>>23684655
Why was he such a bad pilot though?

>>23684870
Not everyone can be amazing at piloting. Ultimately he was an amateur, but he came up with a clever plan to defeat the Gundam by covering for his own weaknesses which shows his guts and intelligence can shine when he's fighting for something he truly cares for
He is a below average pilot, and maybe not the best soldier either, but he is a good person with a good heart, and he gave everything he had when he thought it truly counted. That's what made his loss so tragic.

>>23684897
He should've gone home and been a family man

>>23684909
War robs so many people of the lives they were truly meant for

>>23684870
He wasn’t though. By the time he died he only had a few proper sorties under his belt. Had he lived to Zeta he easily could have been on par with most of the non Newtype Argama crewmen. Some games even have him on comparable to aces like Shin Matsunaga.

>>23684943
>easily could have been on par with most of the non Newtype
Anon... that doesn't mean a thing

>>23684870
He took down the Gundam Alex which is a more impressive feat than a fraud like Jerid or Char could ever accomplish.

>>23684997
To be fair Christina was no Amuro either. She's just an old type trying her best in a machine not built for her kind. You can even see how she struggles in the simulator as the Alex was simply way too overturned for her to handle. She was basically handicapped, and had very few weapons available during her defense of the base

>>23684997
It was piloted by a woman

>>23684655
Literally died for no reason.

Did this take place before or during the OYW? I'm shocked that the Feddies were able to disarm the Zeon of nuclear weapons.

>>23684897
>He is a below average pilot
So is Chris.

>>23685304
A few days before the end.

>>23685310
You don't get tapped for test pilot school if you're not impressing people. From that alone you can infer she's pretty good.

>>23685313
Unfortunately, the new 0080 manga disproves that. Christina is only the test pilot only because the first two test pilots failed, the first one was reassigned for being incompetent and temporarily having a mental breakdown in the cockpit and almost firing on an ally, while the second test pilot turned out to be a Zeon spy.

>>23685339
Fortunately, I don't care what some manga made decades later and retelling the story through another writer's eyes says.

>>23685348
Then I can also infer that despite having the superior MS, she made the tactically wrong decision to intentionally walk into an enemy trap just to avoid civilian harm, and still only barely came out alive against a Zaku that wasn't restored to peak performance.

She's morally a good person, she might have good scores on paper, but she's not experienced at actual combat. For all the griping that people give Amuro about using the Gundam's abilities as a crutch, it absolutely applies to Christina as well.

>>23685359
Yeah, that's all reasonable. I never said she was an ace pilot or a battle-hardened vet or anything. I just think people talk about it like she's incompetent or something and that's not really supported by the show.
Both pilots in that fight are doing what they believe is more risky personally in order to protect the colony, and neither are really wrong either. It's part of the tragedy of the showdown.

>>23685304
The artbook MS ERA contains a scene heavily implied to be the EFSF boarding the ship tasked to nuke the side. At that point in the war with Zeon falling that completely apart I think some people would essentially go 'fuck this I'm not dying to commit one last warcrime'.

>>23685304
I rewatched the OVA in the last two days. Killing assigns the task of nuking the colony to one of his subordinates, but we don't really see what kind of a person that guy is. According to Bernie's dad who mentions being on a shuttle that was almost caught in the battle, the captain of the ship carrying the nuke surrendered after the escorting Zeon warship got sunk by the Feds. Maybe the guy just wasn't one of those super gung ho "death to the Federation" zealots and didn't want to commit a war crime. I guess he was more rational than fanatical and saw the perfect time to surrender without being personally responsible for killing a few million people, but also not appear to be a complete coward or traitor since he didn't immediately give up after encountering the Feds, but after already getting into a battle.

>>23684655
I always watch this on christmas and it makes me cry every single fucking time.

>>23685213
Ans he was piloting a Zaku. A Derilect Zaku at that.

>>23684997
To be fair char and Jerid fought kamille and amuro respectively the best pilots in history. Its like saying the runner up in the heavyweight world title fight is worse than the amateur belt winner

>>23684897
He could have been a good pilot, shiro Amada type with experience i think, unfortunately it wasn't in the cards because he was too good of a person to run away from a situation he felt was worth sacrificing his life for

>>23685001
Christina had plenty of extra practice while doing the simulator runs and kicking Kampfer ass though.

>>23685798
Simulators don't mean jack.

>>23685374
I mean a lot of guys on Zeon already knew they were going to lose the war anyway, even fanaticism has it's limits indeed.

>>23684655
>He may not have had the most kills, but in my heart he was Zeon's best ace.
He was instrumental in a lot of ways to the UC as a whole. If he hadn't taken the Alex out of commission, Amuro would have gotten it and Sayla would have been in the Gundam, and Char would've been fucked.

>>23685572
>derelict
FTFY

>>23684655
Is this the best introduction to Gundam for normie friends?
Aside from forcing them to binge the original of course

>>23693131
Not at all.

>>23693131
A lot of its impact is in how it shows a different perspective from the usual. It is pretty short and broadly well executed, though, so if they're familiar with general mecha show formulae (but somehow haven't seen any Gundam, I guess), then maybe. If they don't know shit about giant robots at all, then I think it'd be a lot less effective.

>>23693173
>If they don't know shit about giant robots at all, then I think it'd be a lot less effective.
I believe otherwise; the fact that it's short and broadly well executed are precisely what make it an ideal introduction to the franchise for those not familiar with the genre.

>>23693251
Yeah, less good than it could be, but probably still good. Struggling to think of a better option.

>>23693282
What do you think should have been done better?

>>23693131
I will say that everybody I've introduced to Gundam with 0080 has refused to ever touch anything else from the series, while the ones I introduced through Zeta, SEED, and 00 all actually got into it.

>>23693336
I guess that shows what I know: nothing!

>>23693340
Idk, it's just a personal anecdote. I think it's just a bit of a sour note to start on.

>>23693336
>Zeta
The TV series or the compilation movie trilogy?

>>23693342
I figured that was the whole point of the OVA and war dramas as a whole. Apparently that's not what general audiences are looking for.

>>23693343
I was watching the TV series and my gf at the time joined in, and she ended up being a big fan and getting into gunpla and other shows.

>>23693336
>I will say that everybody I've introduced to Gundam with 0080 has refused to ever touch anything else from the series
And how many strikeouts is that?

>>23693336
Depends on whether they fall into the "clearly this is gundam DONE RIGHT, all the other stuff is toy commericals, but 0080 is mature!" pitfall. People do it for 08th "actually this is the only realistic war one!", and G "actually it's silly and wacky, all the other stuff sucks because they ask me to treat it seriously!" as well.

Lot of niggas want 0080 to be their cowboy bebop, "actually this is the only good one and I'm much more mature for only watching this!"

>>23693471
I figured it just had the fewest rough edges and/or thematic elements western viewers (Americans at least) would be likely to have hang-ups over.

>>23693445
5.

>>23685731
>he was too good of a person to run away from a situation he felt was worth sacrificing his life for

Except that he didn't needed to die and Bernie makes it clear that he could have just handled the proof of the incoming attack to the feds and live, he died because he wanted.

>>23693606
Evidently he thought feds would think he's psyopping with fake evidence and would detain him, or the bureaucracy would take too long to adjust for an incoming nuking, as the colony gets nuked

This time of year, it's Summer in Australia!

>>23693131
it's a decent side story that I like, but I won't recommend it as an introduction to Gundam.
The scope of the setting is small, theme of newtypism is absent and it lacks many signature elements of the franchise like char clone, ensemble cast on spaceship, war between various factions etc.
Just like >>23693336 I have seen something similar happening where people just watch it as if it's one of the few, if not only, Gundam entry worth watching. Classic 00s ignorance regarding the mecha genre.

>>23684966
Given that includes Yazan, that means a lot.

>>23693799
doesnt yazan commend bernie in one of the srw games for disabling a gundam with a obsolete MS?

>>23693131
it's probably the most divisive even among the gundamfags i know.
thunderbolt is probably a safer entrypoint

>>23693563
Did they state what about it they hated so much that they wouldn't give any other entries in the franchise the time of day?

>>23693336
damn wtf. 0080 was my entry in the series.

>>23684943
>By the time he died he only had a few proper sorties under his belt
That was explicitly his second sortie.
And all he did in his first was enter Side 6 and immediately get ambushed by a GM.
Bernie has less combat experience by the end of WitP than your average Gundam main character has after episode 1. And he was up against a Federation wunderwaffen in a slightly buffed up Zaku.

>>23693742
It is.

>>23684655
At least his death meant something. That's more than can be said about most Zeeks.

>>23703491
It didn't, though. That's the whole point, right? Everything would've been fine even if he didn't sacrifice himself, he just didn't know it.

Kill yourself

>>23704023
Who are you talking to?

>>23703808
For the colony. If he didn't take the Alex out of commission, Amuro would have gotten it.

>>23703526
Anyone got those in a readable res?

>>23703808
It meant something to Al.

>>23684655
who has the burger king crown pic?

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>>23685304
During. Zeon had already been driven off Earth after the battles of Odessa and Jaburo. The final fight happens two days after the Battle of Solomon, 5 days before A Baoa Qu, and 6 days before the end of the war. The leader of the Bernie's team talks about how the war will be over soon and that Zeon will lose before the raid.

>>23685374
Between the nuke ship leaving and getting captured, the Feds smashed Dozle's fleet at Solomon. Given that the nuke ship captain already had reservations, I could see him asking "what's the point?" Even the hardcore are going to question the bombing of an entire colony out of spite when the war isn't going to be won anyways.

>>23685366
The MS Era picture sure seems like it. The captain's costume is right and the date of 25 December matches up.

>>23684655
A real human bean.

>>23685374
While I'm sure he probably wasn't a fanatic like Killing, the Federation wasn't a slouch at the end of the war despite the fact they only job onscreen. As far as databooks are concerned Amuro's learning computer data turned GMs into killing machines. Zeon got their shit kicked in in the field while nearly half of GMs survived the OYW intact. Zeon's only saving grace was the Solar Ray taking out 1/3 of the entire federation space forces, which really fucked the Federation because its logistics was spread thin across earth and space and made it almost impossible to finish their island hopping strategy all the way to Side 3 and Granada.

>>23712396
Shouldn't Bernie be wielding an inflatable heat hawk? Or at the very least shouldn't the water gun be modeled after an MMP-80?

>>23714944
Humans aren't beans, humans are humans.

>>23717509
you're right..draw that

>>23717509
Shouldn't you be job searching?

>>23715229
What makes you think Killing was a fanatic?

>>23712396
Nice dildo.

>>23724155
That's a marshalling wand, you ignoramus!

>>23724155
>>23725243
it's a violet wand

>>23721342
>thinks I can draw
Insert screencap/gif of Al and Bernie laughing in the car here.

>>23722486
Don't need to; already got one.

>>23725985
What's that supposed to be referencing?

>>23684655
He did his best.

>>23729661
He did remarkably well, all things considered.

>>23727345
https://letmegooglethat.com/?q=violet+wand

>>23731148
Yeah, nah, I'm not gonna hazard the potential impact that'll have on screwgle's algorithms if it turns out to be something questionable.

I’ve watched this and some other Gundam but I kind of want to get into the meat now, should I watch the original series or the movies?

>>23732204
Why not both?

>>23732204
Either, your call. Both have their merits. If you want as much 0079 as you can get, watch the show. If you want a tighter experience, watch the movies.

>>23711154
That's what really got me the last time I rewatched it. Bernie's death was double meaningless, since Killing was going to launch the nuke regardless of Alex being destroyed, and of course the nuke being stopped before the fight. But the only person who knew this, and knew what Bernie thought he was fighting for, was a 10 year old kid who had to watch him die

>>23693336
If you start watching Gundam with a fast based ova like 0080 you will get whiplash from any next series. It's like immediately starting ZZ after watching zeta.
(ZZ is awesome I'm not hating on it)

>>23732480
I did that

>>23732150
Shoulda posted that meme reaction.

>>23706779
Not like he needed it in the end.

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>>23735816
You mean this one?

>>23684655
He's retarded. He could've given information about the nukes to the feddies and live. He could have escaped and then go back for Christina once the nuke failed.

There was no point in giving his life for the attack. The people who sent his team clearly sent them underprepared and underequipped for the task, then tried to nuke and kill the entire colony because they're sore losers. They clearly lack the moral integrity and character that he has, so trusting them to stop the attack because he destroyed the Alex was nonsense.
>>23684870
He's an oldtype.
>>23684897
Christina could barely handle the Alex. If Amuro was piloting it Bernie would've died instantly.

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>>23685359
> she made the tactically wrong decision to intentionally walk into an enemy trap just to avoid civilian harm, and still only barely came out alive
I think you need to work on your grammar as well as your logic. Saying "AND STILL" would imply she had the advantage in the situation but like you state she walked into the trap knowingly given up the edge her machine gave her. This if anything says more of her ability as a soldier than it does her ability as a pilot and even in that sense it's debatable.

>it absolutely applies to Christina as well.
Amuro and Chris are different situations. The Alex for all it's specs were actually working against her. The thing was fine tuned in a way that you needed Spider-man reflexes. I don't get why people still have such a hard time understanding this especially when the show comes right out and says it. Far too many power level shows have rotted people's brains to think that anyone who can't just explode a thousand units by standing around is a bad pilot. Especially when 0080 doesn't have plot armor.

>>23742843
He's not wrong, the Gundam still has the advantage in terms of specs and weapons for that fight. The ambush let Bernie take out the Alex's remaining functional gatling, but there's no reason the Gundam couldn't overpower the Zaku FZ in a pure melee fight.

>Amuro and Chris are different situations. The Alex for all it's specs were actually working against her.
..so how's that any different than what he was saying?

>>23742867
specs are not power level. And specs don't help if you can't make use of them because the machines a finicky bitch. And the Ambush made sure it wasn't a pure melee fight. Further this isn't some Wing shit were the Gundam is made out of magic plot metal.

>..so how's that any different than what he was saying?
Because the machine being tuned for a super hero doesn't convey the ability of a regular person if they can't make proper use of it. Pay attention to the actual context of the story and not some retarded DRRR GUNDAMS SHOULD BE TEH INVINCIBLE

>>23684655
If he got to grind more exp he could've become a Yazan-tier oldtype, he clearly had the brains for it

>>23743991
>specs are not power level
nigga that's a weird take

>And specs don't help if you can't make use of them because the machines a finicky bitch
again you just agreeing with the guy who said she's not a good pilot for the alex

>And the Ambush made sure it wasn't a pure melee fight.
literally the only weapon left bernie had was the heat hawk and you're telling he wasn't trying to force a melee fight?

>Because the machine being tuned for a super hero doesn't convey the ability of a regular person if they can't make proper use of it. Pay attention to the actual context of the story and not some retarded DRRR GUNDAMS SHOULD BE TEH INVINCIBLE
how come you're making a point different than >>23685348?

>>23744504
I thought oldtype referred to those harboring anti-newtype sentiment, not those who don't manifest newtype phenomena.

>>23747123
It's used both as an insult to that effect and just as a generic description of all those who aren't newtypes. Compare how people use "boomer".

>>23747169
Don't you mean Untermensch?

>>23740677
Yeah, this one.

>>23744504
Too bad his source media wasn't SRW.

File: sword2gunfight.gif (2.5 MB)

2.5 MB GIF

>>23685798
>Christina had plenty of extra practice [...] kicking Kampfer ass though.

>>23685304
>Literally died for no reason.
That's how war is.

>>23732480
>fast based

>>23725985
>violet wand

for some reason i read that as violent wad