Are there still people who think Wind Waker has kiddy graphics that are cringe?

>>12507301
Yes.

How many windwaker threads do we need?
>>12490772

who wins in a schizo fight to the death
remake hater or wind waker hater?

>>12507305
Were you not here for the flood of Resident Evil 3 threads?

>>12507305
Tbf that's more about zelda as a series.

>>12507308
Don't care, one thread bitching about windwaker is enough

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So are you going to tell the creator of Zelda that he's wrong?

>>12507313
If you're so ass pained about it then make your own thread praising wind shitter to prove all of us wrong.

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I liked the art style, what I didn't like is how kiddy everything was designed. They could have used this art style and been age-neutral.
The real issue with the game is that the battle system is great but there aren't enough difficult multi-enemy battles.

>>12507337
It's why people rightfully judged it. It looked kiddy, and it was kiddy from top to bottom.

>>12507306
They're both deranged, but Remake hater wins

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>>12507337
>battle system
Yeah I agree. The battle mechanics themselves are very good, probably best in the series, and even the enemies are fairly dynamic. There are shortcomings, but the battles generally always being in simple boxes is a shame.

Another thing I think is missing is proper exterior exploration. The lack of any truly big islands to explore and use all the movement options on is a shame. The grove at the top of Outset is one of my favourite areas in the game, and even puts you in a cramped environment that adds some options and excitement to battle, but there's practically nowhere else like it elsewhere in the game. It's a little ironic too considering the game's primary influence seems to be Future Boy Conan, which emphasises the landscape as much as the sea. Style-wise I also wonder what the reception would be if they followed the look of characters in that anime rather than whatever film it was they borrowed from, although I've never had a problem with Wind Waker's style.

Wind Waker would have been an amazing game to get a full, proper follow-up to like MM to OoT.

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>>12507305
How many windwaker threads do you have?

>>12507305
Seven

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>>12507412
It's hard to say because that was a period of time where devs were all excitedly going "Holy shit we can do cel shading graphics just like our ANIMES" and audiences rejecting them each and every time.

Wind Waker was fun and Dragon Roost Island is one of the best music pieces in the franchise.
Could have made a couple more dungeons, or make some of them bigger/more challenging but it's still a good game.
I remember the Ganondorf final fight being fun and somewhat challenging though

>>12507297
>fewer dungeons in favor of more sailing in a barren sea "overworld"

yeah no fucking clue why people bitch about the graphics instead
if it had the same amount of content as OOT or even MM it would be a classic
SMS suffered from a similar downgrade in content from SM64

>>12507630
It's a neat concept and it worked on games that were based off cartoons. I remember how much hype and marketing was generated for Cel Damage and I did not know a single person who bought it, I did not know anyone that even played it. Ads on tv, ads in magazine, posters and game stores, a whole special on g4 talking about cel shading and promoting that game in particular. Then it came out and no one cared about cartoon games not based on cartoons, no one cared about car combat games after the 90s.

>>12507412
Mega Man Legends and Wind Waker both being inspired by Future Boy Conan is interesting, Miyazaki really has an insanely outsized influence on video games.

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I think what's interesting is that wind waker's most objective flaws are basically tied to the Gamecube having no games the first couple of years of release.
Both Wind Waker and Mario Sunshine would have been significantly better end products if the console was able to sit on Melee, Luigi's Mansion, Pikmin, Wave Race, etc and third parties for another year.

>>12507297
>>>/lgbt/

>>12507297
The fuck?!

>>12507919
I agree, but the real question is why the fuck were Nintendo’s top tier dev teams seemingly stretched so thin? Like they should’ve been putting most of their best people on Sunshine and Wind Waker. I don’t understand why both games still needed more time.

>>12507989
Same deal with Twilight Princess’s drawn out development cycle I suppose. Nintendo seemed to have a real issue with making the jump to more advanced 3D graphics in the sixth gen.

>>12507995
Aonuma mentioned in a keynote that at one point TP's development languished because he went off to fiddle with Capcom and Minish Cap and was surprised to come back to the TP team and saw they hadn't really accomplished much without a Director to guide them.

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Why didn't the combat become standard it's so boring to fight in botw because you just do the same three hit combo no matter what.

>>12508048
This matters less than Dynasty Warriors combat. You just mindlessly mash against braindead enemies that don't even do damage back to you, assuming you're not doing the QTE instant win button attack.

>>12508048
Wind Waker's combat isn't as braindead as >>12508059 says, but the combo variety plays a negligible part in it anyway. Things like knocking enemies over or stunning them is more valuable than anything else, and I don't think there are any enemies that truly respond differently to the various attack angles, whether blocking or not. Maybe stabbing is slightly faster? Maybe knockback angles are different? Anyway, the easiest way to challenge the player is to simply throw more and more enemies at them, which is arguably too hectic to be considering directional attacks during. It's a shame that the options aren't important.

The Darknuts are a bit more interesting, since the QTE has two different possible outcomes: removing their chest armour (which you can also do without a QTE), and removing their helmets. In the former case, they become vulnerable to regular sword attacks. In the latter case, they can be stunned by boomerangs and looted via the grappling hook.

All that aside, the Wind Waker combat still feels great, which I think is valuable in itself.

Duplicate thread of a duplicate thread: >>12507212

>>12507989
It must have been pretty bad because Sunshine's development lead DIRECTLY to a new Nintendo team being formed. Nintendo EPD Production Group No. 8 was formed under Koizumi and became the main dev team for 3D Mario games (as well as Jungle Beat and Bananza).
Not sure if there are any actual interviews corroborating this.

>>12507297
>it's the everything else
It's not even the everything else, it's the vast amounts of nothing.

>>12507989
They were rushing things out the door on the Gamecube. Ocarina of Time's many delays and the N64's small library really hurt them. Plus they were worried about the entrance of Microsoft and they didn't want to over invest in any one single game. But, also, Yamauchi had stepped down, Iwata became CEO and Miyamoto and others became executives, so they kind of stopped trying so hard.

>>12508274
What’s strange to me is that neither of them seem rushed based on their release dates. Sunshine came out the following summer of 2002 after the fall 2001 launch and Wind Waker in spring of 2003. I get the feeling that Nintendo was used to small, efficient dev teams and had a hard time adapting to the extra manpower needed to make 3D games in the sixth gen era.

>>12508048
explain how any of these (and the non-pictured ones) various sword swings matter and why you would ever need/want to use one over the other.

Wind Waker isn't perfect but if you wanna see what a worse version of this game would be, go play Skyward Sword

>>12507301
Yes, Miyamoto

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For every windwaker hate thread you make, I like the game even more.

>>12509123
Answering the second question first, as >>12508217 says, it usually doesn't matter in combat. That said, one of the options for a final strike is a spin attack, complete with the sizable range. Another two attacks string together in a jumping combo. It's on the slower side, but it looks sick. There is a small, but notable use case for different attacks.

As for why they matter, the "excessive" movements help compliment his title of Hero of Winds. Whether leaping around the battlefield with parries or "dancing" with directional combat, it can be said to show a reliance on mobility, something commonly associated with wind, over raw power or durability. Another side is to point out is how his combat flows, where this Link also has strong associations with water.
There's more, such as elemental air's temperament being sanguine, with this Link being the most lively and carefree depicted at the time, but that's getting to a larger scope. The short version is: having such an option for different attacks is tied in with the narrative.

>>12511082
>it doesnt matter except for one aoe move
>i will now wax poetic about themes and shit
so unless you want to elaborate on "There is a small, but notable use case for different attacks." other than the aoe of spin, then the conclusion is a resounding "it doesnt matter and the combat isnt special at all."

something like darksiders 2 has a variety of moves and combos (and weapons) that have ACTUAL use, in large part because of the animation timings, but also in aoe and hit effect (damage/hits, flinch/stun, launch, etc) and the fact that the combat encounters (see: enemies) actually provide/demand use for them. while some people might criticize dodge rolls (a valid discussion), its still a far more robust system than any zelda game.

it doesnt matte much what your character can do, if theres no reason for them to ever bother DOING it. crimson desert (not /vr/, i know) has a massive multitude of things that you can do, and inevitably there are certain moves are just outclassed and pointless compared to something better. but if link has a bunch of moves and there is only reason to use 1 or 2 of them, that is far worse and the variety far more meaningless.

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>>12507297
Wind Waker is great and Toon Link is best Link.

The game was heavily carried for the graphics but at least its a Zelda game unlike modern Zelda games that only have the name Zelda in common with the rest of the series

>>12507297
it's aesthetically very beautiful and the story is resonating and heartfelt. The game just falls apart a bit in the last act. I never saw the triforce charts as particularly bad because I just used a guide lol
Much like a lot of Gamecube games it just felt limited by having to come on a 1.5 GB disc

>>12507301
Yes. And they are right.

>>12507301
Yes, myself included.

5 dungeons, without the Majora's Mask gimmick of racing against time

Half the items are bags and things for your boat

A ton of grinding for map pieces of all things

Also when you get the master sword that's it. No quests for bonus swords

On the positive side, outset island and dragon roost are god tier tracks

Also a personal anecdote ..this came out the same time as pokemon RS and those lookout things in the ocean always reminded me of Kirlia

>>12511128
>Why are there multiple attack pattern chains?
Because it feels good and is more fun than mashing the same swing over and over. It makes battles feel more fluid and less like a robotic action. It's subtle immersion, if it's the same swing and hard swing every time it makes you subconsciously aware you're just using software.

>>12511645
What do you mean you quest for Master Sword +1 and Master Sword +2 just like in LttP.