imo
>Ancient Rome was a mistake
>having Gaul/Britian as a separate region was a mistake; should have been Latin+Gaul in the same region with Gaul in the North
>map gen sucks
>diagonal roads are really cool but we need more diagonal buildings too

>>2331710
>>Ancient Rome was a mistake
Kinda! I think a slightly romanticized Ancient Hellas colonization sim would have been a more fitting take on this islandhopping concept of the anno games

>>2331729
>>2331732

>>2331732
No, I think Hellas would also have been a mistake. And for me it's not out of any hate of the Ancient World, I think it's not good for the current Anno formula post-1800. An important game element is late game infrastructure (so you have to plan and design your cities from the start for things like rail lines and power), and while aqueducts can be an equivalent of that it's not as compelling. I've been trying to think about the late game infrastructure problem for a while now. All I could think of was caravan routes or something.
What I expected from 117 was to continue to build on what 1800 got right, but instead it was a step backward in many respects even if others are in themselves welcome additions.

>>2331738
That's relevant for Anno 1800. It wasn't for any of the previous annos unless they were sci fi because the age of sail or 1404 didn't have it. I did love anno 1800, but they can't just repeat 1800. anno 1900 (number autism aside) would be great to see given you get a similar leap (airplanes!) but it would have been foolish to follow up 1800 with a decade change.

I'd favor have just leaned into pure romanticized/fantastical antiquity. Anno 1800 had dieselpunk airships. Anno 117 could have automatronic taloses/colossi, hero of alexandria style steam-technology (Steampunk in an ancient context would have been a nice homage of sorts to 1800 but also distinct on its own). Except for ubisoft's collapse there's still time for that.

>>2331779
I'm not saying that the Anno series now always must have trains, I'm saying it needs late game infrastructure to keep the gameplay loop fresh.
Like let's say you were to set an Anno in medieval Italy. Canals might be a good choice, or perhaps you need to build a castle, or otherwise redesign what was initially a rural town into a Renaissance urban center.
One of the problems with Roman city planning is that it often didn't go through this evolution. It was very advanced, probably one of the best in history, but the Roman economy was 10% subtle genius innovations like sewers and concrete and 90% slave labor. They threw bodies at problems, and tended to copypaste their city plans because lowest common denominator mass production is best when you're throwing bodies at things. This contrasts with the Medieval Era, when you couldn't really throw bodies at things every time and so there was an increasing reliance on early machines until it all reached critical mass with the Industrial revolution. As related to Anno, this again makes the Ancient Era a poor choice because once the city exists there was little city planning done unless you wanted to build a bigger temple or expand an estate.

>>2331785
Gotcha I just thought you meant in the context of prior annos while you mean more "1800 showed how this really is essential for gameplay, no we have to have it more".

>>2331710
When I saw how big the research screen was and how it would take hours each node I assumed it was account wide and I'm still surprised it isn't. Like you've got the hall of fame unlocks just go all in on the franchise mode thing that other sim games are doing.

File: 1623885066785.jpg (2.2 MB)

2.2 MB JPG

>>2332339
There was an idea of a rogue-like Anno that really appealed to me and I'm disappointed we'll probably never get it.
Was basically
>you have to settle an island, but if you pollute the ecosystem gets fucked, but when you fail you unlock better and/or more sustainable production buildings and upgrades
Imagine a sequel to 2070 with that.

File: pax-romana-deep-water-dredger-captain-specialist.jpg (8.1 KB)

8.1 KB JPG

>>2331710
> what went right
> build Rome in 7 days±
> diagonal roads, diagonal! ROADS!!!
> land warfare
> deity worship adds a new dimension
> swamp britons are hilarious
> placeholder buildings kino
> aqueducts

> what went wrong
> game feels less polished than predecessor on launch
> performance issues
> unwieldy UI
> no newspaper with funny headlines
> "diverse" portraits

>>2332368
This appears to be an accurate representation of a decadent roman briefly before the collapse of the empire.

>>2332371
Isn't it about time to leave this sort of thing behind?

File: 1710790325161031.jpg (150.3 KB)

150.3 KB JPG

>>2332371
kek, good one
117 is a bit too early for Rome's fall.

On the subject of falling empires and decadence, I see no chance for an official DLC in the Levant, but ambitious modders could make a really funny mod. Imagine instead of building a wonder, you could have your soldiers tear down a monument to punish rebellions.

>>2331710
A shame noone mentioned production buildings buffing housing, I had the most fun building my city around around them, making little crafter's quarters.

Unfortunately, the 'diverse' portrait that was posted is accurate. Tiberius and Caligula were infamously nonces, and there was even one emperor that was an unironic troon as if he had isekai'd from 2020.
Our modern morality, as in the 'please stop being a fucking faggot you moron', was not present during the Iron Age. There were ideals of manliness and femininity and honor and so on, yes, but if you were sufficiently rich and aristocratic you would frequently mock these values as they were for the poors.
But at least on the flip side we have Marcus Aurelius, who is overhyped (it was just his personal journal) but still cool.

File: 1769813319704645.png (126.6 KB)

126.6 KB PNG

>>2332416
Which games represent the ethical frameworks and social norms of a specific era without filtering them through a 21st century lens?

>>2332539
The difficulty is that historical ethical frameworks and social norms either aren't relevant to gameplay per se, or don't make for good games, or don't live up to expectations.
Take slavery in ancient Rome. Extremely important, to the point where ignoring it is effectively putting the entire point of setting a game in Rome into question. Slavery was vital to providing the large quantities of manual labor that Rome needed for various projects, it was key to various social changes (Latifundia slaves are what contributed to mass urbanism made up of displaced small family farmers, and also the death of the Republic), and it educated the elite (Greek tutors were often slaves). There are so many things in Ancient Rome connected to slavery. But how do you turn that into gameplay? Not morally acceptable gameplay, just basic gameplay? It's a difficult question and you'd have to design pretty much everything around it, so ignoring it as 117 does is a deliberate choice that sometimes has to be made. The game can't get made if slavery is everywhere, nobody wants that shoved in their face, but it's the reality of Ancient Rome.

As for games that do put you in the proper mindset, King of Dragon Pass does a good job of making you think and act like a Bronze Age tribal chief.

>>2331710
No idea but the game is boring. I love Anno 1800 and fire up another round once a year. Played 117 for about 10 hours and couldn't do it anymore. But also can't point at the issue beyond that the setting is objectively worse than 1800's.

>>2332887
I can't really think of any way to salvage 117, unless you want to do something crystalpunk with Atlantis or whatever. Or have a Roman style "industrial revolution".
It's a shallow era. Rome peaked fast and then had a slow decline. By the 1300's, feudal Europe had surpassed it in many respects. Egypt or Greece won't fix things, as Greece had already peaked long before this and Egypt was hellanized to the point you can't even call it Egyptian (although I'm sure the devs will try to claim Nubians were still building Pyramids).

>>2332843
I was playing Grand Ages Rome before 117 and I liked the way it handled slaves. You purchase slave estates as you level up your character and this allowed you to build more slave markets which replaced your citizen workforce in your production buildings, freeing your citizens up for higher value productions. If 117 had some teeth regarding the Roman setting, slaves could've been a resource for your higher tier citizens. All they had to do was make a slave market production building that could only be built in Albion that generated slaves to be shipped back to Latium.

>>2333372
>Grand Ages Rome
Looks interesting. I'll give it a try based on your rec.
>Anno 117 slave markets
Anno has always put a big smiley face on history. It was never going to happen.

Calling the series anno really limits what could be done. 117 would have been better as an age of mythology type spinoff just lumping all the greek mythos into one game.

>>2333445
I disagree about the name because who cares, but the franchise could use a fantasy game where the devs can do whatever they want with the resources and pops.
Like three regions, humans on the ground surface, elves at the top of a world tree, and dwarves in an underground cave. That sort of thing, but not necessarily. Go wild with it.

>>2331710
It's not bad, it's fine even.
But it's sloppified and I think the design from ground up is very mashed together, poorly fitting.
And because of how game is designed from ground up, it's simplified and won't ever really reach the complexity from 1800.
But better than 2205 I guess?

>>2335338
let them cook, 1800 needed a couple years as well

File: hq.jpg (78.8 KB)

78.8 KB JPG

>>2331710
shieeet mane, we need a whole bbc dlc next, knaw mean?

>>2332887
>But also can't point at the issue beyond that the setting is objectively worse than 1800's.
because anno is a game about supply chains and economy so more complex societies naturally lend themselves to it and rome, while civilized, is not nearly as complex as industrial society

>>2335346
1800 was good with Bright Harvest. It didn't take years.

>>2335414
Posted while throbbing hard

They should remake 1602 and 1701

>>2332346
>There was an idea of a rogue-like Anno
Jesse what the fuck are you talking about

>>2332346
>2070
The last good anno...

>>2336033
I'm dead serious. And it sounded pretty good.
The rogue-like part is where your ecosystem gets fucked, your island fails, and you start over unlocking things.

>>2331710
> what went right?
It's still Ubisoft.

>>2332539
Pax Augusta
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1989760/Pax_Augusta/

File: file.png (139 KB)

139 KB PNG

>>2336476
>metaprogression makes the game like rogue

>>2336033
>rogue-like Anno
>what is against the storm

>>2332368
> "diverse" portrait
Hello, I don't want to start a thread for this question, so I'll ask it here.
Is there any way to change the NPC portrait?
It really ruins my immersion,in both games, 1800 and 117.
Whenever I see a black person, a race that couldn't discover the island of Mandasgascar using any kind of ship, it ruins the immersion.

>>2336574
I would think so given mandasgascar doesn't exist.

>>2336574
what if I copied this post to steam/ubiforums

File: 1763646386566157.jpg (51.4 KB)

51.4 KB JPG

>mfw the flame that never goes out, goes out

>>2336490
The whole game revolves around you failing initially and slowly unlocking content. It's the Anno version of Against the Storm. So yes, it is a rogue-like.

File: laughinrickpat.png (114.4 KB)

114.4 KB PNG

>>2332368
Why does that dude have mascara on

>>2337079
He's just zesty like that.

>>2337074
that's not "the roguelike part" though. if 100% of the stuff were unlocked on the first run then it would just be as much of a roguelite

>>2331710
>what went wrong?
they should have ditched the island gimmick and made each map just one big land mass. Instead of trading between islands, you would just trade between neighbouring cities over land routes. it made sense to have islands 20 years ago when the whole game was just one map and each island was supposed to represent a different part of the world, but now that we have a world map, we don't need to do that. An island map could have been added for the greece DLC; and for the egypt DLC, trading up and down the Nile. but the whiny Anno autists need to play the same goddamn game right down to the same silly fertility mechanic, and so we end up with a game that makes no sense at all.

oh yeah, and they added an N-guy

>>2337167
>they should have ditched the island gimmick and made each map just one big land mass
So make it a non-Anno game?
Islands aren't the problem here. That's a key part of the basic Anno gameplay loop. You have an island, can't produce everything on it, must settle a new island, that island doesn't have everything on it, trade results. If you make it one big landmass then it destroys the whole franchise identity; in fact Anno 2205 did that in some regions and it sucked ass.

>>2337183
Just make territories have hard borders. You can duplicate the effect of water on land.

>>2337234
That's exactly what Anno 2205 did and it sucked ass. They broke up land within a region with bridges, and trade was automated between regions. It sucked ass.

>>2337240
>and trade was automated
Kind of burying the lead there.

>>2337244
It's all from the poisonous fruit of "no islands".
>but just use land caravans
The ocean provides negative space (as in, unused neutral empty space) for the trade entities to move around in and for trade disruption to occur. You need to protect your trade routes.
The land is positive space. It's where you build shit. You don't defend the land like you do the ocean.

>>2337247
Yes this can all be duplicated with land. The fact that 2205 did it poorly does not mean it is bad as a rule, just that a poor implementation is bad.

>>2337249
>Yes this can all be duplicated with land
Nope, not without creating arbitrary rules that turn certain sections of land into positive space "islands" and other sections into negative space "oceans".
This was tried with SimCity 2013. It too did not work.

>>2337263
You seem to be under the impression that failed things do not work as a rule and not because the things they were attached to failed for other reasons. SC2013 failed because of a myriad of reasons most notably the city size being tiny. The individual region component was the sole interesting aspect that game had going for it.
Rules make games interesting, they are not arbitrary just because you don't like them.

>>2337265
It's funny that you identify a problem with the game (small city size) and then claim a huge innovation (regions) which resulted in the problem (large regions means small cities because cities can't be self-sufficient, they have to be like islands, only it's arbitrary because islands don't occur on land and cities aren't locked to particular borders just because and certainly don't exist as islands of civilization in between oceans of empty land).
You aren't even honest about why you want a land based Anno. It's just autism about Italy not being an archipelago. Islands are essential to Anno's core game mechanics, and by removing islands you fuck up everything else downstream.

>>2336574
Your only option is suicide

>>2336574
>Whenever I see a black person,
Robert Downey Jr is not black.

File: 20260209193119_1.jpg (1.1 MB)

1.1 MB JPG

I got around to building the amphitheatre, called it a day and uninstalled. Something about this Anno really didn't grip me, not sure why. I guess I disliked the Roman setting. Maybe I'm imagining it but I feel there was a sense of adventure and exploration in the older Anno games which I didn't get at all with this game. My historybrain knows that Rome already controls all these provinces so it never feels like I'm conquering new lands. Also building shitshacks in Albion didn't appeal to me at all, I would've much preferred if they just went with Egypt to start instead of it being future DLC.

>>2336574
It is possible as the asian mod did change all of them, however as you'd expect such a mod would get nuked in a day by ubisoft themselves as racist and most modders nowadays are troons so if anything you are more likely to get more troons and bbc portraits if anything

>>2336574
really triggered the troons with that one

File: historical accuracy.png (999.6 KB)

999.6 KB PNG

>>2338776
Thanks for your reply, I'd better keep playing 1404.

>>2339363
this was pozzed as well iirc, remember the chungus grand vizier vs le evil catholic bishop

>>2339470
Well, it was made by German Protestants.

>>2339470
>being so brain rotted you internalize 1400's religious disagreements as being pozzed
Yes in 1404 there was rampant anti catholic sentiment due to the corruption of the church. They fought a war over this about a century later.

>>2337069
Lol

File: 1746348519959515.jpg (373.5 KB)

373.5 KB JPG

We're talking about the people who are so aware of social issues they inadvertently put a racist caricature of a black man in their game.

>>2335346
See I think the issues with Anno 117 are in fundamental design of the game.
The way tiers are done and the way the promotion of tiers works simplified the game.
Sure there might be "more tiers than in 1800" on paper, but a lot of the goods are simply reused. The supply chains are simpler and require less transportation of manufacturing goods between islands. It's simpler by design.

Then the way specialists work and how retarded some of them are. "+1 for each mine in radius" is absolutely fucking useless to the point I don't understand why would they even include it - it feels half AI generated. Or rather not thought out at all. Similarly other stackable effects are worthless when applied and what matters the most are buildings that increase your population, religion and science. The population increase is the most important because due to how economy scales, you need mostly the low tier workers, but there is the least of them in their houses.

Most gods feel pretty fucking useless and I see no point in ever using them - nice and thematic on paper, but you'll prefer Minerva for speed up the scientific "research".
Science feels like just padding to make sessions longer and lot of it feels silly like discovering fucking wells.
Once again - this just feels very poorly thought out and just slapped together.

Then there is/was(I read they did some updates to it) island and resource generation. But the island variety is low too.
Campaign ends just when it feels like it's properly starting. There are less AI opponents.
It just feels unfinished/rushed to release.

It's like baby's first Anno - still fun, but I do think it's sloppified and simplified design to release on consoles too.
Then there is the issue of them selling you AI artbooks which just fucking pisses me off.

Arguably, yes, they might be able to fix it and add actual complexity down the line with DLC, but it'll require bigger rework and rebalancing. I'd write more but I ran out of characters.

>>2339863
>the liberals are the real racists!

>>2339535
No I just love deconstructing your belief systems which you built up in your head about your favorite childhood games. 1404 is pozzed. the premise is really if you break it down is that brown jihadists good, white christians bad (except when they're reformed awesome redditors haha)

File: 1746538880268990.png (293.5 KB)

293.5 KB PNG

>>2340070
Yes.

>>2331779
>anno 1900 (number autism aside) would be great to see
Given that late stage Anno 1800 has mopeds, you already have Anno 1900

>>2340100
could anno cold war work realistically?

>>2340090
and that's a good thing

>>2339918
This is the moment everything went wrong.
When you waste your time with dumb shit like this (and you hire people to be responsible for it) you've lost the plot.
https://www.anno-union.com/devblog-the-anno-brand-crafted-with-care/

>>2339918
i daresay anno was never really fun.
there are better games for logistics chain of supply simulation
there are better games for simcity urban planning
there are better games for ship combat and trade routes
maybe they should finally let this archipelago meme go

>>2339918
The mid-tier farm buff from Ceres is really powerful where you can expand the size of your farm fields. Problem I ran into, I was hit with an event where I chose -1 Religion, not realising I would be stuck with this debuff for 4 fucking hours until it ran out, causing my Ceres influence to decline and for me to lose the buff from the expanded fields. Totally crashed some of my supply chains, but it wasn't worth rebuilding all my farm layouts because I knew the debuff was only temporary, even though it lasted for 4 hours. Some bullshit. I ended up just setting passive purchase orders for the goods I couldn't produce until the debuff wore off.

>>2339918
I actually like good reuse. There is nothing worse than some random good with a huge production chain only being relevant for one pop. And I'm not talking about the higher tiers.

>>2340120
No actually, there's a difference between being racist based on experience and the ability to link cause and effect, and being racist from mental illness.

File: 1755279304683665.jpg (936.9 KB)

936.9 KB JPG

>>2340148
Nah, 1800 is kino.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YVv3F81lBU

File: file-20221114-15-2872gz.jpg (364.2 KB)

364.2 KB JPG

>>2332368
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hE0qgOlIYhM

File: anno117.png (995.6 KB)

995.6 KB PNG

Thanks Anno team.
https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/3274580/view/525368018321014829?l=english

>>2341057
well anyway im not interested in buying the game until all the dlcs are out

>>2341057
Very nice. I will make sure to pirate the $150 End of Rome edition in three years time.

>>2340102
I think the tropico devs are trying to do that with tropico 7

>>2341057
The cosmetic packs were genuinely a great idea, giving the parts of team that usually is left with nothing to do after their work is done something to work on.
I have to wonder where those parts of the team were when they were making the last DLCs and had the same fucking model for the malls/multifactories though. Apparently that was out of budget scope.

>>2339918
I agree the production chains are more simple compared to 1800, but I don’t mind it as the game has widened it’s scope in terms of city layouts and other mechanics. Not to mention that Roman commodity production was just simply plainer than Industrial Revolution commodity production; I think the balance in Anno 117 fits.

I agree about science and the tech tree being useless padding, however. It should be population based like in 1800.

I’m hopefully optimistic about the future of the game, I think they have a decent base to build on. They seriously need to cut the AI art shit out though, there’s no excuse for thar whatsoever.

>>2340148
Yea but I like the way Anno combines all those things.

I could be wrong, but it seems like there's another significant change in 117, at least compared to 1800.
Namely, subsequent tiers of 117 residents require new goods/services PLUS all previous tiers. IIRC, housing levels in 1800 had some overlapping requirements but quite a lot of unique ones. So a Farmer household has basically nothing in common with an Investor household, for example.
Meanwhile, senators have everything a libertes has, and then some. (Which makes sense, given such households had peasants/slaves who needed such goods.) Were previous Anno games like this as well?

>>2331710
I'll never buy this. The devs are cocksuckers and banned anyone for being critical of their blatent blackwashing of roman history.

>>2346814
Rome was always black and Kangcore

>>2346814
It's Scipio AFRICANUS, chud.

File: IMG_3483.jpg (65.6 KB)

65.6 KB JPG

>>2346814

>>2347328
>>2346814
what's this chud maldie lately? thought anno is a cozy franchise

>>2347371
I think they made the representative of the Roman Empire a black guy, so it's time to have a melty.

I thought it was all about Ubisoft being shit, but nope.

File: Moving the Goalposts.jpg (95.2 KB)

95.2 KB JPG

>>2347328

>>2347328
7/10 bait

>>2347393
No, it's a fact. Backed up with evidence. If it wasn't for Hobbes, Heidegger and Nietzsche, "right-wing intellectual" would be an oxymoron.

Remember, you can't be a "liberal" without reality denial.

>>2336475
And it still had flaws due to Ubishit's obsession with tying important stuff to online bullshit.

If there was a remaster I'd support, it'd be one that makes it so those online things can be used offline.

File: happiest_merchant.png (116.3 KB)

116.3 KB PNG

>>2331710
I always feel super happy when I reach that stage... the people are well when the economy is booming

File: 1699157189582813.png (3 MB)

3 MB PNG

>>2331710
woke garbage, move on

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqxgePDs7GQ
New cringe dropped. It's a teaser for the upcoming DLCs.