>>97627761
There are no new big sci-fi settings

>>97627761
Would say a "Space America" faction.

>>97627906
Dark Elves are a thing anon. They were torture loving naval power who love war and slaughter who live in not!north america in the settings, who also broke away from their island founders to be a power in their own right.
Deldar are not meaningful different. Love to kidnap and torture people for the greater good, to feed dark eldar in settings, for national security irl. Massive divide in rich and poor in their society, their most powerful members love gorgeous and live much longer, they predate on their own young, dehumanise anyone who isn't them etc.

>>97627914
You've just described the entirety of western civilization, none of that is America specific.

>>97627920
American cultural hegemony. Everybody else is just copying.

>>97627920
My western country doesn't abduct people to torture's them in our intelligence agents torture camp black sites in a 3rd nations country to avoid the law.
Also my country isn't a powerful superpower in its own right and doesn't dehumanise anyone since its the most successful multicultural country on earth.

I can't think of any sci-fi setting warhammer has taken from other tahn vague sci-fi tropes like grey aliens and flying saucers since those arent in 40k at all

>>97627761
Trek.

>>97627929
>most successful multicultural country on earth.

>>97627929
Flying saucers I would hesitantly and with no real conviction point to Necrons; Matthew Arnold's report of "Flying saucers" mentioned half-moon shapes, and while the BFG fleet was mostly crescent, they're certainly flat.
>>97627957
Not exactly a major tabletop faction, but I would argue that Trek is (arguably was always intended to be) represented in the actual Rogue Traders. More gothic and twisted, yes, but still a ship and a small Senior Officer corps indulging in away team shenanigans. The 'Federation' ideal you could, if you squint, give that to Tau, or at least how they'd like to present themselves to the galaxy. I suspect some would mention the Eldar in terms of post-scarcity, but I've always felt they're more of a nod to some of those upper-class 'post-apocalyptic hippies' types in the more pretentious type of 70's film, like Zardoz.

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>>97627761
they took marines from star wars, but they didn't make a resistance militia from star wars

also avatar

>>97627957
That was humanity in the golden age of technology.

>>97627993
What nonsense. Trek is entirely and explicitly against both the trading and rampant imperialism that Rogue Traders engage in. Never mind that they ended up in the setting more or less by accident as the vestigial remains of the game Priestly originally wanted to make.
>>97628049
For one thing they aren't in 40k, more or less by definition. For another that's total bullshit because we know next to nothing about that era.

>>97627761
Is there really anything Star Wars? Chaos and Sith are both cartoonishly evil but there's enough difference in flavor that they aren't really the same thing.
>>97627957
In the lore there's a civilization called the Interex that was like the Federation, then the Imperium killed them all.
>>97628018
Not really, Space Marines were a thing before Lucas decided the stormtroopers were all clones.

>>97627761
>What's the biggest sci-fi franchise Warhammer 40K doesn't have a faction based on?

How do you define >based on?
Like obviously the Tyranids are based on Xenomorphs and Cadians were influenced by Starship Troopers. But what about something like Stargate and Tau, where if you look closely then you can see obvious design influences or references, but beyond the superficial there's not much more? What about things that are definitely unrelated, but are coincidently similar enough that parallels can be drawn? Like the Wraith from Stargate Atlantis and Dark Eldar, or Robo-Cop and servitors?

>>97627929
>My western country doesn't abduct people to torture's them in our intelligence agents torture camp black sites in a 3rd nations country to avoid the law
They do (or do something similar inhumane), you just don't know about it because they jangle multiculti newspeak and BIG BAD MURRIKA in front of you to keep you distracted.

On some level you even know this, which is why you're afraid to name your country and be proven wrong once anons dredge up the skeletons in your national closet.

>>97627906
Catachans

>>97628582
>What about things that are definitely unrelated, but are coincidently similar enough that parallels can be drawn? Like the Wraith from Stargate Atlantis and Dark Eldar
I think reavers from firefly and dark eldar are another one of those

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>>97627761
Dune
Star Trek

I dont know if you can say Aliens or Starship Troopers. Since both uses sci-fi tropes that you can throw Tyranids and Imperial Guard at them. But Tyranids are Starcraft and Imperial Guards are just WW2 armies.

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>>97628717
>Dune
Now there's an idea! They could be a desert dwelling army that strike fast with a fanatical religious fever.
They could look like pic related (it's some random art I found somewhere, no idea where it comes from...)

Or they could add some sort of "God" Emperor, or even some sort of mutant space navigators.

>>97627761
Star Wars
Star Trek

>>97628582
>Cadians were influenced by Starship Troopers
I don't see it. The immediate Rambo and Lawrence of Arabia references are noticeable ini the other original guard armies, but there's really nothing that ties Cadians to Starship Troopers, even any of the original commissars and their art don't go in the same direction as Troopers movie "commissar" and neither of them invented the concept of informal political officer

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>>97628835
>They could look like pic related

>>97627904
I was so pissed when Rebel Moon got hyped up as the next huge franchise and then it was total shit

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>>97628835
Dont know if you got the wrong picture and >>97628858 is the one you meant. But your picture show Tallarn Desert Raiders from the Imperial Guards.

>>97628853
I always had Cadians down as a combination of "modern-ish battledress" (as of the early 90s when the 'new' metal ones were released) and a continuation of the original Imperial Guard designs. Shame they didn't keep the universal sunglasses, really.

>>97627929
What country are you even thinking of

>>97628717
40k lifted abominable intelligence and navigators from dune

>>97628880
>Directed by Zach Snyder
Why did you ever believe it would be good?

>>97628717
>Dune
This is low effort bait

>>97628880
Haven't seen the whole thing but I did like a lot of the aesthetics. 40k meets star wars isn't a terrible look.

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>>97627761
Barsoom
Most of its influence filtered through star wars, dune, conan the barbarian and whatever.

>>97627914
>Massive divide in rich and poor in their society, their most powerful members love gorgeous and live much longer, they predate on their own young, dehumanise anyone who isn't them etc.
Considering recent events, that still very much applies to the British. Especially when their royalty partakes in this heinous shit. Though yes, we get to be the cool, sexy elves with a fucked up society.

>>97627957
eldar aren't space elves, they're magical vulcans

>>97627761
Battletech's mercenaries?

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>>97627761
Is there a faction based on SG1?
I can see some shared themes between Jaffa and necrons. But if you asked players what Necrons were based on I doubt many would say SG1.

Dr.who?

>>97628835
Dunno man, doesn't check out, those guys have lasguns. Dune is some of the strongest anti-lasgun propaganda ever written.

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>>97627761
Why stop at sci-fi? There are still plenty of historical groups to choose from.

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>>97627761
I wouldn't really call it a "big" franchise any more, but arguably I don't think they have any proper Matrix ripoff factions. I know people will try to say the Matrix Machines are Admech. But the only thing they really have in common is robot tentacles. Outside of that they are entirely different in their design, motives, and operations

>>97628018
milita from SW
>Any PDF unti can be considered milita
Avatar
>Primitive Xenos purged millennia ago

All 40K factions are based on a major enemy of the United States.
>Imperium: Nazi Germany-meets-Soviet Union (self-explanatory)
>Chaos: Confederacy (trust no one not even yourself)
>Eldar: Britain (irrelevant ancient empire that still thinks it's hot shit)
>Dark Eldar: Indians (irrelevant ancient people who can only raid pointlessly)
>Orkz: Middle-Eastern terrorists (can never wipe them out fully)
>Tau: Imperial Japan (self-explanatory)
>Necrons: China (ancient super empire that is waking up from a long sleep)
>Tyranids: Spain (self-explanatory)

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>>97628498
>Is there really anything Star Wars?

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How would you make some unique imperial guard for a shrine world?

>>97629724
40k was the result of Dune and Foundation being put into a blender along with some malt liquor

>>97627929
UK/Airstrip 1 arrest their own people for "Wrongthink" Germany let's 3rd party refuges abduct and torture the natives and call anyone racist for calling it out. Hell most of the EU outside of Poland and I think Italy basically do that shit. So tell me which one was your country. (So yeah they do.)

>>97627914
Sounds more like the EU. Especially the whole BDSM. Plus aren't Brussels all about that and shit videos and all.

>>97627914
An important thing about being based on is aethetics and stereotypical America does not at all match drukhari.
The closest I can think of is catachan but thats very specifically western forces (not just American) durning the vietnam war.

>>97627761
Unironically probably avatar.
Also, I dont think they've really done anything for Predator except that one new nids face.
Anyway, black mirror/twilight zone kind of, the matrix, and a half full of things that probably shouldnt could like Back to the Future, and Jurassic Park are about all that come to mind

>>97633099
There's far more 2000AD than Dune, and almost nothing from Foundation.

>>97633065
Papal Swiss Guard

>>97633287
Pretty much Catachan is basically "I watched Rambo and made a knock off group for my sci-fi setting that all about that."

>>97633295
....... Let's be honest, if they made a alien cat smurfs they be wiped in 2 turns. Hell the only reason they're not wiped in the movies is basically the humans are pulling a America in Vietnam/Iraq. Trying to be nice during the war and they eventually getting tired and bored of killing them all with all those rules and just fucking off.

>>97630482
Thousand Sons

>>97633065
Didn't the roleplaying 40k game do that with the maccabian jannisarries

>>97633287
>drukhari
Dark Eldar you newfag

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>>97627761
With how Necrons are now there isn't a /solely/ a soulless machine race anymore like Skynet/Kaylons. 40K is primed for one techpriest to touch shit he oughta not and let the DAoT AI out of the blackwall.
There's no elemental forces of nature races like the Hydrgoues/Faeros out of Sins of a Solar Empire.
>>97633295
>Unironically probably avatar.
Exodites could be that.

>>97631331
>let's have yet another samurai sci-fi

Depends
What cyberpunk about 40k?

>>97627914
>>97627929
Based. The US is going to start another war this week.

>>97633736
Hive cities like Necromunda.

>>97633344
It's also Predator.

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>>97633395
The only thing they have in common are some egyptian aesthetics. The whole thing with the goauld is that they don't really have supernatural powers, they are just pretending to be gods with superior technology while the Thousand Sons are the sorceror faction of 40k.

>>97633573
>wahhh they gave my generic faction name a lore-based one
I’ll never understand this mindset. I’ve played deldar since I started and I call them Drukhari now because it sounds better and gives them a more unique feel.

>>97633287
Catachan is absolutely based on American 80s action heroes. They even have their own Apone and old artwork always had a Catachan Stallone in the squad

>>97633295
>Avatar
Has zero cultural relevance. The franchise can't even get its own multimedia products launched, let alone inspire ripoffs
>predator
Striking Scorpions were absolutely based on Predator, and one could argue that Kroot leaned heavily on Predator "armor" design and a pinch of the whole high tech yet primitivist hunter-tism culture, even if it took next to nothing else.

>>97633702
>let's have yet another samurai sci-fi
Hell yeah

>>97634001
It sounds far worse, and the only people dumb enough to think it makes them unique are IP lawyers. It's just corpos trying to own ideas, like patent trolling.

>>97627761
Flash Gordon

>>97633754
Don't forget the Delta Force movie. It's that Action Special Forces Movie vibe. Would I say it's American. When you think Special Forces you tend to think American, but I don't think it really counts. That's like saying if they had a faction about Hockey does that make it American cause of Casey Jones, and the US winning the gold in both the guys and girls Hockey?

The Expanse?

>>97628717
>Dune
You cannot possibly be serious.
>Star Trek
The Interex. The closest besides them that actually have an army are the Tau, though they're just fascists with good PR.

>>97634640
I am serious. There isnt really a merchant empire that is tacticool desert focused.

Tau being Star Trek is a good pon5. Didnt thought about that. For me that was just Battletech/Gundam with a China communism Roman empire thing.

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>>97627761
Do we have anything like Babylon 5s Vorlons or Shadows? Eldar are like Minbari. Shadows are not like Tyranids.

>>97633314
didn't 40k start as
>rogue traders have adventures in space
>during a galactic dark age
>under a decedent empire founded on technology cultism
?

Asimov's Robot series and Foundation.
>but the Mechanicus
--are based on the cult of the nuke from Planet of the Apes, the catholics from Canticle for Leibowitz, Dilbert comic strips and British telecom support calls.

>>97635063
No.

>>97634441
Yes because Canadians lost the Mandate of the Rink the moment they sold their national soul to india

>>97634814
You realize like 90% of the Imperium is ripped directly from Dune, right? You could say there's no fremen analogue, but that's about all they're missing and easily rectified with a homebrew guard regiment of desert deathworlders

>>97628608
They're space Australia

>>97637984
Wrong. They're space American action heroes who colonized space Australia

>>97637965
I am not aware of this. For me Warhammer 40k is more 2000AD with StarWars and Aliens/Startrooper mixed in.

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>>97638035
>>97637984
South America?

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>>97639001
>>97637965
While Dune is just Colonial Britain in Space. Spice is oil with Lawrence of Arabia.
Warhammer40k is more like Crusader time with Rome, and a spin on US army.

StarCraft

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>>97639001
>I am not aware of this
Because you're clueless
>God-Emperor of Mankind
Quite literally taken from Dune practically wholesale, sans the giant wormbody. Horus Heresy made it even more obvious by having GEOM obsess over his "Golden Path", a concept also lifted wholesale from Dune.
>Admech
Literally just Ixians, right down to skirting laws about AI by heavily cyberizing themselves (the AI ban was also taken from Dune)
>Adeptus Biologis
Bene Tleilax. Both are biotech focused weirdos.
>Sisters of Battle
Fish Speakers, militant religious zealouts that declared themselves "Brides of the God-Emperor"
>Adeptus Dialogis
Bene Gesserit. Both are weird eugenic occultists that regularly groom nobles for to maintain control and play Crusader Kings with bloodlines
>Callidus Assassins
Face Dancers. Shapeshifting assassins and agents that use fancy biotech to change their form.
>Navigators Guild
Navigators Guild. GW didn't even bither changing the name on this one. The only difference is their weird fishy mutation is from fancy genes rather than from boofing Spice 24/7.
>High Lords of Terra
The Landsraad. Admittedly a bit of a stretch since "space feudalism full of politicking nobles" is hardly an original concept Dune can claim credit for, but with everything else GW took from Dune I wouldn't be surprised if they took inspiration here too.
>Deathworlders
Again not a hugely Dune-exclusive concept, but a big part of Dune is how both Fremen and Sardukar are the best fighters in the galaxy because they come from the shittiest, most deadly worlds.

There's a bunch more I'm probably missing but you get the idea. Pic related is clearly inspired by Baron Harkonnen, for example.

>>97628853
>there's really nothing that ties Cadians to Starship Troopers
I disagree. Yeah, sure it's not a super deep narrative inspiration where they're 1:1ing things, but there is a general influence on designs and basic depiction that obviously come from the movie.

>>97629441
>But your picture show Tallarn Desert Raiders from the Imperial Guards.
That's the joke.

>>97630482
As I said (>>97628582) there's design influences and references in the Tau that come from SG-1
>Originally 4 great races / Originally 4 Tau castes
>"Special" 5th race comes along to save the galaxy (Humans/Tau'ri) / 5th Caste (Ethereal) comes along and saves the Tau
>Tau'ri are the main guys / Tau are the main guys
>Gua'uld are the emery / Gue'la are the emery
>Shol'vah is the Gua'uld word for traitor / O'Shovah is the only/most well known "traitor" to the Tau
>The Ancients used base 8 maths / Tau use base 8 maths
>The Tau Alphabet / The Ancient Alphabet
>Nagi are worm-like aliens that have mind control abilities / Gua'uld are snake-like aliens that can physically control a person
>Tau often display a circular motif in their design / The Ancients often display a circular motif in their design

>>97628717
Fuck off, retard.

>>97639414
>that obviously come from the movie.
Cadians are older than the movie. If 40k stole anything from starship troopers it'd be found in the Space Marines

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>>97635063
A significant part, perhaps even the largest part, of 40k is Nemesis the Warlock with the serial numbers filled off.

>>97627920
Dark elf society is also largely built on slavery.

>>97627761
MCU or DC.

>>97640243
So nothing like the US, then.

>>97627914
>DAE murica bad??
Oh you wacky thirdies.

>>97627929
>My western country doesn't abduct people to torture's them in our intelligence agents torture camp black sites in a 3rd nations country to avoid the law.
Well yeah, your nation can't, because it's a third-world never-power.

>>97640226
I saw that minor spelling error!

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>>97628498
>Is there really anything Star Wars?
Gee anon I have noooo ideeaaa

>>97628717
>Dune
>the immortal psychic god emperor trapped in his fate
>the family clans of navigator mutants essential to space travel
>everything about aliens and ST
6/10 got a reply.

>>97634843
Old Ones vs Ctan.

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>>97639992
>>97639414
>>97628853
>>97628582

Cadians were based on Colonial Marines.
Genestealers that were based on Xenomorphs.

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>>97640262
I wish I'd seen the second one that I missed, fucking filed not filled.

>>97628717
SoB are just fish speakers

>>97627929
>the most successful multicultural country on earth
Top kek

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>>97631425
>>97633621
>one techpriest to touch shit he oughta not and let the DAoT AI out of the blackwall
it would go pretty hard if they created some kind of fully AI "evil" counterpart to Admech. Dark Admech are fine, but just slapping "muh chaos gods" on imperium shit and calling them different is lame and boring. This would be a good opportunity to make them more Xeno.
>greedy techpriest opens up some forgotten archive
>releases an AI
>AI infects and subdues the entire forgeworld within a day, using their own cybernetic implants against them
>important sections of its code are damaged/corrupted, and it seeks to find the missing pieces in other data archives
>neither "good" or "evil", it does not obey any morality
>it's fully immune to the warp, psykers, and blanks, since it's just code with no mind of it's own
>forces are fully machine, with no servators, skittles, or techpriests
>their siccarians are just empty powersuits moving on their own, sometimes with the rotting corpse still inside
>they enslave sentient species, keeping them wired up in tanks, to use as psychic/warp batteries
>give them new units that are less like traditional war machines and more like xeno monstrosities

>>97639414
Your points about the Tau vs SG1 are not wrong, but the Tau don't look like anything from SG1. If anything, 3rd ed Tau looked like something from SW E1. But that's like the GW special: steal names, ideas, designs, etc from several different sources and present the mix as something original.

>>97639313
I prefer “Not fully down the rabbithole into lore“.
The emperor isnt a worm but a corpse. Kinda like a roman empire from the christiantian time. You could even say that this corpse on a throne is very much like churches saints relicts.
Navigators are different. Dune needs them to stay focused on the path through visions. In WH40 they are able to understand the Chaos.
But the rest is really very Dune like. I didnt knew that. So Mars and Inquisitors borrowed are Dune?

>>97640294
Good point. But they are very different and were created before Babylon5. Snce their armies are not alike.

>>97642032
>and were created before Babylon5.
Ctan and the war in heaven were an early 2000s 40k thing. B5 Vorlons vs Shadows was 1995ish iirc.
I think the Old Ones being different in appearance from the Vorlons is true, frogs rather than ascendant energy metabeings but much of the premise is arch typical precursor race scifi stuff.
>psychic superpower race
>ancient any mysterious, somewhat beneficial to various uplifts
>leaves behind rigid cast system space elves with mythology relating to the war in heaven
Fading Suns did it too. Probably more.

>>97640262
>>DAE murica bad??
Not enough

Nausicaa

>>97642252
I thought the basic war in heaven thing, they fought the old ines and are now in hibernation was a first thing. The whole narrative plot, ok that might be from Babylon 5. but the races and tech are very different. I mean Necron are skeletons and tomb kings after all.
I would agree that the fluff, story got heavily inspired by B5 but the designs and races are different.

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>>97643786
There's not a lot of art for the Old Ones or the 40k War in Heaven, the B5 stuff was largely bio-organic inspired for both sides, likely because hippy bioorganic stuff was just getting cool for scifi at the time. We don't really have any idea what the 40K Old Ones looked like, if whfb is any indication the Slaan (and old RT era Slaan) are also servants of the Old Ones.

>>97630482
>Dr.who?
Classic Dr Who is one of 40k's biggest influences and it's really funny how most 40k fans are too pretentious to admit this
I get /tg/ being insecure about it since tumblr likes modern Dr Who and anons are going to be tribalistic over shit like that but it's not specific to /tg/ at all

>>97642023
>Navigators are different
They're really not. The ftl mechanics are setting-specific sure but 40k very clearly lifted the concept from Dune. You may as well deny the connection between Arbites and Judge Dredd just because they patrol hive cities instead of megacities and call their version of the law DE LECKS IMPERIALIS

>>97645426
It's not that I don't believe you, but I'd really like to see you back up these claims. The only Dr. Whomst reference I know of is a random encounter with the randy faggot in one of the 40K rpgs

>>97644728
It is rather good to let the Old Ones in shrouds. Just use the Slann as the forces and servants that are visible.
For me the Old Ones and Necrontyr have only being the first species and in war in common with B5.

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>>97645449
Just because you need Navigators doesnt make it the same. Or you would say that Navigator Droids and Astromechs in Star Wars were inspired by Dune.

>>97627929
>doesn't dehumanise anyone since its the most successful multicultural country on earth.
>the cultures: dutch, german, french, swiss, danish

>>97627914
>>97627920
dark elves are explicitly adapted from Melniboné and that of course means they are Brits.
Dark Eldar are as british as orks.

>>97628018
starwars
is this bait?
Marines are space kniggas heavily ripped from 2000ad and the shadarkar of dune.
I'm sure if you look at norts from RT and terminators from nemesis you'd find them there.
come to think of it, GIs are basically marines.

>>97628835
Freman/shadarkar are more related to laserburn and the marines.
Tallarn are perry historical brains.

>>97645943
nta Given how much of everything else Lucas ripped off from Dune, I would be at all surprised if they were also copies.

Herbert doesn't directly say below that Lucas copied, but the implication is that it is extremely unlikely that the coincidences were accidental.

>David had trouble with the fact that Star Wars used up so much of Dune. We found sixteen points of identity between my novel and Star Wars. That is not to say this was other than coincidence, even though we figured the odds against coincidence and produced a number larger than the number of stars in the universe.

He also said elsewhere that Lucas owed him at least a dinner. He never got it. He did poke fun at Star Wars though.

>From the most ancient times, the knowledgeable had preferred to surround themselves with fine woods rather than with the mass-produced artificial materials known then as polestine, polaz, and pormabat
>“He’s a three P-O,” they said, meaning that such a person surrounded himself with cheap copies made from déclassé substances.

In case you missed that gentle burn: 3PO.