>>737059573
I hate bitchy characters and she doesn't even make up for it cause she a ugly freak

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>>737059573
The nymphussy...

Owlcat romances are with shitty undesirable women who have tens of thousands of miles of dick run through them. They are arguably the worst people to take notes about romance from. I have never once felt like I was bonding or connecting with a character in Owlcat's shitty lineup, and I'm a huge fucking faggot who actively seeks out and plays low quality dating sims.

>>737059790
I took the option to kill her. I painted the wall with her. I was not going to sit through essays of text detailing how she's suddenly "relatable". She wasn't. She was dead. I killed her. And I actually made every decision up to that point that qualified me for that secret romance.

A game about a real relationship would be no fun because you could do all your objectives and bonuses but still your girlfriend could throw a fit about some random unrelated shit then leave you.

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>>737059573
For me it's

>>737059573
>For example, we added Wenduag quite late in production. Because of that, we had to reshuffle the roster and figure out what to do with it
Explains why she's such a schizoid character

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>>737059663
The ending of Wenduag's romance is pretty cute. It really made me emotional.

>romance guide from the creators of.... shitty D&D sloppa #543254253234
yeah idc

>>737059573
I think it is fucking bullshit I couldn't romance Amiri and make her my queen.

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I love writing romances, I usually start with a couple idea with a fun dynamic and build the whole story around them

>>737059573
>a guide on how to write romance by the people who never let you romance the best girl in their games (Argenta wasn't their fault but still)

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Let me fuck the dragon, please.

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>>737061093
Making Wenduag embarassed by kissing her!

>>737059573
That explains why Argenta isn't romanceable and that gw had nothing to do with it.

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Is WotR doable with an unarmed monk build? BG3 had Tavern Brawler, I don't know if the Monk classes in Pathfinder are any good.

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>>737062764
based catkisser!

>>737063069
Pretty sure the new drunken master subclass is great

>>737059979
Old Maid Galfrey's a virgin who only ever kissed one guy before.

>>737063269
Does that make you consume copious amounts of alcohol before fights for buffs? Kino if so.

>>737062337
Best girl has been available consistently, sounds like a you problem

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>OwlKEK
>good romance

That is a lot of words to justify not offering the player a chaste, virginal romance option and always reminding the player that their choosen partner has another mans seman drying between her legs.

>>737063510
You already got that with the cunt queen that tried to get you killed, go enjoy it

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>started playing wotr for the first time the other day
>met Nenio
>alignment is true neutral
She's the most chaotic character I think I've seen in a crpg. I fucking hate chaotic characters in a setting that wants me to take it serious.

Never had a Witch in my party before, but I hope Ember can fill my caster needs. Otherwise I might get a respec mod.
Started as war priest myself and hope they're alright later on. Felt like they're the closest to making some kind of Sigmar priest, so I specialized in Warhammers.

>>737063069
Yeah, Monks are great. Scaled Fist is one of the best classes in the game. I like to mix it with a level in Magus so I can go into Dragon Disciple and get a boost to Strength.

>>737063661
>I fucking hate chaotic characters in a setting that wants me to take it serious
Sounds like you suffer from chronical lawtardism

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>>737062361

>>737063419
>Best girl has been available consistently
And other delusions the shills will tell you

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>>737061093
>>737062764
I love Wenduag as much as the next guy, but it breaks my heart how she kills Dyra.

>>737064106
>shill
Never boughted an Owlcat game in my life I'm afraid, didn't buy the DLCs that gave us the best KM girls, or that let us impregnate best WotR girl, either

>>737063972
If that would be the case, I would have picked Paladin, but being forced into an alignment is not really fun for a first playthrough in my opinion. Imagine having to snitch on that halfling who was looting from a corpse to his paladin buddy, only to then 10 seconds later loot that same body.
I generally prefer neutral good/evil and pick depending on the situation.

>>737064134
Yeah it's the worst thing about her romance. The two soldiers you learn later that they were talking shit behind your back which is why she killed them, but this is really inexcusable.

>>737064134
I could have saved her bros

>>737064285
>The two soldiers you learn later that they were talking shit behind your back which is why she killed them
Also inexcusable, this isn't worthy of murder

>>737064134
Curiosity killed the cat.

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>>737059573
>Owlshart in any position to give a masterclass on romance writing

>>737063069
It's doable with anything because mythics will carry your ass lategame.

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>>737059573
The trick is simple. just give a happy ending with your romance option where they fucked off into the woods and have tons of children

>>737064328
Pussy

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>>737059573
TLDR

>>737063069
in real path, monks are liquid shit and a joke class, maybe they're better in the video game idk

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>>737064642
Trvke

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>this cannibalistic demon patsy that freely admits to loving murder, deceiving her family, killing people on a whim, and betraying everybody she knows because she's a backstabbing psycho is fine because I think she's cute :)
Is the only way to justify picking Wenduag over Lann in RP, even if you're an evil character, saying that your character was thinking with their dick?

anyways ember romance mod when

sex with Nurah Dendiwhar

>>737063572
They monkey pawed people super bad with that one didnt they.

>>737064886
>Lann
Sorry, but I can't stand his jokes. My ears are literally bleeding.

>>737064886
I think it could also be pretty simple to see that Lann's nativity would be a weakness when we're fighting demons.

>>737064886
On my first playthrough, I picked Wenduag because I felt bad for her. It felt like Lann would be fine either way, but Wenduag needs someone to guide her.

>>737062046
true to caesar

>>737063069
They are great dodge tanks and all about that big damage dice. an enlarged monk deals like 4d10+str/dex and other mod in each attack while also being able to stun, heal, immunity to everything, spell resistance etc

>>737064886
Uhhhhh she suffered a lot and I can fix her even though she showed zero remorse so there's no reason for me to assume I can fix her, and I had to screw over Lann by painting him as a tratior that abandoned his people and I also accepted her deal to turn the mongrels into crazy demon servants

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>>737064642
CORRECT.

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Jesus fucking christ Owlcat YOU CANT just post something like this, HOLY SHIT

>>737065185
Get this harlot out of my sight.

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>>737065253
No.

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>romance
>important
>in CRPGs
>"nuh-uh romance is serious business!"
lol

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>>737063469
Name a single company that has done romance better this decade.

>>737065014
I agree. My biggest gripe with WotR is that the game starts with the most dire stakes imaginable but your first several party members are quipping faggots with no sense of gravitas that or they're psychotic murderers. You can give them shit about it but it's still annoying. The conga line of Seelah, Lann, Woljif, Nenio, and sort of Daeran is only really broken up by Ember and Camcam. Ulbrig is borderline and DLC.
I'd still say deliberately picking "cannibalistic, treacherous axe-murderer" over "annoying millennial that watched too much MCU" is hard to justify.

>>737065019
I feel like
>betrays everybody at the drop of a hat and has already been willing to work with demons for power
is a bigger weakness when fighting demons.

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>>737064642
When are they going to update the twins' ending so you fill them both with babies?

>>737065390
>and Camcam
She is the same as everyone else, not taking anything seriously. One of her first scenes is her taking Minagho like a joke even though she could very easily kill everyone there

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>>737065412
the same time they add the best Martial class in the game which befits a king

>>737065014
Thanks Lann, you're so awesome Lann :)

>>737065487
That's true, I suppose. She does have quips, they're just overshadowed by her obviously being unhinged, and they're relatively subdued compared to everybody else in the party.

I dislike that these games always want you to specialize, I want to play as a Ranger who uses both bows and dual wield.

>>737059790
She's beautiful?

>>737065668
>2008
>this decade
unc, you slippin'

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>>737065734
Oh yeah.... beautiful....

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>>737065734
Beauty, eye of the beholder etc.

>>737065692
Play Pillars of Eternity then.

>>737065801
I don't have any trouble sleeping right now

>>737065764
She looks like she's made for the guy who gets a hard-on walking through the fresh produce section.

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>>737065608
Well that didn't go...well

>>737065858
You asked. I answered.

>>737065692
nothing stopping you from it.
>but my number goes up feats
if you have high str/dex and full bab class it legit doesn't matter than much

>>737065901
thanks Pinhead

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>>737065369
She doesn't level drain anymore, here's the updated version (that's technically still incorrect because she doesn't heal either)

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Romances in RPGs are most unnecessary and worst aspects of them. Waste of time and resources during production, ruining all discussions later as normalfags and horny teenagers can't talk about anything else but which virtual oussy would they plow. Disgusting. I'm sick of it.

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>>737065764
Yikes
Here's my sloppa Nyrissa

>>737059573
>How we write our terrible cringe with the most annoying characters to ever be written
I love the pathfinder games, but the characters are by far the worst aspects of the games.

>>737066067
that looks even worse

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I liked the Kingmaker crew more than the Wrath crew. I love all these character, yes even Linzi.

>>737060052
Having a girlfriend costs so much time snd and money, it's fucking insane

halfling girls owe me sex

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>>737066090
>he Likes Valerie and oct/reg
>he likes amiri
>he likes boring dwarf
point and laugh at this retard

>>737066204
>>he likes amiri
>>he likes boring dwarf
They're both good fuck you

>>737064886
I metagamed, but didn't care, since it was like 30 minutes into the game (after hour long character creation).
I thought his voice actor sucked big time. Immediately didn't like him and having to compete with to Amelia Tyler voicing Wenduag made the choice pretty fucking easy.

a success worthy of praise ;)

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>>737066204
Why bother laughing? Nothing matters in the end. Tis nothing but folly and arrogance.

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>>737066229
hahahahahahaha what a dork.

>>737066374
Applause please!

>>737066090
>yes even Linzi.
She was my favourite character. I don't get the hate.

>>737066385
I guess nothing mattered when i piped your mom last night.

>>737064328
Dissenters on the front lines are not ignorable problems

>>737066204
Amiri and the dwarf are fine?
Valerie was fine too, but that might be because I didn't talk to her much and kind of tuned out whenever she did.
I made her into my party tank, because I found it funny to assign someone who is so obviously preoccupied with their own appearance to the duty of letting enemies smack her repeatedly in the face.

>>737066476
She spent my bag of holding investment fund on a printing press for her book about ethical government or whatever, the fucking bitch.

>>737066476
People get mad that she steals from the treasury despite the fact that she helps take over the place, also no romance

>>737066090
There's good and bad in both but I think I agree, overall. I only really hate Reg and Val in Kingmaker, because even Octavia's silliness is more tolerable when she's the only one really doing it.
It's funny that in both games the gnome is inarguably the best party member, though. I have never had a bigger swerve on a party member going from "fuck this gnigga" to "ride-or-die for my homeboy" than Jubilost.

>>737059573
don't you get tired of making these threads?

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>There is only one alternative to this approach: to make a nice average waifu for everyone and for no one. It's a niche, really. It's better to have a default romanceable character like that, among other options. Otherwise, your player might end up in a situation where they think "Oh my god, I'm surrounded by crazy people, and I have no one to talk to." In fact, we had this situation early on during Wrath of the Righteous production. At some point we realized we had three female romanceable characters, and all three were cannibals. So we had to rewrite our characters urgently, removing all references to cannibalism from Arueshalae and somehow separating Camellia and Wenduag from this aspect, to make the difference between characters more obvious. As a result, Arueshalae was somewhat shifted toward the "average-pleasant" type, but fortunately, she didn’t become that type entirely.

>>737065412
right after the amiri and argenta romances

>>737066596
>book about ethical government
>she abuses her position to steal from the treasury to write it

how is Gendarme+sable marine company? since flying attack is a charge and gendarme is all about charging and sable has a feat that gives you automatic crit at flying attack

I'm still mad you cannot fuck Amiri. Double barbarian unga bunga caveman romance where she realizes it's not bad at all to be together with a strong dude could've been awesome.

>parts of Stolen lands once belonged to a warlord who had a harem of dragonwives and ruled over Aldori
>no dragon sorcereress companion
what a missed oppurtunity

>>737066740
>how is Gendarme+sable marine company
Way better than pure SMC from what i remember. Extremely good.

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>no more Pathfinder games
I NEED MY FAIRY AND GHOST GIRL ROMANCE

>>737066204
Harrim's doomer posting was PEAK, every time that little nigga showed up and starting black pilling the party I'd laugh my ass off.

>>737066687
they genuinely cannot stop themselves from writing evil women

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>>737066797
Imagine

>>737066928
Imagine the smell of her unwashed hairy barbarian minge.

>>737066797
>I'm still mad you cannot fuck Amiri
YOU can't but those strong boiz from tavern can.

>>737066608
I should also specify that I love to hate Val. I realize she's meant to be an insufferable, annoying cunt. So I don't consider her being irritating as a mark against the game, especially because you're meant to shit on her for bullying Linzi and being a narcissist that's pretending not to be a narcissist. Similarly to how I don't see Amiri as a GRRRRRRRL POWER character because she's intentionally parodying that and making fun of how stupid she is for acting that way (i.e. "PEOPLE SAY WOMEN DON'T NEED SMARTS AND THEY'RE RIGHT", telling her to shut the fuck up if she plays the sexism card at you in your first conversation, and her friends saying it's because she's a retard and not because she's a woman). The characters that are stupid assholes in Kingmaker are meant to be stupid assholes, which makes their stupidity endearing.

Valerie is canonically less intelligent than Amiri, by the way.

>>737066928
At least we'll get a stinky kroot GF with no holes soon

>>737065692
Play a gestalt character and go on a power trip.

>>737066918
Evil women are not the problem (although the fact that two of the three romance options are cartoon villains, while the only good one being a former cartoon villain, is certainly something)
it's that they make crazy bitches, Kingamker didn't have this problem

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I never hear anything about her romance. Is it so bad?

>>737059573
The weirdest thing about wenduag I can think of is that I can't see any might makes right evil strong conqueror gengis khan type character being willing to entertain her sniveling and groveling immediately.
And theres no reason for any good character to take her deal, even if they think they can fix her. She explicitly offers "I will make my entire tribe into a brainwashed cannibal army via demonic means" alongside her joining you and you can't just tell her no. And at the same time you tell lann to get the fuck away or you'll kill him.
Its owlcat failing to write actual player choice and this failing is mostly confined to the opening of the game. Its just weird.

>>737065390
>but your first several party members are quipping faggots
Lann doesn't quip, he makes self deprecating jokesm he's serious most of the time. Daeren quips on purpose because he doesn't like most people. Nenio doesn't quip, she's reddit incarnate and is treated as an oddity by everyone.

>>737067172
>and this failing is mostly confined to the opening of the game
She still keeps killing people even after that, that's even worse

>>737059573
My favorite was romancing Argent-oh wait. BASTARDS.

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>>737066090
The Twins are more than enough romance for me, why would I want to fuck anything else when they're so perfect?

Which country is the france of Pathfinder?

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>>737059573
Romance is like the last thing I play owlmeme games for. Almost every single one is complete dogshit to the point where I just outright ignore it every time I replay now. It's like they crowdsource all their romance plot lines from tumblr.

>>737067161
>weird throuple bullshit with the lamest party member, who is an orc, and the second lamest party member, who is a white woman from Seattle
I'm going to be entirely honest, I don't know anybody that would willingly do that romance. The only part of it I've heard people mention is that you can literally cuck a man to death. The tiefling twins were an entire DLC that seemed like an apology for the base game's female romances sucking.

>"yes, I'm interested in this romance" or "no, I'm not interested." We're often criticized for this, and people ask why the breakup phrases in our games are so blunt and rude. Well, unless you write it out loud and clear, some people won’t notice and then end up in bed with the character they don’t like, which would make them really offended.
>click yes to accept gay sex
>click no to avoid gay sex
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH HOW DID I END UP SUCKING HIS DIIIIIIIIIIIICK!?

>>737067504
They're full of shit, these are the same people that had you continuing Lann's romance if you told him you're both good friends

>>737067082
Gestalt is the ultimate power trip, and it feels natural in Wrath to be a Gestalt, Just limit it to your PC and its not even too broken.

I did a Scaled Fist+ Eldrich Scion (Draconic bloodline) Gestalt and it was so much fun.

>>737063331
You do actually get a bottle with alcohol that restores your ki

>>737067161
No, it's not that bad, but the sale pitch is that she's in a poly relationship with an orc and that's a really dogshit premise for a romance

>>737067570
Yeah i did the same
Oracle + Sable Company Marine angel for an ultimate angel power fantasy with a griffin bro.
Made him lame and powerless to justify having a griffin buddy to help him.

>>737067504
Daeran had a fairly innocuous line that lead to his romance

>>737067556
That was a bug that I believe they've since fixed, the line that specifically said you wanted a romance also didn't lead to one

>>737059573
Don't care, still romancing Camellia.

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>>737067082
>>737067570
Does going Legend as a gestalt mean you get three classes or four?

>>737067556
Somehow, I didn't end up fucking Lann, so...

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>>737066001
>Romances in RPGs are most unnecessary and worst aspects of them.
Romances in RPGs are the most necessary and best aspects of them. The lack of romances is the most unrealistic thing that you can have in RPG unless your character is incel for plot reasons. Romances and sex are basic human needs even in fucking Warhammer universe where even ugly plebs from hive bottom are breeding nonstop. Just because you're incel (or maybe wife beater) who directly projects own incel personality into MC doesn't mean devs should downgrade the game for normal adventure enjoyers because of incels. And you still allowed to be an incel in those games. If anything by glad RPG games don't make fun of your 20-30 years old wifeless, childless, incel hero (in the fantasy world where even solders have 2 kids the moment they reach their 20s)

>>737065692
I want to be a sorcerer that dual wields greatswords and the closest I can get is making a crossblooded sorcerer with a mythic third bloodline turn into a dragon disciple and use a scythe. Because sorcerer eldritch knight titan fighter doesn't work together at all.

>>737067414
Galt

>>737067706
Abso fucking lutely no idea anon, try it out, sounds fun.

>>737067504
Well I mean I've had this happen to me in other games, never happened with Owlcat's games but I've had it happen in other because usually i want to maximize affinity in a non-romantic way with most of my companions and sometimes the game makes it hard to navigate that 'no-homo best bros for life' without accidentally triggering the romancce.

Fucking BG3 was super guilty of this shit, everyone in that game wants to immediately ride your dick and that fucking wizard guy who basically turns a friendly moment into gay sex if you agree to practice magic with him.

>>737067681
I think all daeran romance lines are pretty obvious. You can bluntly tell him no at any point and most other lines can be seen as entertaining his playboy flirting.

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>>737067414

>>737066001
Most options in an rpg are "unnecessary" but options is what makes a crpg fun
Some people enjoy romances, even if they are not written like great literary classics, and the more options they get the better

>>737067570
For me it was Tortured crusader+crusader. being a battle hardened soldier turned into a angel TDD murder machine with a Succubus gf is pure kino

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>>737062361
>HUG AIVU
I'd rather a Terendelev.

>>737059573
Nothing worse than unremarkable writers wanking themselves off giving advice about how to write (i.e. doing a Brandon Sanderson)

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>>737067504
>click yes to accept gay sex
>click no to avoid gay sex
I remember sucking dick in tavern by incident in Dragon Age 2 because I can't read. But I swear the wording was weird on purpose to make you suck dick!

>>737065949
Sex with my daughter

>>737066001
Romances make absolute sense in what's essentially a fantasy adventure story. It's literally one of the best genres for it.
It all depends on how you implement them.

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>>737067925

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>>737067993
>noooo you can't give advices unless you have official approval from pseuds!
Lol.

>>737067706
Yes. in my legend playthrough i once decided to experiment and did a fighter+genderme+paladin+slayer. Legend is already OP but having four classes felt like i want too overboard

>>737068032
I remember when the worst example of romance in games was dragon age 2 because every character was bisexual and anders got extremely pissy when you rejected him.

>>737061093
she broke up with me because I called her out for being a weak bitch in alushynirra lol. lady can dish it but can’t take it

>>737068072
This, the synthesis of a fantasy adventure is that you slay a dragon and get the princess
Obviously the princess is not "required" but it does enhance the fantasy

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>>737067901
Most are obvious but he has a lot for starting them

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>>737059573
>owlcuck trannies write a leftisft meme just to say they are closet homosexuals into cuckoldry
You sad morons deserve the garbage you pay for

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>>737068284
Cuckoldry is noble fetish.

>>737059573
I'm ready for a poor justification why they've only had one decent romance in 10 years.

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>>737068359
I love Cassia too anon!

>>737066001
Bro, Icewind Dale was 25 years ago, let it go, YOU LOST. Modern CRPGs are glorified visual novels where people get to ship characters and build up to PG-13 sex scenes and then yap endlessly online about who ranks as the best girl and we're never going back.

Black Isle lost, Bioware Won,
Obsidian LOST, Larian and Owlcat WON

>>737068423
fileting this fish

>>737067783
>Romances and sex are basic human needs

Complete bullshit, so much bullshit I don't even know what to say. Are you fucking 15 that you cannot see female without wanting to get your dick wet? Holy shit, I might be a "wizard" but I'm honestly sickened of all you horny fags.

>>737065317
Josh "It's only okay if it's gay" Sawyer

>>737068426
>Icewind Dale
But it is faceless dungeon crawler.

>>737068083
Pathfinder also have tons of rape. like hobogoblins & half-orc origins, demons who rapes everything and forces the girls to give birth to the half demon, monster girls who seduces man and plant eggs in their corpses, hellraiser realm etc. i know it's a kitchen sink setting but it's one of the decent one imo

>>737068474
with no survivors

>>737065949
I would have Arue pregnant 24/7

>>737068523
He never said that.

>>737063069
Wrath is already dragged down by its combat, but not being able to fully respec companions hurts it even more. So many options and you’re stuck with only being able to really play with your MC. Or make mercs, but they take away from content the actual companions have.

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>>737068546
Yes.

>>737067783
I'd rather have a group of 6 professional motherfuckers who don't want to bump uglies tackling the dungeon than a bunch of emotionally fragile and romantically available retards shitting where they eat. If they want to fuck do it on your own time, you're professionals, you have a job to do, I'm here to kill goblins and collect gold. Now Rothnkar stop making goo-goo eyes at the sorceress and get your damn head in the game, Onlan has 4 hit points left and he needs that cure light wounds scroll NOW.

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>>737068423
Oh there is one with her clothes on, so surely there must be a third one...

>>737068543
Aka the best RPG format. Pure gameplay, no bullshit with romances or premade characters and their worthless stories. Holy shit, I couldn't bear having to actually listen to these little shits. In both Pathfinder games I make fully custom party and include premades only one at time to do their personal quest - and then dump them back to garbage bin where they belong.

>>737068515
>Romances and sex are basic human needs
>complete bullshit
The species literally dies without sex
Denying sex and romance as an essential component of human life and thus storytelling is like arguing that the sky is green

>>737067925
>>737068083
>just steal the entire global history of fiction and use it for your setting, sometimes unaltered
>do not be afraid to write evil, crimes, and other heinous immoral actions into the lore
Unironically a good way to make a setting where anything can happen and anyone can go on an adventure cause theres infinite problems to tackle.

>>737068515
You shouldn't have chopped off your dick if you were going to seethe about normal peoples healthy sex drive 24//, tranny

>>737059573
>Companions’ alignments should be balanced. Any player, whatever moral convictions they’d love to roleplay, should be able to gather the whole party and not be left alone.
If you aren't RPing a psycho or idiot you'd kill/kick half of the wrath companions out.

>>737065949
Owlcat literally saw that meme and made it real and canon. I give them credit for that, no other company gives gamers what they want like Owlcat.

>anti-romance codextranny having a meltie, again

>>737068642
God damn furries

>>737059573
holy shit i am NOT reading all of this, 99% of their romances are trash

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>>737068767
...but enough about Josh Sawyer

>>737068734
My dick is still intact, you homo obsessed faggot. It simply didn't replace my brain, you room temperature IQ retard.

>>737068721
>species dies without sex

Good.

>>737068515
>so much bullshit I don't even know what to say
Because you're angry incel.
>Are you fucking 15 that you cannot see female without wanting to get your dick wet?
I'm not a character of RPG game, incel and you should stop projecting your incel persona on video games.

>>737068543
It was a dungeon crawler with a story, there's a big difference between it and the Bard's Tale.

>>737068647
I prefer "reluctant heroes with party members via circumstance" to "group of professionals who actively went seeking a hard life and keep coworker distant from each other"

>>737068898
>incel, incel, have sex!

Don't you have some club to get drunk at, normalfag?

>>737068543
Icewind Dale was the last game that didn't kowtow to romance slop. Its still a great game with a great story.

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>>737068857
Sure, whatever you say, tranny

>>737068719
>Aka the best RPG format
You mean the worst? Just soulless grinfest with zero RPG.

>>737068647
>professional
We found the greybor fan guys. this guy probably plays a evil character and calls himself neutral.

>>737068998
Simply business, anon

>>737068898
>incel
sure you're not a tranny, sure

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>>737068952
>acts like an incel
>upsets when called out
???
Are you telling be you're not incel? Again read >>737067783
If you don't want romances in Role Playing Game you're incel. This is just a fact. Your character is literal incel.

>>737067161
No, Octavia's romance is quite interesting, especially since it's the only one where you HAVE to call her out on her bullshit to get a good outcome.

>>737067462
>>737067619
You're both retards. The actual poly relationship is actually the hardest romance to get out of all Owlcat Games.

Regongar and Octavia share next to no dialogue/events where you can gain points with both. So in order to get them into a throuple you either have to play with a walkthrough constantly open OR play as the most unhinged Chaotic Neutral lunatic in existence, in one minute crying over the poor fate of some captured kobold while in the next torturing a man to death for fun.

You also have to make Octavia a WORSE person, switch her into Chaotic Neutral, and actively encourage her darker, more degenerate instincts.

>>737068618
You did, Josh. You did.

>>737060487
It's the eyes dude
Say want you want about Larian, they knew how to make soul-mirroring beautiful eyes

>>737068968
>Its still a great game with a great story.
It is not a great game with a great story at all. It is RTWPslop without characters with dogshit 2nd edition ruleset.

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>>737068804
When Owlcat speaks: you listen.

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>hates demon
>marries demon
Why are angelic man like this?

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>>737068647
>I'd rather have a group of 6 professional motherfuckers
But you can hire mercs and replace all characters with hardboiled chuds.
>>737068998
But even Greybor had wife and kid.

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>>737065317
was he right /v/ ? Please discuss in groups of 5

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It's done, for the anons who asked
https://litter.catbox.moe/tw8f5ynxpkbvez2c.png

>>737067414
literally Mendev. it even has a joan of arc leading them but wayyy fucking worse in every way

>>737069363
I will never forgive Owlcat for not including the "you met her as a child" tabletop background.

>>737069152
You retard, I said the romance is good but the PITCH is poly, which puts people off
I agree, it's intentionally written as a bad thing and a result of them being slaves, but obviously when you meet her and she has an orc boyfriend (who is also gay for you) you are immediately put off

>>737060487
I prefer Minty

>>737065317
>>737069397
Why is he so ashamed to write a romance?

>>737069403
How many levels did he lose here

>>737060487
She is the only good choice even tho you can't get her preggo

>>737069397
He is. Josh has even addressed multiple times (he likely lurked here when anons discussed how wordy and boring Pillars is even from the get-go in the chargen screen) is that he was so invested in making the player be immersed like they would be when reading the D&D manuals and splatbooks. He later came to the realization that it was an oversight in his part to give the player that instrinsic tabletop experience and translate it into the hands of the average CRPG enjoyer, let alone video games. He literally filtered an entire audience.

>>737069568
he's a bitter faggot

>>737069568
They keywords are "ego stroking" which is exactly what romance is, you can tell he hates that, so he hates romance
Even uses the retarded "uhhhh muh fade to black" argument that only people who have only played Mass Effect use
For people like him anything that panders to the player is bad, it's that simple

>>737069568
That's not the point. His point is that romance in an RPG is not actually a primary component. It's tertiary If it is, your story needs to revolve around ti heavily or it's simply too shallow or not worth doing lest is just devovles into VN romance route shite. Josh is emphasizing the peak of courtly love that is found in epic poems and chivalric stories which fits the fantasy motif than the "realism" part of it.

>>737065317
>Romance bad
>writes a not one but two gay romance that doesn't involve the player
>gives one of the girls a bad end if you romance her but gives her a happy one if you didn't interact with her where she becomes a lesbo \
>also has a gay fish romance voiced by Garrus in Awoved. same game where you can't even fuck whores or even fuck the black girl
He is gay isn't he

>>737069152
The poly thing being hard to do doesn't change that it's a throuple and that the setup puts people off, which is what I said. Even if you only romance one of them, it's still a throuple because they're with the other until the end of the game. Which puts off most people. The rest of what you're saying is just more reason why it's off-putting for most people.

>>737069835
Josh was only a consultant by the time of Avowed. He hasn't been heavily involved in the Pillars series since Deadfire and got severely burnt out by the end of it.

>>737069585
It's okay, he had death ward

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>>737059573
Didn't read. Jimmy exists so they're doing something right I guess. Total Jimmy Perfection!

>>737069585
He is the commander of the fifth crusade. e will just fort tank it

>>737069770
Too shallow and tertiary components don't make sense. Side quests are shallow too. If anything linear movie game is the best way to experience story without shallow components.

>>737069669
Romance should not have a victory nor loss state. That's the gist of Josh's take and if you add a romance for a character, suddenly everyone wants to have a "romance route" with other characters and bemoans the game for having none. This "player-priority" then shifts to romanceable rather than the story itself. It is safe to say that Josh has a dislike of shipperfaggotry rather than romance. You will never understad it unless you've read a lot of novels/games already and see that romance is often very trite and "ego-stroking" than it isn't.

>>737069146
Look, baby knows a word and now keep saying it. How cute.

>>737069462
>>737069862
The set-up isn't for that of a throuple, but a "friends with benefits" situation. Furthermore, if you go heavily after one rather than the other, their relationship breaks down much sooner.

I wish people who actually played the game partook in those discussions, rather than regurgitating the same walkthroughs that copy off of one another.

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>>737069374
>But you can hire mercs and replace all characters with hardboiled chuds.
Don't mind if I do.

>>737069461
Sorry bro, backgrounds are only a thing in Rogue Trader

>>737069770
You are a fag, Josh

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>>737070016

>>737069363
Jesus didn't surround himself with the pious, but those who needed him.

>>737070167
The sidequests serve the story via ludonarrative. Romance in CRPGs is completely player-centric, often relegated to a sub-quest of a subquest, hence it gave birth to the idea of companions being strictly playersexual because they want to "win" at relationships.

>>737069862
Nothing wrong with a throuple if it closed. For me, what turned me off of Octavia was the “I’m totally fine with being a slut who will slew with a man at the drop of a dime.” I know it’s an intentional character flaw but…this was generally much better handled by the twins.

>>737070270
Romance is not an RPG.

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>>737067082
I just wish you could play a synthesis summoner. Synth summoner, Paladin gestalt is the shit

>>737070316
Companions are playersexual to avoid controversy and complaining over a character being shut off from them due to sexuality. And this isn’t just fags: imagine if Cassia or Arue were lesbians, a bunch of people would be pissed. Better to just let people have what they want even if the writing implies a sexuality (for example, Gale in BG3 is very obviously straight and his romance is written for female characters, but he’s playersexual anyway, and no gay complained about that.)

>>737070536
Why are you bringing up Cassia when she's straight?

>>737070569
>imagine if

>>737070585
You're talking about playersexuality to avoid controversy, plenty of dykes and trannies want Cassia to be a lesbian romance option but she isn't

>>737070536
>Companions are playersexual to avoid controversy and complaining over a character being shut off from them due to sexuality
Do you not see why you just proved my point counteractively? Logically, romance cannot be done justice in a setting like a cRPG unless it's woven into the structure of the story itself, rather than some tacked on route where you can pick at like a new weapon build you want to try. Besides shipfaggotry, romance is inherently inimical and personal to being gamified to such a degree. Most players can't handle rejection in a video games because they see it as a loss-state in the "relationship game" part of the game.

>>737070495
I want to make a summoner drunken monk.

>>737070630
God I miss back when every tranny and faggot seethed over Cassandra being straight

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>>737066675
I wanted to talk about the Owlcat post, not argue about who is the best waifu again (and why it's Wenduag).

>/v/ - Vidya Romance Experts
Everyday we become more and more like the codex.

>>737070630
Warhammer barely has characters and plot to begin with, why on earth would it of all settings contain romance.

>>737070304
Something Theodora would undoubtfuly do

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>>737070193
>no arguments
No anon, of course you're not an incel. That's why you're so upset about romances and sex in RPG. Your 30 years old John Kingmaker, The Savior of Golarion just doesn't like womin. It's not incel projection of some chud.

>>737070778
Retard

>>737070196
I've played the game but I haven't done the romance because, like I said, I was put off by it being a throuple (on my first playthrough) and because I don't really like either character (on subsequent). Like most people. My entire point and literally all I said was that it was a throuple (which it is) and that it puts people off romancing either (which it does). Just because you can make them break up doesn't mean that it doesn't start as a throuple. You're jumping at a strawman because I said two things that are completely factual and correctly identify why nobody talks about Octavia's romance.

>>737070630
The people who complain about player sexuality are vastly outnumbered by the people who complain about strict sexualities.
See the seething from gay men on RT’s release. And now imagine the outrage if a female romance was lesbian only.

>>737070196
>but a "friends with benefits" situation
Even worse
>So yeah, pursue the romance with this girl who is fucking an orc and says she wants a fwb
Not a great pitch at all anon
I played her romance, I think Octavia is a good character (I kinda detest Regongar) but she's a hard pill to swallow and I can't blame anyone who got put off by her especially since Valerie is right there

>>737070690
I can’t see why, if combat and character progression is perfectly acceptable to be gamified, that romance isn’t allowed a similar treatment? You seem to take a “romance MUST be done this way in games” stance.

>>737070817
>Just because you can make them break up
You don't have to, if you don't intervene into their relationship in any way they still break up. It's clear from very early on their relationship is built on shared trauma and is doomed to failure without intervention, since the two have nothing else in common and disagree on almost everything else.

Romance is so deeply personal to every individual, you can't really gamify it like you would the mechanics of an RPG. Lest that's your goal but don't call it "high brow" or stand on a pedestal of "mediocre or nothing" when ultimately the premise from the get-go is already to gamify it. Justify it all you want, it's not gonna make it "more serious" no matter how many lurid sex scenes and *blushes shyly* you put in the game.

>>737070837
The answer was always
>make a character that is capable of romancing the character you want to
But that became taboo when they stopped pretending trannies wanted to be the opposite sex instead of wanting to be trannies.

>>737069374
I think the sorts of conflict/interactions I'd like to have with my companions is Dulofn thinks we should wait until the Ogres are sleep before we force our way through the pass, While Trandgir suggests attacking now while before they can get reinforcements, but Fendaliv thinks we should just avoid the conflict all together by sneaking past by using the old goat paths. Not Oh man I want to bang Dulofn but that'll ruin my relationship with Fendaliv, and Tandgir will get so jealous because he has feeling for Fendaliv too! That shit is super gay I don't give a fuck.

>>737070972
Octavia and Regongar remain together and if you turn Reg CN their relationship improves, even

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>>737069397
>Virgin Sawyer - insecure failed RPG writer
>Chad Jordan - American Tolkien, bachelor of science, war veteran and survivor of helicopter crash
LMAO

>>737070867
>>So yeah, pursue the romance with this girl who is fucking an orc and says she wants a fwb
>Not a great pitch at all anon

If you expect a conservative trad-wife out of a traumatised slave that had to prostitute herself and was repeatedly raped by her masters, you can only fault yourself.

>>737071052
>Octavia and Regongar remain together
Not if you do nothing.

>and if you turn Reg CN their relationship improves, even
Yeah, that's why I said "if you don't intervene."

>know Ulbrig for all of 20 minutes and only talk to him like 2 or 3 times
>to start his romance, you need to go up to him while he's drunk
>*put your hand on his face* "Don't be sad.... what if there's someone very close to you that needs that big dick?

Yeah masterclass writing Owlcat.

>>737071160
Turning Regongar into a better person has nothing to do with intervining with their relationship, not to mention that if he remains CE then he becomes a retarded drunkard while Octavia thrives but they're still in a relationship

>>737071052
The Regongar/Octavia subplot was painful to go through even if you don't romance any of the two, just having to hear them argue and see Regongar get friendzoned like a good little kek. Would've been improved tenfold if you could tell Regongar to quit being such a little bitch and let him stop simping by finding another piece of ass or something.

>>737071026
lmao as if /v/ would make a female MC to romance someone instead of spending the next 5 years passive agressively bitching about it

>>737070943
I'm standing on the point of narrative and gameplay. Narratively, the only way for an actual fulfillable romance should be woven into the main story. Like the age-old stories of chivlaric knights who either lose their path or gain victory from it. This romance is given its due. Gameplay-wise, there really shouldn't be any lest you just devolve it into baseline shipfaggotry. I'm not saying it's not possible, I'm saying that gamifying romance defeats romance. That's how I see it. This is no longer about how Josh may see it unless he's here in the thread to explain himself.

>>737070995
Well I am not Owlcat. I’m fine with things like Japanese dating simulators. I’m not offended by them.

>>737070805
There is no need for arguments when you are just thinking with your cock and try to insult me in only way you can, by talking about lack of sex. Because that's the only value your tiny, horny mind can comprehend.

>>737071215
I only ever tried the Garrus and Alistair romances and thats because they were literally me.

>>737071251
And that's fine for you. Just don't pretend or justify it like what Owlcat is trying to do in their post like it's somehow "doing it right" when they're simply doing it as would any other dating sim would, albeit stretched even longer and even more impersonal.

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>>737070995
>Romance is so deeply personal to every individual,
And moral decisions you make in RPG are not deep and personal at all. Character interactions are not personal to every individual at all.
>high brow
Pseud buzzword.

>>737070304
Just checking to see there are no mutations on you, haha. Praise the Emperor

>>737071332
I like the Thane romance for the tragedykino

>>737071390
Owlcat is the one stating in their post that they're doing "romance" right and they don't want it to be "low-brow". I'd rather they just drop the pretense and say they want the game to have dating sim elements and actually take from many Japanese titles that have leaned into that more deeply rather than treading on shallow waters and calling it swimming.

>>737071160
>If you expect
This has nothing to do with expectation, anon asked why nobody talks about octavia and I answered truthfully: her premise is off putting to many players

>>737071365
Fair enough

>>737070972
That's completely irrelevant to my point, and I was just responding to the statement that it's fine that it's a throuple because pursuing one makes them break up. And my response is that it doesn't matter because it's retroactively solving a problem that put people off in the first place. Which they would only know about if they read a romance guide or something for a romance they weren't interested in.

>>737071160
>If you expect a conservative trad-wife out of a traumatised slave that had to prostitute herself and was repeatedly raped by her masters, you can only fault yourself.
People aren't, but they're also not doing the romance. I don't see what your hang-up is when this entire discussion is.
>hey why do people not do Octavia's romance?
>she doesn't appeal to them because of X and Y
And somebody (I assume you) getting irritated at that and making a bunch of irrelevant statements that don't disprove that, yeah, she doesn't appeal to most people. Which you're tacitly admitting by saying that we can only fault ourselves for not finding her core character appealing, even beyond her romance.

>>737071182
To be fair, that is how women and gay men start romances.

>>737071332
How’s the Javik romance? I’d love a renegade alien romance but I could never give myself to abandon Garrus.

>>737071629
Non existent

>>737066687
>what do we do with this character now that she doesnt eat babies? ugh shes too PLEASANT now
Owlcat is a joke man

>>737071258
>still no arguments
>immideadly talks about cocks
If wanting something natural in rpg is "thinking with your cock", I can only imagine what you use to think about murder and all evil deeds you do in rpg. Did you kill anyone yet, incelbro?

>>737071445
Thane seems kino until you realize that he can start reminiscing about his wife at random moments including when you're having sex

>>737071629
It requires many correct choices to inply a one night stand in the citadel dlc.
You can also make liara steal his dna instead of yours and make beef mclargehuge have sex with Ashley.

>>737071160
>If you expect a conservative trad-wife out of a traumatised slave that had to prostitute herself and was repeatedly raped by her masters, you can only fault yourself.
This is inherently part of why romance is a double-edged sword to gamify into a CRPG. That anon is not wrong to want that, the premise is inherently "ego-stroking" to begin with. The only arbitrary reason as to why developers like Owlcat or most other CRPG devs don't is because their idea of romance is arbitrarily rooted in their idea of what romance is, in that by somehow making it "realistic" it's more """""romance"""""" than doing something like your average nukige would. It's completely arbitrary and pandering.

>>737071482
>I'd rather they just drop the pretense and say they want the game to have dating sim elements and actually take from many Japanese titles that have leaned into that more deeply rather than treading on shallow waters and calling it swimming.
I do want more character reactivity across all party members for sure.

>>737071845
To be more pandering, yes.

>>737071827
I do think western devs need to learn a sense of “moe”.
https://youtu.be/TT2GRpwwS8M?si=OW4KMEYdsRxwk80P
Embrace the cringe, as they say.

>>737071845
>take from many Japanese titles that have leaned into that more deeply
It this a joke? Romances in J"""RPG"""s are a complete joke and an afterthought. To give a recent example, each game in Persona 5 gets about 5 minutes of actual romantic content of any kind.

>>737071756
Shitting is also natural. Why don't you want detailed shitting mechanics in your RPGs then?

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>>737071827
>ego-stroking
Being the main hero is already ego-stroking. Unless you don't let MC to be powerful, beat the game and solve quests.
Josh, step up your game. Save Pillars

>>737071982
each girl*

>>737072031
It's always romance that makes them pissy, these people legit play angel and are fine with the power fantasy, but the instant you want to stick your dick inside a pussy they have a meltdown

>>737071805
>>737071656
Well that sucks.
Kinda reminds me of BG3, if you want a monster romance you only get one scene with him and it’s at the end of the game and to be any further with him requires you to make a ton of terrible choices and he ditches you at the epilogue.

>>737071935
That's my point. But people think it's "too pandering" which is why they look down on it.
>>737071982
The point was to pander to the player. The premise is literally the same. You're faulting it on arbitrary reasons beyond it like how "this shouldn't be that because this doesn't work in real life!" or "that's not how a man/woman would react in real life!" when that is entirely the rule when they've gamified romance already. In some way, your shitty Persona romance routes understands the spirit more than your average CRPG romance writer.

>>737071935
Arue is literally super fucking moe

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AI TLDR Summary for those that dont wanna read all that shit

Technical Process
Companions are planned early in a roster balancing alignments, classes, factions, and game mechanics. Romance types are assigned (e.g., Arueshalae = “shy girl”, Daeran = “charismatic bitch”).
Romances are designed late — after core character stories — so they fit naturally like “ivy on a fence.
”Romance structure includes:
Unlocks: First moment of interest (not always flirting).
Events: Mandatory (guaranteed key scenes, e.g. Daeran’s rose-filled hall) + Optional (rewards for exploration, e.g. waterfall scene).
Resolution, Farewell, and Jealousy (ultimatum if romancing multiple).

Artistic Approach
Writing love is inherently “cringy” — writers must embrace vulnerability. Romances target specific tastes rather than generic appeal. Characters get a strong “first floor” (personal quest) and a “secret floor” in romance that reveals hidden depths without breaking consistency.
Examples:
Octavia & Regongar: Surface couple with slavery trauma; romance exposes emotional immaturity and fears.
Arueshalae: Redeemed succubus discovering human emotions and dreams for the first time.
Nyrissa (secret villain romance): High-stakes “true love” requiring understanding her agency.

Player Interaction & Routes
Romances use choice-heavy dialogue. Common structure: 1+2+1Fail route (clear mistakes)
Two equal main dynamics
“True Love” route (deepest, most complex ending)

Polyamory is limited due to massive combinatorial complexity. Owlcat prefers quality over shallow implementation.

Intimacy Techniques
“Fireplace” fade-to-black (implication over explicit)
Vivid sensory close-ups (e.g. Arueshalae’s “hot, dry palms”)

Overall, Owlcat builds full characters first, then layers interactive, choice-driven romances that feel personal and earned. This creates the vibrant relationships players love.

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>>737064642
>marrying a ultra mega whore

>>737071935
Depicting moe is more difficult in emglish but I don't know why. I don't think its the fact that its equally cringe in japanese but it just feels more unnatural in the english language.

>>737072190
True but they could have gone further. Also I think visual design is a big problem. Not saying they have to go full anime but…owlcat artists are pretty bad, even when they’re not trying to be attractive. Just look at the pathfinder or RT models. They make very ugly games. Expanse seems to be an exception but even that is just more generically acceptable than anything.

>>737072217
Who did you romance?

>>737072217
>being literally reborn by the work of a goddess doesn't count!!!!!

>>737072217
It only works because a god told you to for womanly reasons and you can still say no.

>>737071482
>want the game to have dating sim elements and actually take from many Japanese titles
Well, RT already had a beach episode only instead of the beach it's commoragh, and instead of cocktails it's blood and tears