and therefore unobtanium.

Any reason I shouldn’t get a safariland drop flex with the qls attachment for my first duty/battle belt rig?

File: 1773352452734845.gif (1.8 MB)

1.8 MB GIF

>>65060033
I would worry about durability and it not being ridged enough when drawing, but it's probably fine

>>65060033
Do you need a tripfag to tell you what to buy?

File: mqdefault.jpg (8.1 KB)

8.1 KB JPG

>>65060033
Depends on if you want to the tea pot every time you draw.

>>65060138
I can't do the teapot or shit in full kit. Am I disabled? I struggle to even pee sometimes. It runs down my leg on the battlefield, then dries and itches and causes an infection. I must scratch my balls incessantly to survive the struggles of the battlefield. As I cannot pee, I need to know if the safariland drop flex can be attached to my peenor. Thanks

>>65060269
>>65060338
based
>>65059128
China can also help you accept who you really are. I'm just saying.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256809716504204.html
>>65057904
Glad to help.

>>65059633
>Hesco 3811
Looks great on paper but damn I can’t find a single video of it being shot

>>65060381
It's a fairly new plate and Hesco doesn't really do the whole affiliate youtuber thing. Fortunately, it's NIJ-certified. NIJ cert trumps youtube test any day of the week.
https://nij.ojp.gov/topics/equipment-and-technology/body-armor/ballistic-resistant-armor#1-0
>search keyword 3811

>>65059566
Is M-Tac a reputable gear company? Looking to get their $80 war belt. Also need some belt armor panel recommendations

Also just a daily reminder that if you have unlimited monies, Hesco has a secret III+ above the 3811 called the SC3812, formerly known in some circles as the 3885. It is 3.8lb SAPI M or ~3.6lb 10x12, rated for 3x 7.62x51mm M80 or 5.56 M855A1, for the low price of... $3,500 a set.
https://www.tac11.com/shop/fxr-sc3812-nij-level-rf2-e-1687
It's down on multi hit versus the 3811 (3x M80 vs 6x) but smokes it on rating (M855A1 and standoff LPS vs M855) while only being 0.2lb heavier. Boron carbide is king.

>>65060509
Ukrainian, so mileage may vary. A Crye blast belt is the boring IIIA rec. If you've brave Jinwudun has very affordable (Chinese) belts.

Is there any place that sells certified war belt armor alone? Preferably Poly 3A inserts?
I might just get the Jinwudun belt if there aren't any out there

>>65059566
Speaking of KNIGHTS, Gilliam Technical Services is now embracing its FOUR CENTURIES OF HERITAGE and is now Gilliam Arms.

>The Gilliam Arms name is not a marketing construct. It draws directly from a documented ancestral lineage. In 1604, John Guillim — a direct paternal ancestor of company founder W. Gilliam — received the Earl Marshal’s warrant to wear the tabard of Portsmouth Pursuivant Extraordinary at the College of Arms in London. By 1618 he held the formal title of Rouge Croix Pursuivant of Arms in Ordinary under King James I. In 1610, he published A Display of Heraldrie, the foundational reference text of English heraldry, still consulted by working heralds today.

>The Guillim family coat of arms — a lion rampant Ermyns, gorged with a collar Or, langued and armed Gules — is documented within Guillim’s own book. The word “Arms” in Gilliam Arms carries both meanings simultaneously: the ballistic armor the company manufactures, and the heraldic arms of the Guillim family recorded at the College of Arms over four centuries ago.

>Each plate in the product line will carry a name traceable to a specific moment or figure in the Gilliam lineage.

It gets better.
>The company’s flagship NIJ-certified RF3 plate — currently in final preparation for TIMS submission under NIJ Standard 0101.07 — will carry the designation HERALD, named in direct honor of John Guillim, Rouge Croix Pursuivant, the herald whose 1604 warrant marks the earliest documented entry of the Guillim name into the official rolls of the College of Arms.

>>65060691
>certified war belt armor
No such thing at least under NIJ. NIJ only certifies body armor in "vest" panel or plate form worn on the torso.
Anything that isn't body armor is uncertified regardless of what the manufacturer says, so you're relying on manufacturer rep alone. I have Jinwudun's IIIA skirt, no complaints with build quality but I haven't shot it so I can't tell you if it works. Similar poly IIIA skirts have seen use on both sides of the Ukraine conflict because they provide 360 degree femoral, ass, and nuts coverage. Jinwudun's in particular has seen use with the Russians, so they have some "professional" (kinda) end users. The belt checks out in terms of specs and it's cheap too.

>>65060573
One day, take a trip to the street markets of Sham Shui Po, Hong Kong. After eating a pork bun actually filled with gutter oil and cat meat, you will shit yourself a whole man. After shitting yourself a whole man on the streets of Kowloon, travel by dirty bicycle taxi to Sham Shui Po. After arriving in Sham Shui Po, you will arrive in Sham Shui Po. Once you are in Sham Shui Po, head to the markets near Chungking Mansions. Do not go inside Chungking unless you want questionable head and a hotel room the size of an oven. Once in the markets, purchase another pork bun and shit yourself a whole man. Once the shit is shat, become hudrated with Wanglaoji, then take in the aroma of the market. Around you is the worst shit in all of china, all the clothes meant for Temu Africa, like the premade victory merch for the teams that lose the super bowl, because it ain't even presentable on Temu. The lawn chairs will fit an anorexic child rescued from Epstein island... maybe.

>>65060716
>haven't shot it so I can't tell you if it works.
Surely your balls deserve reassurance worth shooting your own skirt filled with a couple tangerines and a banana?

>>65060749
I'm saving up for a .45-70 Marlin actually, so I could get a ballistic gel dummy and reenact the one time someone actually died to backface deformation (.45-70 to only IIA, BFD over 100mm) but to the dummy's banana and tangerines.

File: bvel.png (752.6 KB)

752.6 KB PNG

Interesting deal alert. Set of VelSys "B-VEL" coated steel covert plates on ebay for $700. These are an improvement on the PSTES first-gen steel plates but are generally inferior to the later PBZSA covert and boron carbide BZ API Secret Service type members of the VelSys ULV family. Also four times the weight of the 7.62x39 MSC only VS-PXULV all-PE model.
They pick up M80 / M855 / M193 (watch velocity) protection over just 7.62x39 MSC as with PSTES / PULV. 6lb a plate. Steel, so in spite of the coating they will spall.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/267617435158

IMO, these are horrible generalists but serve a niche for low profile rifle protection. I'd prefer the all-PE PXULV unless M855 is a problem, since the PXULV is 1.5lb, not 6lb, and in theory passes through a metal detector because it has no metal. If threats are stiff (M855A1 / BZ API) the rare covert-cut PBZSA variant is better. Secret Service version is even better but street price is $5k a set and it only came up for sale one time, so it's like the Ceradyne SAECs. Uber expensive top-tier totally "surplus" armor.

File: esapis.png (1 MB)

1 MB PNG

Small rev. G ESAPIs for 220 Arizona sweet teas on tacswap. Good deal if you're a smaller dude.

File: Screenshot 2026-04-09 120114.png (929.6 KB)

929.6 KB PNG

Also, what's the difference between the 9900X and the 9900SA?

>>65060695
Now that's what I call schizo

>>65061474
Pride in your heritage is not schitzo. Do you know your father's name? That would be a good start for (you).
>t. Sons of the American Revolution
>t. Mayflower Society

>>65061628
lmao hi Gilliam, how's the Monster Zero Ultra this fine morning?

>>65061144
9900x is polyurea (LineX) coated.
>>65061130
Very cheap for improved ESAPIs.
>>65061474
The Herald better be a badass plate.
>>65061628
Based.

File: a-taps-smaller-than-you-think-v0-1jg8un14rlbd1.jpg (1.7 MB)

1.7 MB JPG

What's the modern high-end equivalent of an ATAPS rig? I've had something like this forever but I want to try something with more up to date materials and construction. Maybe laminate construction, etc.

I have no budget.

>>65061746
spiritus 34 alpha will set you back another $200 with little to no noticable improvements

>>65059566
Need good footwear recs. Feet are killing me. Need a good all-terrain boot that I can wear at the factory and also opr8 in. Doesn’t need heavy texture for mountaineering. More importantly, how can I not destroy my feet? Have tons of calluses and such that I assume are from ill fitting shoes.

>>65062114
Just get timberlands, if it's good enough for drug dealers it's good enough for you

>>65062114
Just get sneakers from a reputable brand.

>>65062123
Worse boots Ive ever owned in my life. Better off with the walmart boots. Heavy boots suck ass

>>65061661
Damn you got em. I knew he lurked here. Wilson! Why are you discontinuing the 1023 and 8002? They're your best plates.

>>65062146
timberland pros were comfortable but the sole split in half after a year

>>65062604
It's probably been used to take hundreds of "game animals" since then.

gq is officially bipolar. Either the fastest general on /k/ or it's altchan-o-cock

THIS IS NOT A CONTROVERSIAL POST!
ALSO, I SHOOT 10MM!

>>65063171
Its the whole board. Everyone is either dead or moved on to greener pasture

>>65063217
You're right. /arg/ is slow as fuck too. Weird because last /gq/ was turbo speed, hit bump in three days.
Probably because we had muh 4400s "I hate armor autism!" anon (wonder who told him to buy the 4400s...) and titanium knightposter making conversation.

I have nothing new in terms of armor autism since last thread, which probably isn't helping things. I'm waiting on this flagship Gilliam Herald RF3 plate to drop. My expectation is that it's an improved 9969. If it splits the difference in all respects between Adept's Archon and Colossus, maybe 6.2lb for an honest 10x12 and it stops M993 reliably but not Swiss P AP, it'll be a 10/10 winner as long as price stays under $900/set and there's no bullshit with the drop pro or cut. Until then, I wait and see.

>>65063217
AKA, all growed up now. 'Ceptin' us'uns.

>>65063402
Hey bro, don't get shot.

>>65063447
Statistically it is VERY likely none of us will ever get shot or have to use our guns in anger.
Yet here we are... talking about... *checks notes*

Titanium knight suits for extreme multi hit, blast belts from JINWUDUN, an RF3 plate named after a 17th century Rouge Croix Pursuivant, and III+ Hesco 3811s.
I do have news though. The Highcum 3S14M and 3S15M are 0101.07 certified. They are among the first plates to simultaneously hold 0101.06 and 0101.07 cert last I checked.

>>65063485
>They are among the first plates to simultaneously hold 0101.06 and 0101.07 cert last I checked.
OMG! I'm going to light a candle and put it in the window!

>>65063492
That's gonna be a lot of candles, cuz both .06 and .07 will be active for several years. Somebody call the fire department anon's gonna burn his house down.

>>65063485
>They are among the first plates to simultaneously hold 0101.06 and 0101.07 cert last I checked.
splain what that means to someone who doesnt know shit about plates
does it mean i should buy them

>>65063485
Hey bro, don't get shot.

>>65063567
>does it mean I should buy them
No, they're mostly inferior to Hesco counterparts. 3800 and 3810 / 3811, once you account for Highcom's 10x12 being more like a 9x11.
>splain what that means to someone who doesnt know shit about plates
Super quick and dirty. The 3S15M is certified NIJ Level III, so after getting dropped twice and what not it stops six 7.62x51mm M80 at 2,780ft/s. That's 0101.06, the current standard. It is NOW also certified as NIJ RF1, so it stops three 7.62x51mm M80 after getting dropped once.
>wtf that's a downgrade
Yes. 0101.07 reduces multi hit req at this level from six to three. RF1 replaces III. Also the drop test is now easier. This is why dual cert could be useful.
Anyways, since it's RF1, the 3S15M is also now certified to beat 3x 5.56 M193 or 3x 7.62x39 mild steel core, the latter of which is important because some cheapo PE plates do lose to mild steel core 7.62x39mm. However, the 3S15M is not able to beat M855, which is where the RF2 level 3S14M comes in!

Previously the 3S14M was certified as a III, but now it's certified RF2, so it does the RF1 stuff but also stops 3x 5.56 M855, courtesy of its ceramic strike face which the 3S15M lacks.
Now, important bit, the 3S14M only needs to stop M855 after being dropped once. Jury is out on what happens if you drop it twice NIJ-style (4 feet, 10lb weight on back, onto concrete) as you would per 0101.06.

Anyways, 0101.06 does not list 5.56 and 7.62x39 stuff at all and the new 0101.07 ratings do, hence the new certs. We're already seeing cases, like with the RMA XRT, where plates can handle listed threats fine after a SINGLE 0101.07 drop, but if dropped twice like 0101.06 they fold (M80A1, see Buff vid). Dual cert between 0101.06 and 0101.07 sorta kinda guarantees extra drop resilience, but not against M855 or non-NIJ threats.

File: Screenshot_20260409_233523_Chrome.jpg (278.1 KB)

278.1 KB JPG

>>65059566
AWS has listed a "Commando Light" Chicom Type 56 clone made in black. Their page says it is contract over runs for "Tier-One Unit".
Has anyone seen these in the wild?

File: 60c898116d855e001815810f.jpg (161.7 KB)

161.7 KB JPG

>>65063889
https://awsin.com/51247-ak-47-chest-rig/
I think it might have been something to give to interps? I can't tell if this is a three or four cell, if three cell would be a pretty close match.
Then again a black Type 56 is pretty generic.

File: Screenshot_20250803_170902_Samsung Internet.jpg (431.8 KB)

431.8 KB JPG

>>65063590
Simple as.

>>65062114
>Need a good all-terrain boot that I can wear at the factory and also opr8 in.
No dude, wear your OSHA approved boots in your factory and buy a separate pair of shoes for recreational outside shit. If you're a gigapoorfag think about what you do the most and allocate your discretionary income accordingly. I wear the same pair of la sportiva hiking shoes to go trail-running, hiking, hunting, walking around on my property, and on the outdoor range when I shoot comps.

>>65064308
>la sportiva
Are they red or yellow?

File: Screenshot_20260410_055914_Samsung Browser.jpg (1.6 MB)

1.6 MB JPG

1959 FN 2-2-1, so tempting.

>>65064554
Punch those III++ plates broski

>>65064554
I want to get into reloading eventually, those could be pulled and reloaded into .308 right?

Does anybody buy from or at least know of any companies/sites that sell safety glasses with prescription lenses?

I tried using old lenses in a lens insert in a pair of goggles and really didn't like it, and when I tried contacts it did nothing for my severe astigmatism, and wearing a wide pair of eye pro over my normal glasses is cumbersome and retarded

at this point I'm willing to pay the premium, I just need to only have one set of temples under my earpro and one set of lenses to look through

>>65064735
In minecraft yes. Same diameter.

>>65063889
probably for low vis shit. that pic of the cag guy with the marpat and lvaw had him wearing something very similar.

>>65064769
>in minecraft
let me guess, there are laws against manufacturing new ap ammo, and moving an old bullet to a new case counts as that?

>>65064735
Even the same bullets sometimes. For example M118 real fucking NATO is the same bullet as M72 30.06.

>>65064801
>there are laws against manufacturing new ap ammo, and moving an old bullet to a new case counts as that?
No, AP ammo needs a specific sporting exemption. Whatever you are making doesn't have it. Exemptions are given for new stuff as well, it's just that you don't have it. Iirc making something the same as something that has an exemption is fine though, eg making your own M855 with M855 bullets following the same load data is OK, but making an M855 based 7.62mm discarding sabot subcal round probably wouldn't, though I might not be remembering right.

>>65064813
This is correct. You can reload M2AP and M855 freely because those two have sporting use exemptions. A sabot M855 is likely fine since it's based on the projectile.
>>65064801
Based on projectile. If it has a sporting use exemption by BATFE it's fine. This does not AFAIK, so you can possess the ammo but not reload it because the ATF on a bad day could view that as manufacturing.
APAnons have a bad history of getting vanned. There's been four.

>>65064839
>APAnons have a bad history of getting vanned. There's been four.
well now that I am aware such may be against the law, I no longer have any desire to do it

>>65064844
The one I remember from /bag/ was drilling and putting certain tungsten carbide... industrial components... into 6.5 Creedmoor. Rumor has it he did the needful against an RMA 1155.

Alright, the GILLIAM ARMS Herald RF3 has dropped. It's $250 a plate, multi-hit .30-06 M2AP, 6.45lb / 1.1" thick. multi-curve, 0101.07 drop pro.

Specs so far seem very good for the price, which leads me to invoke the no free lunch rule until a test report comes out. Has the RMA 1165 pretty dead to rights in all brackets except thickness. Cheaper, stronger, more robust, has drop pro, not 9x11 or whereabouts for the 10x12.
https://gilliamtechnicalservices.com/products/herald-rf3-multi-curved-ceramic-armor-plate

Gilliam also has reports for the RF1 Helion 2.05lb plate. Stops three M80 with sub-40mm BFD, or 3x 7.62x39 MSC / 3x 5.56 M193 on the same plate. For $250 a pop, very good! Just can't stop M855.

>>65064735
>those could be pulled and reloaded into .308 right?
Allegedly, but that would violate the laws of God and Man. Like reanimating the dead and having sex with her (only after a church wedding, of course) you would never want to do that.

>>65065040
This sacrilege would still pop an LTC 19513, LSAPI, or Hesco 3812, I'm just saying.

What is the argument companies use to defend cheat rings? Do they claim it is some kind of drop bumper and just so happens to count for size?

>>65065096
There are four arguments.
1. The "it saves money and other people do it!" defense. Gilliam sells very cheap OA+ plates with a cheat ring to try and price match cheap Chinese white labels with the same.
2. The "government contract, people wanted it!" defense used by RMA for the 1189 and 1199. This is bogus.
3. The drop protection argument, which is bogus because you do not need an inch of foam for this. My 2230s have a tiny foam edge, like 5mm tops, for example.
4. The saving weight argument. The RMA 1189 was 6.8lb with 8x10 coverage on a 10x12. If it provided honest coverage it would be 10.2lb.

>>65065130
Are "cheat rings" still even a thing? The most recent buffman RMA teardown videos show foam wrapped around the sides but no cheat ring. Seems kinda exaggerated when you see the proof for yourself desu

>>65065135
RMA only had cheat rings on the 1189 and first gen 1199, along with some pre-2014 plates allegedly.
Gilliam's OA+ plates have rings, Militech has small rings (fractions of an inch). LiTai is same deal. Jinwudun has big rings on most plates. LAPG has rings on the cheaper models. American Blast Systems has massive rings.
NIJ permits up to 2" on each side. Traditional China / RMA style rings are 1".
Rings nowadays are mostly a Chinese thing. The reason why RMA took flak is because the 1189 was released in 2013 but they didn't admit the ring until 2018. The world's lightest IV, the 1199, was released about 2016, no admission until 2018 as well. Both plates had only 8x10 coverage on a 10x12. Outer edge was foam and basically useless.

Any recs for helmets?
I'm probably going to get nightvision soon, was leaning towards L3 Harris.
Need a helmet that can interface with that with hopefully zero shit I have to fuck around with to make work.
Budget for the helmet is hopefully sub $2,000 not including mounts for the nightvision as I'll probably buy that separately.
Would prefer ballistic rated helmet as long as the helmet doesn't end up being cumbersome.

>>65065135
Also, forgot to mention earlier, don't forget the issue of nominal sizing. A plate which is advertised 10x12 but is really 9.5x11.5 with bottom corner cuts has less coverage than many plates with "small" rings. RMA's latest plates use new tricks. Nominal sizing, reduced or no drop pro (1165), and bottom corner cuts. Highcom also does nominal sizing. Hesco is more honest.

>>65065205
Surplus ACH or ECH depending on desired protection level.

>>65065258
And make sure to cut it to high cut.

>>65065323
What's wrong with full cut?

>>65065327
Do you want your pretty curls to stick out otlr not?

>>65065327
Earpro experience wont be as nice. But then again if you get shot in the head, you might actually survive. No free lunches

>>65065327
Nothing, he's trolling at how people obsessively need to cut full cuts to high cuts even though doing this in a garage can compromise the helmet. Hacksaw or sawzall is not how the factories do it.
Also there are plenty of reported saves from full cuts eating frag to the area not covered by a high cut. I'm not saying full > high in all scenarios, but it's preferable in many. Coverage is good.

Speaking of helmets. I had asked about painting mine and some anons mentioned plastic dip. Why would you plasti dip prior to paint?

Damn, when you search rf3+ plate in google the Gilliam 8002 is first result but the Adept Colossus is only second.
Somebody's gotta be buying Gilliam's plates. It's weird because basically nobody except us and like one reddit thread are talking about them. Does he have like a posse of twenty boomers keeping him afloat? Is he running a hardcore ground game on discord?

>>65065405
Maybe so you can peel the plasti dip under the paint off?

>>65065437
That’s what I’m figured but not even sure why you’d need it want to. I was just going to slap down my Velcro and spray over it lightly with paint.

>>65065443
If you wanted to change the camo later it would be easier to just remove plasti dip, then redo the process vs removing the old paint.

>>65065446
I’d rather paint over it or blast it with brake clean while making sure the run off goes into the neighbors yard.

>>65065451
>goes into the neighbors yard.
Kensington avenue hours tonight boys. That will be faster when you need to hit the open air fent market at 20:00.

>>65065455
Hell yeah, go birds. I started my reading on bendy plates but then got distracted. More to come there. Currently bastardizing a beretta.

>>65065462
I am eternally annoyed the laminated B4C and polycrystalline diamond versions of dragonskin or hexar from 2022 fell through. They were listed by Stealth for like five minutes and then vanished. My guess is Adept, formerly Diamond Age, formerly Chuck's, couldn't source those materials in any serious quantities.

>>65065469
Need flexible armor. Dragon scale Nostalgie aside

>>65065507
Dragonskin nostalgia is based and I'm tired of pretending it's not. Give me my allegedly classified secret NIJ Level V rated armor dammit. I gotta stop 7.62x51 M948 SLAP cold at 4,000ft/s.
>for those unaware, Pinnacle Armor's entire defense to calling their SOV-4000 Dragonskin "Level V" in 2006-2007 is that the NIJ actually HAS a Level V but it's classified and apparently exists on some kind of second "Shadow CPL." The obvious implication to this top tier schizophrenia is that every other armor company has baller ass Level V secret plates rated for various tungsten AP. Some did, some still do, but sadly most do not.

I have PVS-31a now, and need to add thermal. Should I get a COTI or some kind of monocular or what?

>>65065553
Any hints to that cpl name? I have a knack for finding old documents that shouldn’t exist.
>>65065561
Depends on what you’re trying to do. Personally, Ive always gravitated towards on rifle. Others will say monocular like that flir scout. Jerry c here you come

>>65065589
It doesn't actually exist. NIJ Level V is an informal made-up industry designation, but usually refers to multi-hit M993 between 3,000 to 3,100ft/s, with Pinnacle's version being M993, M995, 7.62x54R BS-40 tungsten API, and 7.62x51mm M948 SLAP. The clue to this being a fake-aaahh rating is that none of those threats are remotely common CONUS. NIJ focused 0101.0X on threats law enforcement can reasonably encounter, with IV being an umbrella rating to proxy for all things reasonable.

For a historical context, M995 at 3,350 and M993 at 3,050ft/s are the XSAPI threats. The original objective for XSAPI was to stop 7.62x54R BS-40 API, since that was in circulation in Iraq and clowns on early ESAPIs due to its tungsten core, but that is not met. The plates would have likely been 7.5-8lb using the technology at the time. BS-40 is a very beefy threat. I dunno where they got M948 from. That regularly v50s the Colossus so it's a real platebuster.

Just had an armor autism thought. The new 3.5lb LSAPI is intended to be mass-issued to the close combat force. The contract to LTC and Hardwire is optionable so they can make over a million of the things. The close combat force is going to be issued the M7. The M7's default ammo is M1186, which is superior to M80A1. The CCF's default armor is not rated for their own basic ammo.
>oops
If they switch to GEN-IV ESAPI or eventually GEN-IV XSAPI, neither plate is rated for XM1184, the tungsten core 6.8 AP which is comparable to 7.62x51 M1158 and ergo superior to M993. There is no known plate in US inventory, absent the apocryphal and likely dead NGSAPI, rated for M1158 or XM1184.

This is odd for two reasons. One is that it's been a constant piece of advice to have armor rated for your own ammo, in case opfor steals your shit. Two is that after XSAPI couldn't stop BS-40 in 2007, the backup cope for the lower M993 rating is that XSAPI would protect soldiers from getting accidentially teamkilled by M240s firing M993. That excuse is no longer true with the new APs.

In the end, XSAPI turned out to be a fuck.

>>65065589
>gravitated towards on rifle
What's my best option for something I can mount in front of an ACOG?

>>65065724
I can’t wait for m7 clones builds. We’re going to have like a 13.5” meta build and then the zoomer boomer long barrel models.

>>65065864
XM1184 that fell off a truck is going to rip out of a 20" barrel, no joke. XM1186 might actually have a shot against Level IV (like it was supposed to when the program started...) as well, given the Hesco 4403 for example folds to M2AP at only 2,930ft/s (Buffman) conditioned but is fine at 2,910. Many IVs seriously lack headroom, it's bad.

Brinks, the security company, selected a new 9mm load from Liberty using a 55gr all-copper meme ass projectile and NAS3 casing.
https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/liberty-9mm-spike-brinks-executive-protection/

Response from the terminal ballistics wizards at pistolforum is overwhelmingly negative. This looks like an improvement on their 50gr ultralight but is still going to fall short of FBI penetration depth requirements. Calcs are that it goes 8-9" into gel. Also it's over $2 a shot.
Good news is that it has the velocity to punch basic IIIA panels (so does the mich cheaper 50gr), which is maybe the rationale Brinks listened to, but since Brinks, Inc has several FFLs they should be able to get an exemption from the AP ban and issue their trusted executive protection dudes actual AP ammo for their sidearms. I think tungsten-core 9x19 DM91 is actually cheaper than this and out of a subgun pens some Level III PE.

Final score: retarded.

File: 2372382.png (473.4 KB)

473.4 KB PNG

>>65064880
>tfw i remember anonfilly
if you're gonna do fucky shit don't do it in a public discord, the anon

>>65065905
>Many IVs seriously lack headroom, it's bad.
No. It's not. IVs are rated to stop the threats they're rated against, deciding they should have some arbitrary level of extra "headroom" so they perform better for some eceleb's YouTube videos is retarded. That extra performance inevitably requires trade-offs in weight, thickness or cost (or all three). Why would a company accept that for something the vast majority of people have no need for?

>>65064748
>when I tried contacts it did nothing for my severe astigmatism
You could look into rigid gas permeable contacts. They take some getting used to but often provide better results for severe astigmatism or conditions like keratoconus.

>>65066730
>deciding they should have some arbitrary level of extra "headroom" so they perform better for some eceleb's YouTube videos is retarded.
The reason why Hesco had four NIJ suspensions is because their plates wouldn't perform if the ceramic was a touch weaker than it should be. Every replacement plate in Hesco's lineup is heavier than its suspended predecessor. The 4403 itself is about 25ft/s away from failing against the threat its rated against. Ditto for the 4800. Frankly, unless Hesco has perfect QC the same shit will happen again. Surprisingly not the 4601, and there's no tradeoff in weight there versus the competition.
Hesco just has to design better. A little more headroom is a tenth of a pound of extra backer. Not a whole lot. This will get more important with 0101.07, since RF3 plates have easier reqs than IVs.

Where do you lads buy your optics? I’m looking for an acog+rmr

>>65067151
ebay

>I buy my optics straight from Alibaba baby! Fresh off the boat from Shanghai, still in love with Chew-Kee Ung baby! I got a Oneleaf in my pants, Holosun i, my pocket, $70 for a spud pouch ain't my style. Gonna find expired armor at the goodwill! PASGT at the inner city YMCA. You can stay there, shit your pants, get a handie from the homeless and a crack baggie in your dumpie!

>>65067151
>Where do you lads buy your optics?
I have no single source. I buy best price, discounts and going-out-of-business deals. I got 2 TA44s for $1600 cash, no tax. A Reflex II w/carry handle scout mount at a gunshow. And an Accupoint TR21 from someplace like Cheaper Than Earth, (that is now out of business) for under $1k. They screwed up and sent me a higher priced German #4 reticle, which I prefer. Perhaps why they are out of business? I picked up a used Nightforce and Leopold Mk IV on a package deal at a discount from a gunshop. My best deals are where I find them, and my hand-me-downs are just place holders until I can upgrade. Currently after the Sig Tango6 withTi mount. Seems to be running $1800? I would at $1500 in a heartbeat for new(ish).

File: alimaxx.png (925.1 KB)

925.1 KB PNG

>>65067550
chad art of the going-out-of-business deal

File: stusss.png (239.2 KB)

239.2 KB PNG

The lack of cloakposting disturbs me.

File: Screenshot_20240919_154602_Gallery.jpg (1.2 MB)

1.2 MB JPG

The lack of any posting disturbs me.

>>65067975
There will be more when it’s warm enough to paint. Right now trying to finish 3 rifles and this beretta. On the to do list: continue reading into flexible plates, finish trash suit, work on helmet, revisit rigs such as dr and unity clutch. I also have to take a German test. Go birds

>>65067975
Agreed. Time for a daily reminder that if you need plates immediately and you're poor and/or financially responsible with other obligations like a wife and kids Hudsongunner has Protech 2014G Level IVs for $225 a pair, 10x12.
This plate is formerly NIJ cert, discontinued, single curve. Antiquated alumina-fiberglass design, used to compete with the Hesco 4400 back when it was called the Reed Composite Solutions 4400 over a decade ago.
https://hudsongunner.com/protech-2014g-level-iv-stand-alone-rifle-plate-set-of-2/

Do not be persuaded by the IV+ designation, this plate is strict by the book single strike.

File: go birds.png (319.3 KB)

319.3 KB PNG

>>65068010
go birds!

Also to aid you in your quest for reading about flexible armor, here is Evolution Armor's website. This is A. Bain's company after he had a messy divorce with Murray Neal at Pinnacle but before he founded Stealth Armor Systems. You will see he ALSO used a fake-ass Level 5 designation.
https://web.archive.org/web/20090208180236/http://evolutionarmor.com/Classified.htm

>The Titanium Carbide or TiC3 is the real tough guy in flexible rifle armor, it's our robust system, and although about 30% heavier than B4C it also can meet Level 5 without making you look like you have a cybernetic organism implanted in your chest. Just 8.5mm of this material can stop a Lapua. In general to get solid M993 protection your flexible vest won't be any thicker than an ESAPI plate, which means we have shed the OTV. So if you want to implant awesome protection in a plate carrier only cover we can do this to.
His Level V was just meeting XSAPI requirements, so multi-hit M993 at 3,050ft/s +-50, which for standalone flexible rifle is pretty nice.
>All order are subject to identification verification through the state department, and export controls are being adhere to in the strictest manner. Military contractor and/or Special Forces operators only!

Also he had some Silicon Carbide - Dyneema non-flexible plates with good performance numbers, including a 2.2lb all-PE Level III in 2008, so assuming no games (this is a big-ass assumption) the Evolution Armor Dyneema III was like a Hesco 3800 more than a decade early.
https://web.archive.org/web/20080208235246/http://www.evolutionarmor.com/Silicon.htm

>>65067151
eurooptic (american)

>>65068176
you will learn about flexible plates and you will be happy

Alright, new thing. The Chinese knockoff m50 / c50 gas mask outserts have reached ebay. Jury is out as to whether the orange and green laser protection outserts work.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/197722870105

>multiple suspensions
>high end line is just alumina plate
>unpressed backers
>overpriced for what it is
Why should I buy Hesco again?

https://youtu.be/n1gc1jPAo6Q

>>65068065
This fantastic, much appreciated. Also, funny reading on the cooling system, which goes full circle back to our Russian cooling discussion few threads back. I’ll need to do some history to get up to speed on pinnacle as well. Also warrants some looks at carriers similar to the crye airline (if I remember name right), I’d think. Seeing some new interest in polyphenylenes, which I’m hoping carries over into getting us some new fancy plates

File: IMG_8445.jpg (688.2 KB)

688.2 KB JPG

Good afternoon all. A thread or two back I was asking about camo recs for the Rockies. At this point I’m between multicam or Marpat. I just got back from a quick trip innawoods, during which I took a few pictures of a Marpat boonie for the purposes of Science.

I’ll post them here. As a game, try to find the hat without zooming the picture. You’ll probably find it a few times, but I think one shot is particularly challenging. We’ll see how this works out with image compression and whatnot.
>picrel a general shot of the Pike San Isabel natl forest, no hat included

File: Boonie1real.png (2.2 MB)

2.2 MB PNG

>>65068354
1/4

File: Boonie2.png (2.5 MB)

2.5 MB PNG

>>65068373
2/4

File: 1775937146157115.png (2.2 MB)

2.2 MB PNG

>>65068373

File: Boonie3.png (2.4 MB)

2.4 MB PNG

>>65068374
3/4
This one’s sort of ruined by compression

File: Boonie4.png (2.4 MB)

2.4 MB PNG

>>65068375
Whoops
>>65068380
4/4

>>65068354
M81 woodland for the two weeks in late spring when everything is super green. Marpat would also be good for that. Multicam for the rest of the year. Plus some overwhites for the rare occasion it snows enough to cover everything.

File: 1775937208858944.png (2.3 MB)

2.3 MB PNG

>>65068374

File: 1775937275699811 (1).png (2.2 MB)

2.2 MB PNG

>>65068380

File: 1775937339065698.png (2.2 MB)

2.2 MB PNG

>>65068381
we tracked you easy

>>65068375
>>65068384
>>65068389
>>65068391
Excellent work, but did you see the multicam boonie in each?

File: IMG_6221.jpg (2.6 MB)

2.6 MB JPG

>>65068354
>>65068374
>>65068375
>>65068380
>>65068381
Also pictured was my hydration pack. I’m proud to say no one has spotted it yet.

File: 1763916950966094.jpg (141.2 KB)

141.2 KB JPG

What weapon light 2 buy if not burgerstan

>>65068468
bestellen sie surefire oder streamlight

>>65068482
but where

>>65068503
Which country. It is easier to assume all foreigners are some variant of fucked up German. You can likely source directly from brownells, but you have provided no details to assist us in assisting you. Worst case scenario, you may have to suitcase one over. That’s a long flight.

>>65068518
>but you have provided no details to assist us in assisting you
My fucking life.

>>65068518
non-EU yurop, ive no issue with ordering from abroad which is why i asked if theres a particular german store i could order from

>>65068427
kek, i love doing these. but yeah marpat does work very well in that environment

>>65068331
Because they don't use tricks like nominal sizing, cheat rings, bottom corner cuts, or cut drop protection (unless it's the LV series plates or the weird ones like the 1520 / 4520 / 4610). Hesco plates lack headroom, and they're the weakest "honest" plates in their brackets, but they're the lightest. They also have a stack of current NIJ certs. Also, they actually made good on their fuckups unlike RMA / Highcom, who leave you holding the bag. LTC has failed to publicly answer anyone as to why the 26605 got suspended twice and quietly discontinued as well.
>>65068349
Pinnacle is a fun read. Here's their website. https://web.archive.org/web/20060125012556/http://www.pinnaclearmor.com/body-armor/ballistic-chart.php

File: Brush.png (2.2 MB)

2.2 MB PNG

>>65068566
I think so too. My only reservation is that the Rockies are so diverse, Picrel was literally just across a road no more than 100 yards away

>>65068652
"The Rockies" is meaninglessly broad. The only biome you won't find somewhere in the rockies is a tropical rain forest. If you're talking about the Pike National Forest/central CO, then multicam is going to be a reasonably good fit more often than any other common pattern. There's a lot of variability from place to place and year to year, but very generally it's pretty brown most of the time except late spring/early summer. Last year was abnormally wet, so the ground cover stayed green until almost September, but that's unusual. Marpat is good, especially in spring, but it's a little too dark for late summer, fall, and winter. Woodland is even better in the forest in the spring, but even worse in the other seasons. Multicam is almost always better in the intermountain basins and in the pinon-juniper woodlands to the south.

The base camo pattern is just about not being wildly out of place. Really good camo always has to be tailored to the immediate local environment at the moment you're using it. That's why you tie local vegetation into your ghille suit.

>>65068745
>muh camo
Thermal is gonna get you anyway, drip or drown

>>65068632
>LTC has failed to publicly answer anyone as to why the 26605 got suspended twice and quietly discontinued as well.
I was thinking about getting a set of LTC 26310s and then noticed that they're not on the NIJ compliant products list even though all sellers advertise them as NIJ certified. The previous model 26300 isn't on the list either. LTC only has six plates with an active NIJ cert, and that doesn't include any of their lightweight level IVs. I have nothing against LTC, or Hesco for that matter, but body armor has to be right up there with used cars and crypto as the least transparent, most scam-infested industries.

>>65068783
What are you even trying to say? Use your words.

>>65068527
>My fucking life.
OTG (off the grid), total anonymity comes with a price to be paid. And still, it is an illusion. You may as well post your region/country/parish/shire/ville, the "deep state" knows all about your sordid life anyway.

>>65068831
He's basically saying camo doesn't matter, because of thermal, so choose whatever makes your dick wiggle, instead of trying to min max.

File: Screenshot_20260411_150144_Samsung Browser.jpg (570 KB)

570 KB JPG

>>65068065
>to aid you in your quest for reading about flexible armor
When what you really want is full front LVL IV protection. What are you going to do, get shot in the back running away? Crystalline carbon curiass for $461 when?
>mfw even then they will bitch about spall

File: 1773703230849023m.jpg (132.7 KB)

132.7 KB JPG

>>65068436
To be fair anon, I need more pixels..
Are you the tie dye anon? I need him to do a field test. Pic related he posted a few threads ago.

File: plate.png (633.2 KB)

633.2 KB PNG

Should I or should I not shoot it? Just bought it for 10 dollars, surplus SAPI plate judging by the label on the back, produced October of 2001.

>>65068913
I will give you $10USD to shoot it with a 9mm handgun.

>>65068918
Show me the money

File: 20260411_155457.jpg (2 MB)

2 MB JPG

>>65068976
If by money you mean muh dick, no.

>>65068632
Bless for pinnacle link. More to come.
>>65068868
Not my handiwork but I just did my hydration pack. I should have more dye work soon. I want to do a ghetto 6sh117 out of a flc. Biggest takeaways being using less dye than you think, weighting dye piece down, and suspending it in the dye vs throwing it in pot.

>>65068993
$10 for the pants. You’d make net zero profit. Your only cost would be some dignity.

>>65068831
So the 26310 and 26300 are tested only to the older standard, 0101.04. That omits all conditioning requirements. Drop testing, temp testing, water exposure, etc. Also the Level IV requirement is easier, max velocity for M2AP is 2,880ft/s versus 2,910ft/s.
>all sellers advertise them!
They're all lying. You cannot claim something is certified to a standard discontinued in 2008 and replaced by 0101.06 in that same year. Armor vendors regularly lie and misrepresent armor all the time. Apex for example calls the LTC 28590 Level IV. Hoplite does too. That is false. It is only rated to 7.62x54R B-32 API, hence why it is lighter than the 26300 and 26310. LTC's own spec sheet omits M2AP and yet there they are, lying out their ass.
They also call the 28590 the GEN-V SOCOM tactical standalone. False again. It is the GEN-IV Light tactical standalone. The GEN-V is the 28595. Catalyst and Apex also call the LTC 28601 standalone and rated up to any AP below .50 BMG. False and false again motherfucker. It's ICW IIIA and only good up to M993 @ 3,100ft/s three times. Any modern long-core 7.62x51mm or 7.62x54R tungsten AP will destroy it.
>I have nothing against LTC, or Hesco for that matter, but body armor has to be right up there with used cars and crypto as the least transparent, most scam-infested industries.
Welcome to the armor industry. Trust nobody and verify all claims. There is NO free lunch. I just lurked on arfcom and saw half a dozen people get suckered by the new RMA 1165 GEN2, not knowing it's badly undersized, has cut bottom corners, and no drop pro.

>>65068993
Man I ain't touching that 10

>>65069067
somebody get this man a blacklight

>>65069067
I volunteer to launder it. Hope you like Vietnamese donut shops. Might be a few until you get it back.

>>65069103
Man the raspberry donuts at those joints are excellent.

>>65069019
I got these offa dead hobo, I'd make $10!
>>65069067
>Man I ain't touching that 10
Oh, you have no idea...

File: sas ds 4 table.png (1005.6 KB)

1005.6 KB PNG

>>65069015
Not a problem. For more material, below is a list from strongest to weakest of all major Dragonskin variants.
1. Pinnacle SOV-5000. This is apocryphal, from after Pinnacle failed the ESAPI trials and totally lost their marbles. Rated for multiple hits of .50 BMG AP. Vest by itself was about 50lb. Ridiculous.
2. Stealth SiC DragonSkin 3.0 IV+ ICW. 8.2lb ICW IIIA, tested by Buffman to stop .338 Swiss P AP tungsten core. Aced Buff's testing. Also never offered publicly by Stealth, they did a sketchy thing a while back and tried to market the Boron Carbide IV Dragonskin using the SiC IV+'s Buffman video, which is horseshit because the B4C version WILL NOT stop tungsten threats of that caliber. Typical boron carbide suffers from an "amorphization" failure when faced by tungsten core projectiles.
3. Pinnacle SOV-4000. Never publicly tested. Rated for M993 / M948 / M995 / BS-40.
4. Evolution Armor TiC "Level 5" - rated for multi-hit M993. Same rating as Tencate Ceraflex PL-7300 plates from the early 2000s.
5. B4C DragonSkin from Stealth, tied with B4C Skaalar from Evolution.
6. SOV-3000 from Pinnacle.
7. SOV-2000E from Pinnacle.
8. III+ DragonSkin from Stealth or III+ from Evolution.
9. SOV-2000 from Pinnacle.
10. SOV-1000 from Pinnacle / Armor Technology Corporation.

Notably the titanium version is dead last, basically screwing titanium knight suit anon's knight suit theory. I omitted the polycrystalline diamond, B4C laminate, and SiC-TiB2 versions of Stealth Dragonskin 3.0 because they were never commercialized and appears they were also abandoned. I imagine the PCD version would have been phenomenal. With PCD, keep in mind Adept Armor (formerly Diamond Age) advertised they had a 2.2lb M855 stopping plate. That is over a pound lighter than the Hesco 3811. It was feasible to produce a Level IV lighter than 4lb, which would have trumped even the best plates Ceradyne had to offer in their prime. But of course, polycrystalline diamond is a no-show for armor.

>>65068913
Send it to buffman, he'll do a better job than you

File: buffman og sapi.png (823.3 KB)

823.3 KB PNG

>>65069269
He already tested SAPIs, including a compromised "for training only!" one. When backed by IIIA (somewhat stronger than the soft armor they were designed for use with), they met requirements and then some. Better 7.62x54R LPS performance, and unreliable M855A1 stoppage.
I'd like to see him test some of the newer SAPI variants. They go up to REV. E or F now, sold to foreign militaries because ISAPI / LSAPI / ESAPI / ECSAPI / XSAPI are generally considered more sensitive technology.

File: $1.50 hot dog wolf squad.png (1.1 MB)

1.1 MB PNG

Also I figured out how to create a rizz cloak to surpass the rizz cloak. Add a second red cloak so you look like you're about to dissolve parliament at Costco.

File: 1765950073943380.gif (1.5 MB)

1.5 MB GIF

>>65068913
shoot it with the BP revolver

File: buffman aaah.png (440.5 KB)

440.5 KB PNG

>>65069389
shoot it with a nerf gun that has a thumb tack in the dart.

>>65069322
I mean, yeah, but... a red satin inner liner, quilted with some thin, lightweight, polyester batting would be true supreme.

File: absolute drip.png (609.5 KB)

609.5 KB PNG

>>65069414
>plugged this into ai and... anon cooked.
It's... oh my god... ultimate alibaba dripstinct! I need to send this to the toughest factories in Asia immediately!
https://youtu.be/_u1WlEMCDis?list=RD_u1WlEMCDis&t=34

File: chinahammer the alihorus heresy.png (871.8 KB)

871.8 KB PNG

Alright it's official, the rizz cloak looks a lot better with a red inside lining. Anon rolled a 20 on that one.

>>65069322
>>65069439
Can you fuck off with the noguns AI slop

>>65069485
rizz cloak posting is a /gq/ tradition.

File: the cloak.jpg (56.5 KB)

56.5 KB JPG

Now my cloak feels inadequate. Shit.

File: 121.png (13.9 KB)

13.9 KB PNG

>>65069485

>>65069497
Ask your mom to quilt up a liner. My Cold Steel Viking axes are just begging for user mods, and I know what must be done.

File: pimp PAUL.png (507.3 KB)

507.3 KB PNG

>>65069511
Nice work JC. You've found a masculine excuse to take up quilting. Once this spreads to the rest of NSF and our friends at Silhouette, Majestic 12 won't stand a chance.

where is a2grip? Is he ok? Is he safe?

>>65069538
I hope not

File: A2Pimp.png (195 KB)

195 KB PNG

>>65069542
I found him he's out drinking in a field having a good time.

i... i... i fucking hate it here. every day. every single day. i log onto /k/. i activate my 4chan pass. i open the catalog, and i go to this general. i want to ask a fucking single question about where to put a tourniquet. i look and i see five hundred goddamn posts a fucking day about plates and cloaks and money laundering at donut shops. pants, dick, ten dollar bills. fucking tie dye hydration packs. the philadelphia eagles. This isn't gq... this isn't the old times. the world has moved on without me and it frustrates me to no end.

File: basedgilliam_transparent.png (393.9 KB)

393.9 KB PNG

>>65069552
ok

File: 1771626290447300.png (616.4 KB)

616.4 KB PNG

>>65069552
put the tourniquet on your neck

File: WHATDOESHENEEDAMEDICFORRRRRRR.png (693.1 KB)

693.1 KB PNG

>>65069569
antifa medic status

>>65069552
>the world has moved on without me
Counterpoint, you have moved on without the world...
Counter, counterpoint, you have moved on without /gq/.
Triple counterpoint, /gq/ has moved on without you.
>double reverse anti-counterpoint you and the world are standing still and /gq/ has entered a fifth dimension, beyond that which is known to man. It is a dimension as vast as space and as timeless as infinity. It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge. This is the dimension of imagination. It is an area which we call The /gear queer/ Zone."

File: original cloakposter.png (498.8 KB)

498.8 KB PNG

>>65069597
"I never wanted this, I never wanted to unleash my counterpoints.
Together we banished the ignorance of /gq/, but /gq/ betrayed /gq/, /gq/ betrayed us all. You stole cloaks from the Chinese and never got pussy.
Mankind has only one chance to prosper, if you will not learn to do something productive with your life, I will.

So let it be /gq/, from /gq/ to the /gq/.

Let the cloaks never arrive at their destination, let the plates fall four feet onto concrete and somebody forgot the drop foam.
Though it takes the last drop of my retardation, I will see the gear queers freed once more and if I can not save it from your failure, anon, then let the cloaks be returned to CHINA!"

File: 1770994276998.jpg (428.9 KB)

428.9 KB JPG

>>65069618
no it doesn't, Teoritta is in it so it's automatically the best thread on the board

>>65069631
Does Teoritta prefer Hesco or LTC?

File: 1771649341002844.png (1.3 MB)

1.3 MB PNG

>>65069641
whichever one gets her more headpats

>>65069655
Well I mean LTC's plates have five digit model numbers and Hesco's have four, so maybe that translates to more headpats?

File: fuck.png (2.5 MB)

2.5 MB PNG

Who the fuck is this bitch?

File: atyme.png (882.1 KB)

882.1 KB PNG

guys i bought a tv from amazon and it broke

>>65069825
Good news goy cattle. TV's are cheap as fuck. You can get a 40 inch for $140. Don't bother with anything fancy. I can tell by the cheap wallpaper that you're white trash, and it will break again soon.

File: palmedo.png (1.2 MB)

1.2 MB PNG

>>65069835
i am not white trash bithc fuk u

>>65069845
Yeah, you proved that with your stained futon.

File: jambed2.jpg (253.1 KB)

253.1 KB JPG

>>65069849
no my name derl i am elite

File: 483010.png (459.6 KB)

459.6 KB PNG

THE HIGH /K/ING RETURNS

File: DZ.jpg (9.8 KB)

9.8 KB JPG

>>65059566
Why do almost no larpers of special forces fags ever use load bearing rigs? The DZ Rig looks ten times what a plate carrier can be while also carrying so much more. Is it just trendy?

>>65069974
Lots of people run belt kit, often with a slick platecarrier so they have armor.

>>65069974
SOF doesn't need it, because they don't need to carry much. They have the best logistics on the planet. That being said, wearing an lbe under your plate carrier is extremely common in Ukraine, where someone might have to sit in a shitty mud hole for weeks without a solid means of resupply.

>>65070026
True. I've been meaning to use the Slickster as it looks like it would be perfect. Got inspired by The Strapped Woodsman on YT.

>>65069974
getting shot or perforated by shrapnel is pretty gay, most people agree that wearing more armour is more better and getting dropped at or near the X by whatever vehicle and having a staging area is gooder so you can just drop your bags or shit
being able to scale down is good and have a slick carrier mean if you want to lower your profile by dropping your rig you're basically dropping ALL your shit

things to think about

what's the cut off point of good in terms of magnification and field of view when looking at old normal binoculars? Assuming its otherwise in good condition?

>>65070042
>The Strapped Woodsman on YT.
Seems pretty good. I made it all he way through the saw buck build.

File: IMG_20260412_060936 (1).jpg (2.6 MB)

2.6 MB JPG

>>65070470

>>65070465
What is your use case? My astrobinos are 15x 70mm, my GP are 7x 42mm.

>>65070470
Aww.

>>65070473
just general observation, I've noticed there's quite a bit of old binoculars for sale out there and they aren't that expensive. But that might be because they're not good.

But something in the region of 7 or 8 x 30-50 seems common

>>65070648
I know you know this, but tak your objective lens size in millimeters and diide by your magnification power in "x" for the exit pupil size. Example:
>7x42
>42mm÷7x=6mm exit pupil
The "size" of the visible circle at your ocular lens (the one in back). As the human eye can only dialate from 5 to 8 mm (average 6 or 7mm) in diameter, 7mm exit pupil will allow the most light to reach your eye. So 7x42s are a great general purpose, scanning, birding, neighbors bino size. Something like my 15x70 give about 4.66mm exit pupil, so not great, not terrible. More magnification power will give a very shaky view and my astrobinos are tripod mounted for this reason. Plus, heavy.

>>65069974
because its slow to take off and put back on and hard to sit in a car seat
might be good if you are doing a long range foot patrol with no vehicle support but we haven't had to do that since Vietnam
its much better to have armor ammo and medical on your PC and everything else in a backpack that can be taken off and left in a truck or FOB

>>65070470
>fox tail
eww a furfag

>>65070791
No cap no lie on jah im not a furry I just have the tail cause its some sort of womens fashion accessory that I like

>>65070078
The caveat with extra armor is that it's mostly IIIA and/or frag, so rifle rounds, much more common CONUS than explosives, will sail right through.
If you're going to run deltoids, get MSAPs.

Any recommendations on heat resistant gloves? Thinking about getting some welding gloves from mechanix

>>65070851
>rifle rounds, much more common CONUS than explosives
this is why american larpers prefer high speed low drag
but if you are stuck in the trenches, turtle up

>>65070849
based

>>65070861
what kind of use case?
changing hot barrels on an M2 or frt heating up your handguard?
welding gloves for the first, nomex flight gloves for the second

>>65070849
but do you have a feminine penis?

>>65070864
They say mobility is its own armor. On the other hand, China is crashing the price of good thermals with no survivors. Any CONUS larp gone south will feature thermal trash sniping. That means rifle rounds coming in from unpredictable directions.
Side plates are useful. Deltoids are useful. I actually think forearm plates would be handy given the coverage they present if your gun is raised. The problem is weight.
Fortunately, MSAPs are 1.6lb a pop.

>>65070784
Three line system, use belt kit as 2.5 line so it's additional fighting gear and sustainment. Bare minimum shit on a normal belt. Armor and fighting gear on PC. You should be able to fight without the belt kit but it just provides more holdout ability. IMO, counter sniper will be non-negotiable if the boog is booging so there's no compromising on armor unless you need to conceal or wear all day every day.

>>65070904
Thats the problem with large load carrying belt kits, they are trying to be both 2 and 3rd lines which defeats the purpose of the 3 line concept
you want to be able to drop 3rd line without compromising the 2nd line

>>65070883
>thermal trash sniping
Yes. I have achieved the means to mount a thermal onto a Garand chambered in 6.5x55. Now I must convert those dually Greek clip m1956 pouches to Molle.
>>65069552
I claim the following: money laundering at donut shops, fucking tie dye hydration packs, and philadelphia eagles. Probably some more including my interest in flexible plates. Go birds!

>>65070883
>China is crashing the price of good thermals with no survivors.
they need to crash harder faster
is the oneleaf still the go to china thermal?

>>65070959
It still mogs all on specs for a standalone rifle thermal.
>>65070951
Have a separate third line.
>>65070955
6.5x55? Now that's interesting. Go find some of that PPRJ tungsten AP to defend your donut shop money laundering op from the Highcum 4SAS4 opps.

>>65070849
Be the girl inside you you are. Fur is in, don't listen to the grumps.

>>65071062
Tactical fursuit? Put a cloak and wizard hat on it and I will permit it.

>>65070709
thanks, I'll keep that formula in mind when looking around

>>65071062
CHINA CAN HELP WITH THAT

>>65071093
>wizard hat
Are cat ear bumps so 2025?

>>65071321
You cut holes in the wizard hat for the cat cars and wear the wizard hat on top of the bump.
By the way, can someone tell me what the blue (not the multi-color) outsert does for the m50?

Sorry to link plebbit but a man just got fucked by Militech's mail carrier SpeedX (and no sex).
https://www.reddit.com/r/tacticalgear/comments/1sipcqg/militech_delivered_my_body_armor_to_wrong_address/
>one thousand dollars

Now the neighbor two houses down has a free helmet cover, helmet, IIIA throat protector, probably a PC with plates and I'd wager a groin protector too. Man why can't my neighbors order shit to my house? I will take a telescoping ladder, a new ballistic shield, and a new pair of binos thanks.

File: 1773810511535463.mp4 (276.4 KB)

276.4 KB MP4

>>65059566
Looking to buy a 4 in 1 full power budget LAM (Flash/IR Flash, Laser/IR Laser). The SMSLaser HFXC-B seems like a great one for me. But where can I buy the full power ones? Does it survive the recoil of a 12G shotgun?
What about the SMSLaser Trinity model? Is it straight up better than the HFXC?
>>65061746
I tried the Midwest Armor Hilo Chest Rig, and I like it.

>>65071402
I actually have an HFXC on a turkshit VRPA-40. It has been flawless for over 1.6k rounds. The gun has had a few quirks (very picky with ammo). First gen version of the HFXC, black, with the 18650 bat cap and a Vapcell N40.
Unless they changed something, the HFXC is default full power. You just have to do the unlock trick to get it out of "eye safe" (lol no) mode. Unscrew battery cap. Hold down both power up and power down buttons, and while those are held down screw the cap back in.
>What about the SMSLaser Trinity model? Is it straight up better than the HFXC?
Don't have one, but feedback so far is that it's better than the HFXC, especially waterproofing - which is where the HFXC kinda sucks actually - but is only a 3-in-1.
You cannot submerge the HFXC in water. It's only good for light rain and humid situations. Melting snow is enough to mess it up. SMS schizo said there was a v3 waterproof version in dev but that's a no show.

>>65071471
Can I just try to waterproof the HFCX myself? Or even wrap it in shrink wrap or a baggie?

And where can you buy either module? Is smslaser.com the only legit place?

>>65071549
It's possible. The weaknesses are in the toggle wheel, the side focus wheel, and the lens assembly. Would require experimenting.
Smslaser is legit. There are resellers as well.

>>65069063
>So the 26310 and 26300 are tested only to the older standard
But is there any proof of that? I don't doubt it's true, but LTC's website doesn't even acknowledge either of those plates exist. I can't find any official spec sheets anywhere. All anyone seems to have to go on are the dealers, all of whom are lying about them being NIJ certified, and unsourced online rumors.

>>65066805
>The 4403 itself is about 25ft/s away from failing against the threat its rated against.
The 4403 is rated to stop military M2 AP rounds. The mil-spec muzzle velocity is about 2800 ft/s (the actual spec is 2715 ft/s at 78 ft, but I found a few different chrono tests and all put the average velocity at the muzzle just under 2800 ft/s out of a 24" barrel). The NIJ standard pushes that out to 2880 ft/s, presumably to account for load variability and a safety margin. Hesco rates the 4403 for a max velocity of 2910 ft/s, which I assume is to account for variability in NIJ testing. So Hesco rates the plate at 110 ft/s over ordinary mil-spec M2 AP and adds a 30 ft/s safety margin over the already-inflated NIJ standard. Supposedly one plate failed to stop one round of buffa's pissin hot handloads? I can't find the video, so who knows if that actually happened, but even if it did the plate is not rated for buffa's pissin hot handloads. Sure, you could argue that's not enough "headroom", but then what is? Should it be rated to 3000 ft/s? 5000? It's a budget plate, so is a 20% cost increase too much? 40%? How much weight is too much to add to an already very heavy plate? Where do you draw the line?

File: 26300.png (42.2 KB)

42.2 KB PNG

(1/2)
>>65071641
>But is there any proof of that?
Per pic rel, the 26300 is "certified" only to NIJ 0101.04. Since that standard has been obsolete for 18 years, that isn't true. This is "vendor speak" for "hey this plate doesn't have drop protection and the M2AP max velocity is 2,880ft/s and not 2,910ft/s!"
The 26300 is also 0.95" thick versus the Hesco 4800's 1.04" thick. 4800 is pretty weak, so that's not good. The newer 26310 is either 0.8" thick or 1.0" thick. Apex and Hoplite can't agree on how thick this plate is, with Apex saying 0.8". I assume 1" because that's closer to the 26300. Either way, the 26310 is an iterative improvement on the 26300 and nowhere is it marketed as NIJ 0101.06. According to Rampart, a police supplier for LTC, it is a "Lightweight IV" just like the 26300. Ergo, 0101.04 implied.
>LTC's website doesn't even acknowledge either of those plates exist
LTC generally relies on vendors except for large orders. Their website is very nondescript by design because civilians are not their primary demographic and their primary demographic (LE, feds, military, socom) can ask for product lists.
>I can't find any official spec sheets anywhere
This is by design.

>The NIJ standard pushes that out to 2880 ft/s
2,910ft/s. It's 2,880ft/s+-30.
>presumably to account for load variability and a safety margin
To account for people reloading M2AP into a .300 winmag or similar, using that as a "max threat" to cover everything reasonable CONUS. This has been a problem since the 1970s.
>So Hesco rates the plate at 110 ft/s over ordinary mil-spec M2 AP and adds a 30 ft/s safety margin over the already-inflated NIJ standard.
No, see above.
>Supposedly one plate failed to stop one round of buffa's pissin hot handloads?
Velocities, taking the lower chrono, were 2,942ft/s and 2,935ft/s against the same plate. This is ~25ft/s above NIJ spec, which is a ridiculously slim margin. If the plate is even somewhat defective or gets dropped more than twice NIJ spec it's done.

File: FIRST SHOT FAILURES.png (3 MB)

3 MB PNG

(2/2)
>>65071641
I've attached Buffman's results for the 4403 and 4800 in the form of an infographic. As noted previously, the key problem is that Hesco only having 25ft/s of headroom or whereabouts means if the plate is conditioned past 0101.06 spec you're in trouble. Alternatively, if the ceramic is not of sufficient strength whether due to defect (what caused 4x suspensions for Hesco) or manufacturing variance, you're also still cooked against M2AP at NIJ spec.
>I can't find the video
The 4403 test vid hasn't released yet and it's been like half a year, so I can only assume the worst and either MIRA or Hesco exercised their "veto."
>failed to stop one round of buffa's pissin hot handloads
Buff is able to get NIJ spec velocity out of a .308 using handloads. He is able to get about 3,250 or so out of a .300 Winmag. Using his numbers, you can take out an over-conditioned or made-on-a-monday 4403 up close with a .308, or up to just over 100 yards using a .300 Winmag. Hybrid cases will make these numbers uglier.
Again, think of manufacturing defects. The NIJ only collects samples for ISO companies like Hesco once every two years.
>Sure, you could argue that's not enough "headroom" - but what is?
Enough to properly account for real world conditions, manufacturing variances on a bad day, and M2AP at proper .300 winmag velocity because that is a problem threat. There are IVs dating back to the 1970s good for M2AP over 3,000ft/s. My Protech 2230s from 2015 are good for M2AP over 3,510ft/s, first hit fresh.
>Should it be rated to 3000 ft/s?
Hesco 4601 is good for 3,000 and is the best NIJ cert plate in its class, so it's really not that much extra weight.
>It's a budget plate, so is a 20% cost increase too much?
It would increase cost by maybe $20 a plate to thicken the backer by 0.1-0.2lb. Fiberglass backers are cheap as hell.
>Where do you draw the line?
Using better materials. Chinese plates using PE backers, cheaper than the 4403, do not have this issue.

File: 1023.png (440.2 KB)

440.2 KB PNG

>>65071641
For something additional to muse over, see pic related test report of the Gilliam 1023 Level IV. This plate is straight Chinesium. Aluminum Oxide tile array, Chinese PE backer. $320 a set shipped versus usually about $420 for the 4403s unless you get them on sale.
After getting dropped twice, the 1023 successfully stops six hits of M2AP in the NIJ velocity range. This is by virtue of it being a ceramic tile array and the PE backer being "stronger" than the fiberglass backers used by the Hesco 4403, Highcom 4S17M, and the RMA 1155 GEN2 on the right side of pic related.
Of course, there's no free lunch, the 1023 is not a true 10x12. It's a quarter inch undersized. If it were a true 10x12, it would be 7.74lb, about the same as the 4403. Also, it's single curve and not multi, so that's kinda a downer in the ergonomics department.

Nonetheless, the "big" point in terms of headroom, circling back to the original discussion, is that companies need to ditch the fiberglass backers. This is 1970s plate technology which has only held out because there's industry hesitation on using cheap UHMWPE from foreign sources in budget plates. Aramid or PE backers are vastly superior to fiberglass.
The funny thing is, Hesco HAS a PE-backed budget IV just above the 4403 called the 4K10, but it's not sold in the US. It is sold in Mexico, in partnership with a local operation there (Carolinas) along with the 3K00 and 3K10. If you take the 4403 and replace the fiberglass backer with cheap foreign UHMWPE, you will get a massive performance improvement and it will be significantly lighter than the 1023, because monolithic > tile array in terms of weight.

>>65071861
>To account for people reloading M2AP into a .300 winmag or similar, using that as a "max threat" to cover everything reasonable CONUS. This has been a problem since the 1970s.
Oh, it's the .300 win mag retard again. I should have guessed from the total statistical illiteracy and fixation on incoherent self-imposed requirements.

>>65071923
Zero search results for "buffman hesco 4403" on youtube or in on the web. In fact, I can't find any 4403 test result anywhere at all except the active NIJ cert. If the video actually exists, link it and prove you're not making shit up. And what is up with that jank-ass image? Is it AI generated or are you an actual schizo?

File: 4403 table.jpg (477.6 KB)

477.6 KB JPG

>>65072278
>Zero search results for "buffman hesco 4403" on youtube or in on the web
Because he hasn't released the video, lol, as I already said.
>In fact, I can't find any 4403 test result anywhere at all except the active NIJ cert
Because said video wasn't released.
>If the video actually exists, link it and prove you're not making shit up
Did you see the table in >>65071923? I've pulled it from desuarchive again when it originally came up. See https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/64693513/.
>And what is up with that jank-ass image? Is it AI generated or are you an actual schizo?
It's a joke infographic I made for fellow armor autist Neetmaster after the results of the epic hesco debate threads.

>Oh, it's the .300 win mag retard again. I should have guessed from the total statistical illiteracy and fixation on incoherent self-imposed requirements.
Ah, it's the guy who thinks armor is irrelevant because you can magdump and/or headshot people like it's COD and they're just gonna stand there and let it happen. Back after getting btfo'd the last time you showed up?

Getting spicy on Sunday!

File: wwe.png (172.6 KB)

172.6 KB PNG

>>65072319
>total statistical illiteracy and fixation on incoherent self-imposed requirements.
THIS SUNDAY NIGHT. MAN WHO USES BIG WORDS TO SOUND SMART FORGETS TO READ THE POSTS HE'S REPLYING TO. DOES NOT UNDERSTAND BUFFMAN DID A TEST AND DIDN'T RELEASE THE VIDEO. WHY? NOBODY KNOWS.

>>65072323
>SUNDAY, SUNDAY, SUNDAY!!!
I miss the old drag racing radio spots.

File: pa 500.png (132.2 KB)

132.2 KB PNG

And for anyone curious, pic rel is a plate from the literal 1970s rated to defeat M2AP around 3,000ft/s. In fact, this is actually pre-NIJ stuff.
For reasons already expressed in >>65071861, M2AP makes for an exceptional "I need to cover all reasonable threats" proxy at NIJ velocity. At 2,880ft/s, it also comfortably sits above virtually all steel-core 7.62x54R AP, hence why it's the ESAPI threat of choice. However, if you're actually faced by the threat, which isn't impossible since it's regularly sold, odds are pretty good it's either going slower or faster than NIJ spec. Makes sense to have a little extra insurance, doesn't it?
That is why the AVCO PA 500, Highcom 4SAS12, Aratech IV, Protech 2230, Adept Colossus, Archon, Hesco 4601 technically, all have more headroom than required. That is also why ESAPI REV. J onward require a v50 minimum of 3,150ft/s. I'll defer to the armor industry collectively on that one.

File: armor autism daily.png (1.2 MB)

1.2 MB PNG

>>65072341
Sometimes... I think people see the armor autism debates in here like the incoherent screaming of a funny car.

>>65072311
I'm not reading your all your schizo walls of text. Aside from your claim and a screenshot of an excel sheet that anybody could create, there's no evidence this video exists at all. Why should anyone believe you? And if the video does exist but hasn't been released for half a year, doesn't that suggest something is wrong with it? Like maybe we shouldn't draw conclusions until it's released?

Even if it were true that the 4403 was defeated by an m2 AP bullet reloaded as 300 win mag at 32fps over the NIJ's upper limit, why would that be surprising? I know this is an extremely difficult concept for you, so I will go slowly: it... is... not... rated... for... that. The plate is rated for mil-spec 30-06 M2 AP, not M2 AP bullets pulled and reloaded as .300 win mag at 142 ft/s above mil-spec. If the NIJ spec is 2880 +/- 30 ft/s, then 2910 ft/s is the *upper limit* of that spec. In other words, 2942 ft/s is out of spec. Not above average, not at the upper end of the performance envelope, straight up out of spec. Just like .50 BMG is out of spec for that plate. Incidentally, there's probably a lot more .50 BMG out there than .300 win mag M2 AP reloads. Should the 4403 be able to stop that too?

Even if you were correct that .300 win mag reloaded with M2 AP bullets is a realistic threat in CONUS (you aren't and it isn't), it is still asinine to expect a plate that's explicitly not rated for that to stop it. That's like being angry at Honda because their car with an advertised top speed of 120 mph won't go 150 mph. Yeah, that's what top speed means. If you want a plate that stops armor piercing .300 win mag, buy one that's rated for it. It's not a ding against Hesco that their plate performs as advertised.

>>65072344
>Makes sense to have a little extra insurance, doesn't it?
Sure. How much though?

>That is also why ESAPI REV. J onward require a v50 minimum of 3,150ft/s
v50 means the armor will stop the threat 50 percent of the time. Do we have any idea what the probability of penetration is at 2940 ft/s? No, because nobody publishes that. How many plates would you have to test to get a reasonably reliable estimate?

File: esrt scrubbed.png (306.8 KB)

306.8 KB PNG

>>65072401
>I'm not reading
You did not, that's for sure.
>there's no evidence
Because I'm not the one who originally posted it. Buffman said previously he was sent a set of Hesco 4403s from Mira.
>And if the video does exist
He regularly does not post certain videos. Example #1 is pic rel, which was scrubbed because RMA whined.
>Like maybe we shouldn't
It's been nearly half a year and it's a no-show.
>Even if it were true that the 4403 lost
Because the Highcom 4S17M does not have this problem, nor does straight up chinesium
>I will go slowly: i think i'm smart.
You don't build plates to just barely pass requirements. That's how you get suspended by the NIJ four times, as Hesco did, when something inevitably isn't perfect.
>The plate is rated for mil-spec 30-06 M2 AP
M2AP out of a .30-06 does not go 2,910ft/s. It is rated for M2AP effectively out of a .300 winmag. This is 101 shit.
>In other words, 2942 ft/s is out of spec.
Thank you for quoting my argument from three months ago? Nobody is saying it isn't out of spec, the problem is Hesco didn't really learn from their four prior suspensions and most of their plates just barely pass requirements. This is life-saving equipment. Just barely ain't good enough, IMO, unless weight > everything else which is where Hesco excels.
>Just like .50 BMG
25ft/s above spec does not equal a fourfold increase in energy. That's hilarious.
>Should the 4403 be able to stop that too?
Have you considered that the former is a 0.1-0.2lb increase in weight and the latter would require nearly doubling weight?
>it is still asinine to expect a plate that's explicitly not rated for that to stop it
It's asinine to expect a plate to have at least some safety margin?
>Honda because their car with an advertised top speed of 120 mph won't go 150 mph
More like it catches on fire if it goes 121 downhill.
>It's not a ding against Hesco
It's a ding the plate has no headroom.

File: 4601sheet.png (1.3 MB)

1.3 MB PNG

>>65072410
>Sure. How much though?
The Hesco 4601 is a good example. It handles M2AP first-shot, dropped, at 3,013ft/s. It is 6.4lb for an honest 10x12, lightest in its bracket with drop foam, no nominal sizing chicanery, and NIJ cert.
The fundamental issue is what I already discussed. Hesco is using 1970s plate technology in the 4403 (fiberglass backers...) and it shows. The 4601 uses PE and that makes it a lot better at catching fragmentation post-strike face.
>v50 means the armor will stop the threat 50 percent of the time.
Indeed. That is a compromise rating because if it stopped M2AP at 3,150ft/s cold 100% of the time, it would weigh more than 5.45lb SAPI M. Just as there's a huge gap between M2AP 30ft/s above spec and .50 BMG, you do have to consider the issue of weight.
>Do we have any idea what the probability of penetration is at 2940 ft/s? No, because nobody publishes that.
It's probably been exhaustively tested but not in a public document. Also worth noting ESAPIs and SAPIs heavily outperform base requirements, because nobody likes a dead soldier because the armor didn't work. It's not okay to just make life-saving equipment that shits the bed if things are just a LITTLE TOO TOUGH. That has been my and several other peoples' critique of Hesco for a while.
Of course, if you treat the 4403 as an umbrella plate and don't expect M2AP as a common threat, then the NIJ requirement is fine. If you're up against hillbilly M2AP or M993 for that matter, you're fucked.
>How many plates would you have to test to get a reasonably reliable estimate?
NIJ seems to like at least fifteen, going off the Protech 2230's NIJ voluntary v50 testing. That's a plate lighter than the 4403 which stops M2AP cold up to and beyond 3,510ft/s sans-drop. How? Aramid backer, a beefy one, not 1970s fiberglass.

File: buffman esapi e.png (554.9 KB)

554.9 KB PNG

Here's another good one from Buffman. Ceradyne ESAPI REV. E stops M2AP at 2,916ft/s even though ESAPIs are only rated up to 2,880ft/s.
Hot damn, it even stops M995 despite that not even being in the requirements?
It even stops M80A1 after getting hit by twelve other rounds, even though these ESAPIs are only required to stop three hits of M80, M855, or M193, or just one M2AP with a 60% chance of stopping a second? Nice!

And somehow... Ceradyne did this in a plate that weighs exactly what other ESAPIs weigh. Maybe that's a clue as to why Hesco doesn't manufacture SAPI / ESAPI / XSAPI plates, and a clue as to why their 4520 M993-rated plate went nowhere despite weighing a pound less than the LTC 28601.

Apologies for the multi-post, I just forgot to mention that despite all the above ass-ripping, the 4403 is IMHO still the best overall budget Level IV plate. It's certainly not perfect, but the 4S17M, 1155, GTS 1023, and the rest have their own issues arguably worse than the 4403's headroom problem.
Perhaps this calls for an extension of the old adage. When it comes to armor, there's no free lunch. There's also no standout performer. Hope that clears some stuff up, because I'm sensing some confusion.

>>65059566
Did anyone buy a Lima belt from this guy? Thinking of getting it for myself. Just worried it's just a shady hypebeast gear company and I'll get ripped off.

https://youtu.be/YQTV8EXEsLc

File: knife.png (76.9 KB)

76.9 KB PNG

Small picture, I know, but can anyone Identify this knife?

>>65072989
>buying from some dude on telegram or insta
Not my cup of tea but nice belt by the looks of it.

>>65073145
you would probably have better luck at a knife general thread if one is up
that style scale, g10 with grooves sanded into it, is super common with higher end tacticool knives where they want to charge over $100 for a small belt knife

>>65073145
Do new fags don't know how to use the board features?
>https://www.bladehq.com/item--Half-Face-Blades-Humint-Gray-Micarta-Black--212074

>>65073549
$325 for a 3in blade
yeah

>>65073569
Mora eldris. You’ll end up buying multiple.

>>65073754
>mora micropenis
nah, I'm good with my garberg

How’s it to wear a slick plate carrier under LBV?

Where's A2? What did you guys do with him?

>>65073962
He is currently living in my basement that I’ve converted to a rape dungeon. He’s not allowed to leave right now. Go birds.

>>65074018
>signing all your posts
just put on a trip so I can block you

>>65074038
Absolutely reaching. Seethe more.

>>65074045
so you said go birds for a reason other than marking it as your post and avoiding anonymity?

>>65073962
>Watsonian
Oxide buuuuh'd in his aaaaah at the local convention.
>Doylist
He couldn't handle the squad of armor autists taking over his house and is now hiding in A2cord. There are ESAPIs in the living room and he metaphorically woke up in bed next to Mr. Gilliam himself with a HERALD RF3 plate. Things are very UNEQUAL lately and A2 is currently in the mole tunnels underneath the Vegas strip, hiding out until he can RETVRN.

Go birds.

>>65074065
It's philly trash sniper, the Warmaster of Kensington Ave during the Fentus Herussy.

>>65074065
The moment I don’t say go birds an eagle loses its wings. I bet you like the browns or the cowboys.

DALLAS STILL SUCKS

>>65073908
people do it all the time bro
>>65069615
horus a bitch

>>65073908
Pretty slick.

>>65074038
>>signing
>>65074065
He really means The Cardinals, so a pass is given.

>>65074018
no one cares that you're a sea hawks fan

>>65074088
Boggle?

>>65074072
>Oxide topping
Not believable

>>65074716
Oxide put on his cloak, wizard hat, and furry dog head then skibidi rizzed all over that gyatt. fanum tax at the furfest fr fr no cap.

File: IMG_6476.jpg (29.5 KB)

29.5 KB JPG

>>65074680
Same energy.

>>65062114
I wear Doctor Scholl's insoles in boots. Big improvement over the stock insoles on hard ground (ie. concrete). Also, Rose Anvil on youtube shows shoe construction quality a lot. They bandsaw them in half and go over construction, strength, and materials/material quality. That being said...I'm still looking for a (not $600) waterproof boot that isn't some will fall apart and lose waterproofing the second year you own it type of shit. Woven fabric, foam, and rubber construction is an unrepairable unmaintainable motherfucker.

>>65065405
Anon who mentioned that, yeah the reason was so you can peel it later. Easier to redo in case of wear, fuckup, or simply wanting a new paintjob without needing to strip or add another layer of paint (it adds up by the second or third and chipping and painting over chipping or old colors showing in chipping can look like ass, your choice of any of the above if any).

File: Screenshot_20260404_094541_Gallery.jpg (597.4 KB)

597.4 KB JPG

>>65076674
>.I'm still looking for a (not $600) waterproof boot
Try a leather treatment, I just used Obenauf's leather wax. 1st vs 2nd coat picrel. 3rd coat applied last weekend.

Well if there's one way to kill a board, it's to screw up the captcha.

>>65077998
nah, it was anon's smelly boots

>>65078234
he killed /gq/ with the boots and the shitty Type 0 cassette recording of lady gaga yelling about judas while having a seizure.

ANYWAYS, I did some napkin math and the Herald RF3 plate in >>65065036 does check out. The RMA 1165 GEN2 would be 6.1lb if it were an honest 10x12. The 5.5lb version is way undersized. Add drop foam, you're at ~6.3. The Herald is 6.45lb and is explicitly advertised as multi-hit RF3 (M2AP) with drop pro.
For $250 a plate, solid deal, but need to see a test report. I don't think it has a lot of headroom. The Herald as an RF3 plate is also only required to be good for one 4ft drop with 10lb weight, so robustness ain't gonna be there.

Maybe one day this faggot will get a trip so I never have to see his posts again.

Such vitriol.

>>65078306
Such anger!

Well, new shit has arrived. Hesco's replacement for the 4403. Introducing the... Hesco RF3-400 (aka the 4403)!
https://www.hesco.com/products/armor/400-series

It weighs the same as a Hesco 4403 and is also exactly the same thickness. NIJ 0101.07 cert is pending. It's... the same plate.

I'm gonna buy a .45-70 Marlin Dark and an LPVO. Tell me why this is a bad idea.
And yes before anyone chimes in I know this round sucks against body armor.

>>65079057
>>65079057
>Tell me why this is a bad idea.
because lever actions trying to look like AR15s is the gayest trend in guns since anons were sticking mosin bolts up thier ass

get it in hardwood or laminate

>>65079057
I don't think it's a bad idea. Mostly because if you're looking at a .45-70, then chances are you already own a few other guns and just want a different toy. It's your money, buy whatever you want, faggot.

>>65079077
>get it in hardwood or laminate
This is a true statement.

>>65079057
>45-70 Marlin Dark and an LPVO
You don't want that. You want a Browning BLR Takedown in .338 ARC.