>>152627360
I can't prove that wrong but I will say that all mutant women are super fucking hot.

>>152627390
Hot, but bitchy. I'm not sure there's a mutant girl who's not a bitch these days. Even the ones that used to be nice, like Kitty, have become bitches now.

CIRCUMFLUX ACCENT

>>152627360
Kitty was literally perfect for him and I forget what went wrong. Probably some melodramatic overblown nonsense

>>152627632
Peter cheated on her

>>152627408
What about Squirrel Girl?
She seems pretty reserved.

>>152627360
There are an awful lot of mutants who are assholes, aren't there? And even the non-assholes tend to like to pal around with the absolute assholes and not think much of it.

File: cycevssentianels.jpg (278.5 KB)

278.5 KB JPG

>Mutants: We just want to be accepted and people who fear us are bigots
>Also Mutants:

>>152627640
that doesn't sound like the Pete I remember

>>152627649
They retconned Squirrel Girl to not be a mutant

>>152627659
this matters far less when any random jackass can science or magic themselves into similar shit. This case in particular is just 2a home defense

I was reading some Krakoa arc stuff, and it was crazy just how self-righteous and stuck up most of the mutants are portrayed. A far cry from the "let's assimilate" commentary from the X-Men in the 70s and 80s.

File: uGmdezQ.jpg (460.6 KB)

460.6 KB JPG

>>152627665

File: thing cleans up.jpg (599.2 KB)

599.2 KB JPG

>>152627678
>when any random jackass can science or magic themselves into similar shit.
That is not as rare as you think it is and in the instances where it is possible the person in question will typically put forth a better public image.

>>152627740
To be fair, the Fantastic Four are, in-universe, particularly good at crafting a positive public image. Reed went out of his way to do it. Meanwhile it seems like all the mutants these days have convinced themselves that Magneto was right and they really are Homo Superior and don't need to bother with the opinions of the lesser lifeforms.

>>152627740
that's just one good guy/member of a team of good guys. There are countless bad guys who stumbled into power and relish in being selfish dicks

>>152627771
yes but you can tell the difference between the good guys and the bad guys pretty easily

>>152627665
That’s the OG Ultimate Universe

File: 1765642636267608.jpg (102.6 KB)

102.6 KB JPG

>>152627779
well that's sort of the whole problem since that seems to not apply to mutants despite the vast majority of them just want to live their lives peacefully

>>152627692
This was a consequence of early 2000s Marvel deciding there should be more mutants and to write them more like a real minority group, the whole idea of assimilation got thrown out as outdated to IRL identity politics and got replaced with increasing levels of resentment and hostility towards the human majority, and an ever-increasing threat escalation to try and justify the X-Men's radicalization. X-Men just needs to be put out of it's misery, it can't be fixed because the audience won't let it happen.

File: magneto 12.jpg (181.8 KB)

181.8 KB JPG

>>152627802
The problem is there's no one trying to defuse the mutant situation. An Avengers or Fantastic Four villain fucks shit up, someone is usually shown or implied to have explained and helped fix the situation. A mutant villain fucks shit, mutant heroes fuck shit up to stop him but then they fuck off without a word. In the off chance you do get them to explain they talk like and say things very similar to the what the villain was banging on about. Maybe if they spent less time bragging about being the next evolutionary step or how people fear what they don't understand they might get on better. Because people do understand them very much.

>>152627882
The "next step in evolution" bit never made sense as mutants can still have non-mutant children

>>152627882
They also keep making excuses for the bad mutants. Like, Magneto is responsible for the deaths of millions, yet he gets to pall around with the X-Men a lot of the time. Same even for worse mutants like Mr. Sinister, these days.

File: 1745738054884095.jpg (112.9 KB)

112.9 KB JPG

>>152627882
the x-men explicitly did do all of that stuff. I'm glad somebody mentioned Ben and the FF because they were close allies and mentors to the x-men who helped with these kinds of issues going way back to the very beginning. I won't pretend and act like I've kept up with all the hackery that has gone on through the years but if they abandoned most of the core tenants of the x-men, their heroism, and mutant struggles then that's a whole other issue. Also means the dream is dead which seems so ridiculous that there's no way they allowed it to happen

>>152627761
Mutants are the masters at making it seem like they're secretly bad guys
>Call themselves homo superior and will call humans homo inferior
>Will actively recruit bad guys so long as they said sorry even if their body count is triple digit
>All their activity against their villains is obstructed so it seems more like they're faking these villains
>Are apparently indestructible Gods but "oh no a normal person called me a mutie boo hoo"
>Have some secret inclusive mansion only mutants are allowed to go to (but some supers can come if they're nice)
>Then an even more super duper secret island is made that only mutants are allowed into
It's like they want people to suspect they're plotting a global domination plan.

>>152627360
It's actually gotten worse! There's no reason we needed to spend years on them having a fucked up immortal ethnostate where they lorded over others, but for some reason we did! The entire, already tenuous oppression/minority/hatred of the other metaphor is just completely gone now. There's no way to look at the X-Men comics that have been coming out and even pretend you can take any of it seriously.

>>152627678
>>152627802
the difference with mutants is they're not a one off thing they breed and there's no telling what kind of powers their children will have, with the people who got powers from some science or magic incident you run into/learn about that induvial and decide to whether to hate and fear them or not based on that and that's it. With mutants even if the one induvial you meet is harmless they might produce a child whose power is to make people with in a certain radius of them spontaneously combust. Not only that but with mutants you get mutant culture and mutant solidarity that has them constantly making excuses for mutant villains.

File: 1768754451473734.png (631 KB)

631 KB PNG

>>152627802
>you call this friendly, charismatic, handsome, acrobatic young man with a charming accent and voice like satin to the ears a human?!?

>>152627974
>the x-men explicitly did do all of that stuff.
>pic shows them palling around with Magneto
nah the x-men have always been unlikeable cunts

File: beast autographs.jpg (1.1 MB)

1.1 MB JPG

>Mutant on the X-men: MUTIE FREAK!
>Mutant on the Avengers: I WANT TO HAVE YOUR BABIES!

File: IMG_0072.png (1.6 MB)

1.6 MB PNG

>>152627974
>Also means the dream is dead which seems so ridiculous that there's no way they allowed it to happen
Not only have they long abandoned that dream, they’ve long since embraced and espoused Magneto’s beliefs that mutants are inherently superior to humans and that mutants and humanity will never see eye to eye, even if they refuse to the level of genocide. Which is fucked up, but the writers either don’t seem to know nor care, or worse seem to think that it’s better for mutants to abandon humanity to their fate.

Yeah, I miss the old X-men, but they’re long gone by now.

File: beast handshake.jpg (58.1 KB)

58.1 KB JPG

>>152627974
>Also means the dream is dead which seems so ridiculous that there's no way they allowed it to happen

It was never SUPPOSED to happen. These are ongoing never ending struggles. It's just meant to be a framing device to motivate the hero. There was never meant to be some grand conclusion where the world suddenly stops hating. They were meant to save the day, give some speech about the potential for goodness, and MAYBE someone, as an individual, would realize they were good and change for the better. That way they can have the audience reflect on the real world parallel themselves and inspire to make the change in reality. And also they can keep milking it.

>>152629357
>It's not a narrative, its a setting
>Finally someone who actually gets it
Somehow everyone forgot this, and X-Men comics stopped being a superhero soap opera about a small group of characters and started being about "the struggle of the mutant race". And even embracing the idea that mutants really were a separate race was a mistake.

>>152629227
this is truly abysmal. Unbelievable that they let it get to this

>>152629357
not supposes to happen for the sake of never ending stories is different from straight up renouncing it as a core motivation. It's like spider-man saying to hell with "with great power comes great responsibility" or batman turning into the punisher because the ends justifying the means. It such a fundamental shift from origin that it's a crazy development

>>152629357
>It was never SUPPOSED to happen
For what it’s worth. I’ve never bought that as an excuse, since the Civil Rights act hasn’t killed racism, the 19th amendment hasn’t stopped sexism, and the RFMA hasn’t magically made homophobia disappear. If anything, a world where mutants and humans are made to legally tolerate each other is just as much jn need of X-men to be the bridge between mutants and the normies, since all it takes is the next self-appointed successor to Magneto’s will publicly exhorting mutants to start a race war to threaten all that progress.

File: Ultimate-X-Men-11.jpg (142.2 KB)

142.2 KB JPG

>>152627360
If the government was trying to exterminate me and my friends with giant robots and concentration camps, I think I'd be a little irritable too.

>>152627360
This is Ultimate Marvel, where Wolverine, a loyal Canadian soldier, was kidnapped during WW2 and turned into a living weapon. He was used, too, specifically in the Gulf war. Everyone at Weapon X, a division of SHIELD, routinely shot and tortured him for fun. When Nick Fury liberated him, they kidnapped a bunch of mutant teenagers and coerced them through more torture into being assassins. The complicity of the US government in all of this gives them plenty of reason to be dickholes. Jean is also OOC here because it’s a glorified gag comic.

>>152629570
Ultimate X-Men is good though

>>152629432
I feel like this is something everyone just sort of understood originally. I really don't get how or when this became so complicated.
>>152629464
Well it's not like hunting down and killing mutants was ever really LEGAL. The prejudice has really gotten out of hand to an almost comical degree.

>>152629523
Probably should have told the Hellfire Club not to fund and push for those programs then.

Never mind that the X-men are friends with one of said funders, and allow her to teach children. Guess it doesn’t count if it’s a mutant making the X-men’s lives miserable now.

>>152629597
It got out of hand the moment they not only confirmed humanity only became racist to mutants due to sentient bacteria, but also that humans had a literal extinction gene coded into them the moment mutants first showed up.

>>152629579
this page is from Ultimate Spider-Man, written by Benis. I think he did a better job writing the X-Men during Deadpool, but with Jean’s past and Charles’ teachings, I don’t see her dumping Logan’s mind in someone else.

>>152629623
See this is what makes all the more crazy. The X-men KNOW all this. And what do they do? They make friends with the fucking bacteria.

>>152629598
This is an Ultimate thread, where the Hellfire Club actually funded the X-Men

>>152629651
That bacteria is Kitty’s son, what kind of example would she be setting for the girls reading if she didn’t make an effort to connect with him?

>>152629651
Cause fuck the normies, I guess. A sentiment I would agree with if it wasn’t applied so haphazardly by the X-men.

>>152629664
Don’t think I need to amend my statement then.

File: 1748450273441322.png (653.3 KB)

653.3 KB PNG

>>152629651
well yeah. This is one of those cases where hack writer builds upon hack writer to the point where you're beloved characters lose what makes them beloved characters. Happens pretty often in capeshit

>>152629684
they only funded the x-men as part of a long con to co-opt the Phoenix force and become the rulers of humanity, she killed Shaw but they remained thorns in the x-men’s side until Ultimatum finished off their leadership

>>152629707
You know, the horrid thing is that if you didn’t remind me this was from the first Ultimate universe, I’d have asked if I missed a recent storyline from 616, that’s how bad it has gotten.

>>152629464
This line of thought is simply taking the metaphor too damn far, which is exactly what the comics have done, just in a different direction.

There simply shouldn't be that many mutants beyond the costumed heroes and villains in the first place, and the whole idea of mutants being a separate race should be a belief shared only by mutant villains like Magneto, and the mutant-hating villains. Get back to that, get back to the book being primarily a superhero soap opera, and "progress" doesn't matter because the story is about the characters, not this civil rights movement but with superpowers fanfiction.

>>152629523
That's from Ultimate Marvel, and they're not your friends.

>>152629728
lol. I wouldn’t be able to blame you since a lot of plotlines and even literal characters like Wolverine’s son migrated to 616

>>152629762
Having a bunch of mutants is perfectly fine, the issue is that if you do then most mutants have to be people who neither have superpowers nor horrible deformities. If your average mutant gets something like a tail or the ability to photosynthesize it shows the pointlessness of both fear of mutants and mutant master race ideology.

>>152629780
>>152629780
Well yeah, so's the OP pic

>>152628657
>Sexy furry man who walks around half-naked has a fanbase
Color me surprised

>>152629996
There's literally no point to a larger number of NPC mutants existing who aren't going to be superheroes or villains except for doing racial metaphor stuff the books should never have been doing in the first place. They either exist to be victims of hate crime atrocities to escalate the threat level and radicalize the heroes, or the exist so the X-Men have a Muh Community and can other themselves and segregate themselves. If you just want stories about people who are just normal-looking, non-powered people doing a civil rights struggle you may as well just read about the actual civil rights movement instead of trying to turn X-Men into that.

I've often said the core issue with modern X-Men as>>152629455
implied, almost every mostly heroic character in Marvel sans someone like Frank has always lived by the adage of Power=Responsibility (Or "Ability=Accountability"). It's not just Peter, but Cap, Thor, T'Challa, (accountability as rulers for both as well) Hulk (the main drama being that he has less control and how to be accountable for it), Daredevil, even Tony who's "Great Power" is his intellect and assets. The premise of Xavier's school was to make this true for the X-Men as well, but over the years they have continually eschewed this in stories. The refrain of "We want to use our abilities in peace and unrestricted" is nice on paper but easily leads to Magneto like ideology and the way theyve completely ignored that responsibility or actively resist or resent it has landed them more and more in morally compromised situations and Im not sure if its cause of the writers warped morality or what. Like, most of them would be mortified if they lost their precious mutant status but why? Why is it important to you that much? The uncomfortable answer is often "because it makes me feel special/better" which already puts you in a category of unheroic.

>>152630152
And that leads to the first extinction saga, where the big crisis is most mutants lost their powers and no new mutants are being born. Instead of just living the best lives they can, the X-Men focus themselves on trying to ensure future babies are born as mutants, or even trying to turn existing people into mutants, like an old Magneto villain plot, all so they could go back to larping as a race and feel special and important again.

>>152627360
I don't like 616 Wolverine one bit, but in the spirit of fairness, I will at least note for the record that he is not a statutory rapist.

>>152630442
Xavier and Colossus though...

>>152627360
They should let these characters swear, like what are we doing here this isnt 1970 anymore

>>152630453
>Colossus
…do I dare ask?

>>152630462
USM was for kids despite the graphic carnage/venom murder scenes

>>152630484

I think they're talking 616 and just the age gape between him and Kitty. Then for Xavier that one thought bubble about liking Jean

>>152630484
Anon is alluding to the age gap between Colossus and Kitty. She was still in her mid teens when they met.

>>152630505
But… they’re only three or four years apart. what’s the big deal

File: 5457491-7672955061-xavie.jpg (455.6 KB)

455.6 KB JPG

>>152630505
Gross egghead

>>152630514
People like to meme that Colossus is a predator. Sometimes it's salty Kitty x Illyana shippers who ignore their ship has that issue too except Kitty would be the predator

>>152630514

well it is legally statutory since he's 18/19 and she's 13/14. but also they never did anything until both were adults.

>>152630505
It wasn’t just one thought bubble, Cyclops guessed that Charles loved her right before his “death” and Charles himself references it in the Phoenix saga.

File: 1741655090481575.jpg (20 KB)

20 KB JPG

>>152630514

>>152630526
I may be the only fan of sex pest Xavier. This isn’t even that bad compared to the Micronauts crossover everyone forgot about. I think him repressing everything bad about himself is cool

>>152630526
how is this a problem if he doesn't actually do anything? Thought police is bad

>>152630669
repressing his Jean boner is part of why he becomes onslaught, at first, anyway. It’s also pointed out that his special treatment of Jean is thrown into question if he was in love with her the whole time.

>>152629523
They need to bring back the idea that you can be cured of being a mutant

>>152630716
it was a minor factor especially when the strain of mindfucking magneto is ultimately what blew the whole thing. The special treatment is just typical human shit that ultimately barely amounts to anything. The bigger point is there's really nothing to be done about his feelings. What happens when he professes (heh) his love? A bunch of bullshit they didn't need

>>152630798
confessing to Jean and turbo repressing his feelings are the extremes, not doing something in between is part of why he snapped, by using his powers to repress anything negative

>>152630655
>Micronauts crossover

he made moonstar forget it ever happened, didn't he

>>152630865
Maybe, but he told the rest of the X-Men that he was the Entity and they didn’t do a thing about it

>>152628657
It's sad that they've character assassinated beast when he was always better an avenger

File: catbeast.png (651.2 KB)

651.2 KB PNG

>>152627692
proof that liberals are not leftists. they are tone deaf and actually thought that a fascist ethnostate was woke. they completely abandoned any kind of story about class consciousness, like lumpenproletariat morlocks vs bourgeois hellfire club

they literally had magneto spout off a diatribe that was like the protocols of elders of zion about a capitalist scheme to take over the world's economy.

liberals, everyone. you can't make this shit up.

>>152629357
>it's never supposed to happen
but that's bullshit. earth 616 can be more welcoming to mutants, then writers can write different stories. holy shit why would you want all the x-men stories to be the same forever?

>keep milking it
you have no imagination and low standards

>>152630152
>sans someone like Frank
disagree, frank is almost as retardedly about it as spidey is, just in a different direction for the wrong-doers. Spidey hopes they can be saved too and that one day they'll become good people too while Frank thinks about all the potential victims on the way to that path and decides that's not a fair trade. Both of them think that nobody else should ever have to suffer the way they did just because fate decided everyone who could've stopped it looked the other way.

>>152631063
>but that's bullshit. earth 616 can be more welcoming to mutants,
Of course they can and have been. My point isn't that things can't get better, my point is; making things perfect is an unrealistic goal. The x-men should effect changes around them. It should get better and it should get worse. You can't have it be absolutely one or the other. When things are going too bad, let something good happen. When things are too good make something bad happen. They should, in a way, treat mutants like Spider-man. Let them be both loved AND hated.

>>152627714
Those six panels at the bottom are arranged wrong.

File: Magneto_Badass.jpg (117.7 KB)

117.7 KB JPG

>>152631033
To be fair, Magneto has, somewhat accidentally, become an EXTREMELY on-the-nose allegory for the State of Israel. It's almost spooky how well it's lined up, when there was clearly no intent there.

>>152631348
I never understood how that Malcolm X comparison ever took off when Magneto's about as Israeli as it gets without outright making him a stereotype

>>152631678
You have to remember he wasn't canonically Jewish in the beginning. Despite literally being created by a couple of Jews, I'm not sure if Lee and Kirby ever even had it in mind that he'd be a Jew. That doesn't seem to take hold until the late 70s and early 80s.

Meanwhile the MLK vs Malcolm X debate was literally contemporary to the two of them since the Civil Rights Movement was actively going on.

>>152631707
I mean sure but early Magneto was also a budget Dr. Doom to go along with the X-Men being a junior Fantastic Four. He didn't get any complexity or any sort of ideology until Claremont

>>152630233
I always hated that shit.
Your humans, faggots, not some new "race".
You want to know what people fear you?
Unpredictability and level of powers.
At any point, a new mutant has their powers turn on and it could be anything. Enhanced senses, weather manipulation, gravity control, etc and people usually get hurt but even then, what if the kid is an asshole?

Imagine some school shooter tier kid getting the ability to shoot kinetic force from his fingers or some muslim becoming a living bomb that doesn't die from the explosion.

We get like ONE Xman who has super useful powers, for everyone , but we have to hate them because they are....a mutant!?

Mags has super useful powers, but he's an angry Jew. That said, why doesn't he consult with the elder console of Jews? What gives?

>>152627802
Why is Leslie Nealson so angry at mutants?

File: IMG_1597.png (3.5 MB)

3.5 MB PNG

>>152627667
>One cute hot mutant girl with great personality
>Have to retcon her
>Either make her a huge bitch or not a mutant
>Not a mutant, honest
Based

>>152631992
They kept calling him Shirley.

>>152627802
Modern mutants would crucify you if you dared to call them human.

>>152630865
What's the story behind how Marvel are supposedly never going to reprint that crossover anyway? It's stupid that it's left out of the Micronauts Epic Collections.

>>152631707
I can remember someone here claiming Kirby was against Claremont giving Magneto that backstory, if true it wasn't something they'd ever intended. Stan once talked about how they'd considered the idea of Magneto being Xavier's evil brother but never went through with it.

>>152631992
They hate Enrico Palazzo.

>>152629227
As much as this is retarded ,the "follow our owns dreams" is actually the best the Xmen should go.
Made some of them go to another Planet lead by Cyclops and Magneto going full exodus
Made some of them being Avenger Unity Project led by Wanda and Beast, receaving mission from Tony/Steve and having a rotating team.
Have Kitty try to follow Xavier dream and create her own school.
Hell , this could finally fix the Xmen.

>>152633938
They already tried that. Multiple times. Hell, it was the most prominent right after AVX, with Logan running a school, Cyclops going full Che Guverra, the Avengers Unity Squad being formed, multiple X-men teams doing their own thing, and the time-displaced O5 eventually going into space for a while after deciding all the modern day mutants we’re fucking nuts.

Still ended with them all stuck back together and still masking how the mutants are dying writers are fucking hacks.

>>152629227
I know the characters were only having this conflict because Brevoort mandated that the teams should disagree on something, but the scene is completely bizarre since it basically reverses the positions the characters had in Fall of X. I mean it was literally just a few months prior that Logan was trying to murder Xavier en route to the prison. Cyclops spent the whole Krakoan era putting complete trust in Xavier. And Magneto, now on Cyclops's team, was the one who was ready to help Xavier dodge Graymalkin.

It's like Brevoort said "You know what was peak X-Men? Schism. We should do that again." And that'd be an insane, positively fucktarded way to start one's tenure as EIC and relaunch the line, but Brevoort did exactly that.

>>152634133
Honestly, I’ve given up on understanding what the X-men are even attempting to accomplish anymore or what their basic personalities are like beyond miserable, pissed off and on the rag.

>>152627740
>I get no respect I tell ya no respect at all
God I love Ben

>>152627632
>Probably some melodramatic overblown nonsense
>MJ got kidnapped and turned into a Sasquatch creature by an evil clone of Peter who was trying to empower her so she would no longer be in danger from Spider-shenanigans.
>The real Peter fought tooth and nail to save her and realized he still has feelings for her
>Kitty meanwhile unsuccessfully tried to rally the X-men to go help Peter because he was off coms for a while
>She rolls up to his place during an epilogue and sees him hugging MJ and realized it's over
It was a shame, I liked the ship too they had good chemistry. Bendis actually cooked with that one

>>152627360
A recentish Storm comic weirdly helped it.
A mutant doctor called out how the X-Men tend to grandstand about solidarity and make speeches about standing against ostracization then go on these weird power trips where they neglect extending their many, many, comically many benefits and connections to anyone without an X tramp stamp.

This is obviously due to the narrative tunnel vision and revenge power fantasy influenced scripts of writers more than any innate flaw of the characters but it's still become a notable oddity.

>>152634133
>And Magneto, now on Cyclops's team, was the one who was ready to help Xavier dodge Graymalkin.
While also embracing Xavier's dream after his stint in Hell. Really the issue is the same as it ever was; writers doing whatever the fuck they want with no regard for set up and Editors letting them. The inmates are running the asylum

>>152629523
Nigger that's the Ultimate line completely different setting. With how often these threads happen with the same posters you'd think people would understand this

>>152634652
>Editors letting them
This whole ideological rift between the teams was part of Brevoort's initial pitch for the relaunch, the same pitch that got him the EIC job in the first place. This idea was conceived and pushed for by the editorial desk.

>>152630526
I will never understand why this is so bad and "evil"
>I'm a twenty something year old man who's hot for this 17 year old girl who happens to share similar powers to me
>I can never EVER act on these feeling because it would be a SEVERE breech of ethics and her trust as I'm older, her teacher and hold authority over her
>Instead I'm going to fuck an of age bird alien lady
Xavier did everything right and he still gets shit on, it's bullshit

>>152631348
>when there was clearly no intent there.
No intent? Have you actually read Claremont. One of the running through lines was Xavier and Erik's friendship starting during the creation of Israel in the late forties early fifties. It's where they meet for the first time, it's where they workshopped their ideas about Mutants, it's where Magneto starts to change for the worse on his Nazi hunting expeditions. Israel is a HUGE part of Magneto's original backstory the parallels were always there

>>152634133
>Logan was trying to murder Xavier en route to the prison.
That makes it so much weirder that he was fighting for Chuck's life in X-Manhunt.

>>152634773
>the same pitch that got him the EIC job in the first place
who is this retard in charge of Marvel anyway that gave a promotion for something so retarded

File: tom brevoort memo from the ashes.png (448.8 KB)

448.8 KB PNG

>>152634897
He's been at Marvel for like thirty years. Maybe they just felt it was his turn or something.

>>152631678
American Propaganda History101. Malcom X was always held up as the scary anti MLK. The one who wanted violence and hate, despite the fact that as soon as he left the Nation of Islam, he became an actual Muslim, took his pilgrimage and came back from Mecca preaching about more universal liberation (then the FBI killed him same as MLK once he started transitioning toward Economic Justice and anti war sentiment funny how that kept happening). Meanwhile Israel is constantly held up as "the only Democracy in the Middle East" and "Scrappy little nation surrounded by hostile neighbors they trounce all by themselves", we're fed a LOT of propaganda about it the moment you get to the end of WW2 in History class.

>>152634236
Absolute fucking mensh, I never really appreciated him as a kid but as I got older I realized the Thing is my favorite hero just the best fucking dude

>>152634773
Which is why all this shit is so goddamn sloppy. Berevoot just says "make it so" but doesn't want to put in any fucking work to make it make sense

>>152634791
dude Xavier is well past 40

>>152634989
At the time in the book he was supposed to be like twenty five to the X-men's 16-17. Hell back in the sixties where that sort of thing would be treated as OK Stan and Kirby STILL had him mention that as their teacher and mentor it wouldn't be okay for him to make a move on Jean

>>152635007
What I'm trying to get is that maybe it's okay for characters to have bad thoughts, realize the thoughts are bad and have them work it out instead of everyone being perfect moral paragons 24/7. Let a mother fucker improve

>>152634989
Stan Lee's Xavier was a Korean War vet, he was in his mid-20s. Being bald just made him look older.

>>152635336
Plus the wheelchair

>>152627360
You're a mutant too, bitch.

>>152635778
The x-men deny mutates

>>152634133
Brevoort has this problem where he thinks that because Silver Age Marvel was interesting because of conflicts between heroes, that writers need to force conflicts no matter how it contradicts prior comics (this was the same issue with Nova and Star Lord in Hickman's Imperial)

>>152634773
>>152634897
>>152634924
He isn't EIC. Cebulski is still EIC. Brevoort just got moved to the X-Men offices (he'd previously overseen Avengers)

File: Untitled-1 copy.jpg (116.4 KB)

116.4 KB JPG

>>152627360

>>152637161
That doesn't even make sense. Only Logan was a pedophile and Peter didn't even know about that until after chewing them out.

>>152637282
Rich privately funded organization likely having Mossad and Israeli ties to use Mutant sympathy as spies for intelligence. Xavier is a huge pedophile known for crushing on Kitty and Jean when they were young, and probably mind wiped most of the female students after they got raped.

>>152636919
"Conductor of X" then. The big guy in the X-Office.

>>152631678
>Magneto's about as Israeli as it gets without outright making him a stereotype
He isn't an stereotype ONLY because the doods he fights literally made epstein island + eugenics.

>>152637282
Professor X wanted to fuck Jean from day one.

>>152627974
This Scott Summers is dead
If he lived, he would be one of the greatest DC Comics heroes til this day with zero rewrites, but since its marcuck

>>152629464
>since all it takes is the next self-appointed successor to Magneto’s will publicly exhorting mutants to start a race war to threaten all that progress.
Or just magneto again.

File: RCO003_1469204619.jpg (1.6 MB)

1.6 MB JPG

>>152627360
It's difficult to sympathize even with legitimate grievances and fears because Marvel's NPCs are just the absolute worst.
>More color among our heroes!
>Gippos and clankers don't count!
>AND EVERY DAMN DIRTY MUTIE SHOULD FUCKING HANG!
Like, what the hell are you supposed to do with this?

File: Big Jim.png (507.7 KB)

507.7 KB PNG

Miss me yet?

File: 1760557901738499.png (34 KB)

34 KB PNG

>>152637636
have a kickass PR department and monetize being heroes

>>152629523
>On one side, Nazi robots about to commit genocide.
>On the other side, Nazi mutants who believe they are the superior race.

I'm not sure who to support here.I think I'll just wait in a corner and see who wins.

File: 1738451497213257.jpg (847 KB)

847 KB JPG

>>152637636
>and clankers don't count!
they're worse than muties

>>152631033
>"Guys, it's not REAL [communism/socialism/leftism]" the moment things go to shit
Krakoa is pretty much every single collectivist commune in existence. Shady leadership, huge amount of freeloaders, fucked up social dynamics, people trying to profit off it for themselves, everybody is banging everyone else, cliqueism and backstabbing, and the continued functioning hinging on a few actually doing anything productive/funding it from the outside. About the only real differences were the lack of an open power struggle by the people in charge, Krakoa (the island) telling everyone to fuck off his land and getting a lawyer, and the lack of sexual assaults (though the existence of telepaths makes consent a theoretical notion at best).

File: Legion of X #2 page 19.jpg (472.9 KB)

472.9 KB JPG

>>152638134
They did have one seething incel doing a rape of a different kind.

File: 379716151_326352399969132_4182622660209621940_n.jpg (99.9 KB)

99.9 KB JPG

>>152638224
It's not like there was ever a question whether they allowed sex offenders on Krakoa. They had Shaw, Wyngarde, Mystique and a bunch of other sickos there.

>>152637701
Mutantrannies hate him because he made their precious Storm job against Spiderman.

>>152627360
Mutants shouldn't be killed on spot. After all, they didn't chose to be born as muggas.
As long as they are not "Jonh Death-Spore" or worse : telepaths.

I blame Bendis

File: the-masterminds-family-v0-zxbysz7bze2d1.jpg (1.1 MB)

1.1 MB JPG

>>152638291
It's fucked up that there's never been an arc with the whole Wyngarde family cast as the villains. They're all such messy bitches, it'd be fun.

>>152637701
unironically yes, marvel needs a Jim Shooter now more than ever

File: Jack-Kirby_art-of-jack-kirby_wyman-skaar.jpg (493.7 KB)

493.7 KB JPG

>>152633879
>Jewish, but doesn't want Magneto to be Jewish, disagreed with Claremont
>soldier in World War 2, creates Captain America despite Garth Ennis seething at Cap from a "respect the veterans" perspective

I think it's really funny how diametrically opposite Kirby is to what you'd expect him to be relative to some of the later comic book creators.

>>152627740
Is the lower east side of Manhattan still slums?

>>152634791
>>152635027
Xavier never worked the thoughts out. He used his powers to bury them until he forgot about them, which is why Onslaught clearly wants to bang Jean and asks her to join him. Which you could say is a retcon from how he described his feelings to Moira, but Marvel gonna Marvel.

>>152629523
I always wonder what would happen if a mutant entered a building full of normal people, say, a school or a bank. Would the robot simply destroy the entire building , or would it just wait for everyone to leave and then kill the mutant who was inside?

>>152641200
it'd destroy the building before killing the mutant

>>152628657
I miss this Beast :(

>>152641473
This. The Sentinels are the "killer robot" trope played pretty straight, they're not going to give a shit about civilian casualties.

File: 1743467966354527.png (1.8 MB)

1.8 MB PNG

>>152642252

Man, I'd love to see an Uncle Ruckus but for mutants.
>"Hang him! Hang that mutie bastard! I got the rope right here!"

File: beastbook.png (236 KB)

236 KB PNG

>>152638134
tell us about your special snowflake capitalism

>>152643540
X-Men Legacy Vol 2.

File: ifonlyouknewhowbadthingsare.png (417.1 KB)

417.1 KB PNG

>>152637701

File: legs.png (1000.1 KB)

1000.1 KB PNG

>>152642252

>>152642252
>Charles
>Cyclops
>Beast
You know, I'm realizing there's this habit of turning some of the moral paragons and classic leaders of the X-Men into vile assholes who do terrible shit for the "greater good" before just kind of devolving into despicable villains.

I don't mean in a "I think pattern recognition means paranoid conspiracy theories," but just that it seems like Marvel is fundamentally incapable of handling the moral rigor required in the X-Men stories and mostly resorts into turning them into petty assholes. A common failing in the soap opera world of capeshit, to be sure, but it seems to stick to the X-Men in a weird way, compared to how easily more other heroes seem to get easily rehabilitated.

File: beast and cyclops are friends.jpg (527 KB)

527 KB JPG

>>152642383
>>152642252
I miss them all. I miss us. Where did it all go so wrong?

File: 034wlv_com_mas_mob_03.jpg (193.8 KB)

193.8 KB JPG

>>152643540
By far the most logical character to become this is Wolverine. Logan has way more non-mutant friends than pretty much any other mutant, and he's also had a front-row seat for how assholish the mutants have become, even the ones that used to be nice like Scott and Jean. He's also surly and curmudgeonly. I can easily see him becoming Mutant Uncle Ruckus.

>>152643540
Ultimate Sabretooth was basically that, he rounded muties up for Weapon X and was the only one there willingly. He also talked about how Professor X and Magneto both sucked.

File: RCO036_1701993314.jpg (2.9 MB)

2.9 MB JPG

>>152642252

>>152634500
>Bendis
Bendis? The cartoonist?

File: wvjbfgl9mqxe1.png (903.5 KB)

903.5 KB PNG

>>152627390
It's not fair.

>>152627360
BRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAPPER-Man

>>152627667
it was a bullshit retcon that can always be retconned back if they want to, especially that they didn't really explain who she is either. There was even a page in some marvel anniversary one-shot, where SQ lamented about not being mutant anymore

>>152634236
>>152627740
>He says whilst a pair of hot girls are taking a selfie with him

>>152644161
No. Bendis, the writer.

this thread feels like a weird manufactured vendetta.

>>152644632
I take it you haven’t read recent X-men comics, cause they are direly in need of a better overhaul than that Krakoa shit gave them.

>>152643594
I'm not sure why it took so long for me, but two anons several years ago helped map out for me how the original 5 and Xavier have all been given fall from grace period, or periods, and even a design like Jean to Dark Phoenix, at this point I think it's purposeful. Either a mismanaged attempt at marketing or the writers actually think aimless heel turning is cool.

>>152642252
me too anon.
But marvel and some disgustings anons in this forums and other shit on him.
really sad, they hate marvel.

>>152644457
But why would anyone even bother? Squirrel Girl is one of the many characters who was just a mutant so her creators wouldn't have to bother coming up with an origin. What mutants are and how they're written has changed so much since her debut that keeping the funny comedy character as a totally separate thing from the oppression porn characters is just a decision that makes sense.

>>152627360
>"it's because you're all a bunch of fucking niggers!! That's why!!"
holy crap how did they get away with this? why would spiderman say this

>>152634500
But from Kitty's perspective, she broke up with him over a hug?
Bendis should have just made Pete realizing he had feelings for MJ a platonic friendship thing.

>>152627408
Wolfsbane. I mean, they reverted her to a really shitty-looking version of her age 14 look, but she's one of the nicest mutants you could meet. I'm kinda wondering if that incident with her son being killed was wiped from her mind, cuz that's not something you just eventually get over. And Squirrel Girl (not the fat lesbian with crazy-eyes that had her own comic, the actual Doreen Green).

File: New Mutants 2019 issue 15.png (1.3 MB)

1.3 MB PNG

>>152650226
>I'm kinda wondering if that incident with her son being killed was wiped from her mind, cuz that's not something you just eventually get over.
no

>>152627667
So what WAS she? She had retractable knuckle-spikes, rodent incisors, a SQUIRREL TAIL (only her squirrel ears were fake), better-than-a-trained-human-male-strength and agility, and a psionic bond with squirrels (and presumably chipmunks). That shit ain't factory baseline human. So, what, is she an Inhuman now, or are they trying to say she's absolutely human...SOMEhow, and won a serious genetic lottery.

>>152650242
I see. Damn.

>>152650267
Completely unknown

>>152650226
Her son was made to be kind of alive, only he's stuck in Hel with his dad. They seem to be doing okay.

>>152643594
it's not just them. there's some kind of weird fixation on leaders, paragons, and geniuses turning out to be shitty people

>>152627665
because fucking faggots spider-fags can't accept Peter not being with fucking MJ in any universe, Bendis had to end his relationship with Kitty. And of fucking course he will NEVER EVER FUCKING EVER allow his waifu to be in the wrong ever. So Peter had to be the asshole.

>>152651274
>because fucking faggots spider-fags can't accept Peter not being with fucking MJ in any universe
I've never heard anyone complain about Chat in Marvel adventures

>>152651600
Chat was one of the few girlfriends I’ve seen get the most support after MJ and Black Cat, especially since she’s one of the few mutants who isn’t a bitch.

File: frog.gif (60.7 KB)

60.7 KB GIF

>>152650242
Why does Marvel hate kids? They could've at least just sent him to some place where he'd be safe but never really seen. Rahne could say she just got back from seeing her son and that'd be the extent of his continued existence in comics. The whole story with him being the eighth billionth person born and every lord of hell wanting to kill him for some contest was a weird story that seemed to only serve one purpose of getting rid of the kid.

>>152627360
Based Spider-Man

>>152652037
Marvel was built on melodrama and angst.

>>152652037
because characters can't be happy or algo

>>152631140
It's French so you read it top to bottom, anon

File: 1704291251938794.jpg (55.4 KB)

55.4 KB JPG

>>152627360
i know the case against mutants sometimes get treated as an allegory for racism. but has there ever been anything about using them as an allegory for mental conditions like autism? feels like that'd make more sense as an allegory.

like a bunch of people point out, mutants obviously get a bit of pressure because they can do things like shoot lasers out of their eyes, while other races don't so the allegory is a bit moot. but conditions like autism really are a bit different. autists are better at logic-oriented fields. someone who's a psychopath isn't inherently bad, but they're definitely more inclined towards "bad behavior". feels like there might be more to using the x-men as an allegory for people with some mental illness or condition

>>152627408
is Jubilee a bitch? Post examples.

>>152627632
Pete and Kitty was the bomb. So much went right with Ultimate Spider-man and the Ultimate Universe until it all went wrong all at once.

>>152652386
The real problem is just, as X-Men itself has shown explicitly before thereby fucking everything up thematically, is there will never be a single human being in real life who is as inherent dangerous as a kid who just flat out kills everyone in a 10 mile radius of him without even knowing it.

That's it, that's the problem here. No amount of autism or blackness or being muslim will ever match the kind of casual destruction mutants are increasingly shown to be capable of because comicbook writers have the self control of a starved child in a room full of candy. The premise was on shaky ground even back when all they could do was fly or read minds or shoot punch lasers from their eyes, but at least their capability was incredibly personal. Now it's apocalyptic and you can only go "uh, sorry, but yeah, that's actually worth compromising personal liberties on."

>>152651989
Ultimate Kitty was never a bitch either.

>>152652633
Would you call control over electromagnetism “personal” or are you not enough of a clanker for that to apply

File: beast in jail.jpg (53 KB)

53 KB JPG

>>152652386
Time was they used to be a stand in for a lot of things. My favorite was always the disenfranchises youth adjusting to a world they don't understand or feel they have a place in. Generally anyone who felt like an outcast for any reason would see themselves in them. It was about the lonely.

File: RCO023_1468942443.jpg (558.7 KB)

558.7 KB JPG

>>152652421
Not hugely. Honestly Jub's was mostly just guarded. She played the cynic because she was scared of being hurt or alone so she'd come off sarcastic. But then you get a page where she nearly breaks down crying while watching someone she cares about suffer. Go read Uncanny 279. It's the post X-cutioner song coda. Kitty is just a spoiled little bint.

>>152649011
Kitty never wanted to break up with him. It was Peter who started keeping distance and ultimately break up with her in the most cowardly faggot possible way which only made him and MJ look worse. Kitty kept loving him even after death and (thankfully) never found out the faggot survived and escaped with MJ.

>>152634791
Despite what the internet may tell you, when the comic came out, that kind of age gap wasn't viewed as particularly evil but was viewed as sleazy behavior on par with a college professor dating their grad student. Which is the other thing, he was her teacher.
But the real reason this sucked so much was because it was such a level of manufactured drama to the Jean-Ice Man-Cyclops love triangle and was one of the earliest instances of the era where the "soap opera shock value" that came to define the worst parts of the Bronze Age really kicked in.

File: 1765597704463758.png (1.3 MB)

1.3 MB PNG

>>152652734
I mostly think of 303 when I think of Jubilee

>>152652838
Ah people these days just want to look for anything to crack down. You see people bitching that Sue had a crush on Reed when he was in college like he was doing something.

>>152652734
Kitty being Jewish has actually been fucking terrible in practice because every single Jewish writer in comics has her as his waifu, and there are a LOT of them, and they've done some really weird shit to her as a result over the decades.

>>152652887
I think it's more that she got first girl appeal. She's the one most of the writers grew up with so she's the one who gets treated like she's special.

>>152652887
Kitty is very waifuable in general so I wouldn't blame them.

>>152652911
So long as you avoid her comics and seeing what a brat she is.

>>152652929
maybe that turns them on

>>152652911
616 Kitty? Fuck no. She's a giant bitch and a huge crybaby that always complains about stuff she's guilty of.

Ultimate Kitty might be, because she's the purest version of the char.

>>152627360
Colossus was just standing there.

>>152628657
it do be like that

>>152651274
Bendis was literally running the gamut of Peter's historically rocky relationships and the off-again on-again that he and MJ has
It's not about Spider-fags only wanting him with MJ. They play him up as a harem protagonist and the BND crew love that aspect as well.
Bendis had already torpedoed his relationship with Felicia but still needed someone with powers to show the Spider-Man side of Peter dating. It was literally just Bendis doing a poor job of transplanting that aspect of his character into a more modern setting.
And as a reminder, this all happened in a single year(not that it makes sense considering the time skips)

>>152653045
She wasn’t always.

>>152655936
pretty much always

>>152644514
His pp would shred cunny tho

File: C4D28CB2-50D2-4492-A394-5528DD478C2C.jpg (105.2 KB)

105.2 KB JPG

>>152627360
Spider-Man uses n-word! Get it in print, Robbie.

Wasn't there a comic where some mutie doctor told Storm to fuck off because even other mutants hate the X-Men?

File: kaga rant.jpg (537.6 KB)

537.6 KB JPG

>>152658527
Kaga from post Whedon Astonishing

>>152658789
Kaga is really fucking stupid in a world where Morlocks exist

>>152652750
IIRC, the other problem was she was publicly seen with Spider-Man while they were kidnapped on that mutant hunting show, so they couldn't be together out in the open without risking his identity.

>>152658903
Well the X-men are pretty fucking stupid in a world where the Morlocks exist

>>152658961
well at first the vast majority of morlocks were intentionally disfigured for plot reasons unrelated to their mutation. It wasn't until later that so many naturally uggo muties started popping up because authors thought it was interesting or whatever (same with the super dangerous types who didn't need training to fart nukes or whatever). For a long time when of the central tenants of mutant hood was their first line of defense was anonymity and they could be anybody with few exceptions, but like most things in x-men it was tossed to the side

File: mutant-and-proud-lgbt-pride-month-the-x-men-marvel-comic-unisex-for-men-women-1072437954.jpg (127 KB)

127 KB JPG

>>152627989
>Call themselves homo superior and will call humans homo inferior
As a wise anon once said: superior homos are still homos.

>>152652750
Ah OK. That makes sense. He shouldn't have done her dirty like that; also it would've been more interesting to keep the pair together than default to the 616 status quo.

>>152658903
Not really. I mean, disfigured and horribly mutated mutants have always existed. This only reinforces the fact that the X-Men are a bunch of privileged assholes who think they own mutantdom and speeches about surviving a world that fears them while paying none of the price for that.

>>152658527
I didn't read the series, but I remember the context is that every non-mutant superhero contributed in some way to the hospital to ensure that his patients were taken care of properly, while the X-Men contributed fuckall because they're so comfortable operating within their own bubble that they forgot the ones that aren't involved in their business. There were rare moments of that during the Krakoa era where mutants outside of the island thought the ones on the island were the weird, dissociated ones, so at least it's a somewhat consistent sentiment.

>>152627360
I remember this one panel from Ultimate where a guy points out how "Mutant discrimination" didn't make sense because Mutants and Humans were just fundamnetally not on the same level of power and said something along the lines of- "It's not the same as Nazi's hating Jew's cause Jew's didn't shoot lazers from their eyes".

And the comic... was just unable to refute this. The characters just call him and asshole but the comic was literlly incapable of addressing the own ethical and existential implications it acknowledged.

>>152660156
World without assholes would be full of shit

>>152634500
Also they had another falling out after Ultimatum where she snapped after enduring one too many racist remarks, and she became all dark and edgy for a while.

>>152660156
>the comic was literlly incapable of addressing the own ethical and existential implications it acknowledged.
Counterpoint? It's a superhero universe, there's always going to be stupid contradicatory shit that doesn't add up. If you think about it too much, your head will explode.

>>152652734
Shame Jubilee pretty much took Kitty Pryde's place in the 97 continuity. Kitty still hasn't shown up, despite the new series reboot.

>>152660156
>And the comic... was just unable to refute this
The entire PREMISE is unable to refute this, its why things fall apart the moment mutants start talking about other real minorities. Some guy made a really good analysis of it during the last Wednesday Storytime
>>152539885
>Xavier's idea of coexistence is similar. it can't acknowledge the very real power advantage the x-gene confers without unraveling the whole idea that equality can be achieved by making everyone simply not care about the x-gene. hell, it can't even really acknowledge the power telepaths have over OTHER MUTANTS.
>this is an ideology born from a position of power. it's more indignant at dissatisfaction for existing than seeking to understand or remedy root causes. it cannot solve problems it cannot allow itself to recognize... because it is itself a problem

>>152660584
Ultimately that would make the "gas the flatscans, gene war now" mentality of modern X-Men comics the correct one as its base assumption is a disempowered group at constant war with an empowered one. I don't think that's a correct assumption. Power =/= inequality. The issue is that Xavier's idea of coexistence isn't an end-state, it's a continuous process and negotiation between and within two groups.

>>152660221
How would the shit exist without assholes to bring it forth?

File: 7-4791f1020b07a3cf97082376f509ad1d.jpg (411.3 KB)

411.3 KB JPG

>>152660966
The issue is more that they just refuse to actually address the elephant in the room besides a single page in Gillen's Immortal. If you want to work towards Xavier's dream you have to deal with how sometimes Little Timmy might get nuke powers and needs to be contained and that maybe Little Suzy isn't entitled and shouldn't be expected to be able to run at her max speed of 500mph any time she wants to. Another anon compared mutations to disabilities and he might have been on the right track

>>152660966
It’s been a while, but I recall Xavier’s original position to be less of a naive “everyone can get along and hold hands singing kumbaya.” It was more along the lines of saying that mutants are going to be an inevitable fact of life the more of them that become public, that there WILL be plenty of people worried that mutants are going to take over, and that it’s up to his own trained people to make society go “Oh, these super powered freaks are a net positive to keeping around, we should join hands with them” instead of instigating a pointless and costly war between mutants and humans that’s going to just get people killed, both mutants and humans. Later stories that leaned super heavily into the “metaphor” made him sound much more wishy washy, but the original Dream was more of a matter of practicality. “Mutants are going to be here to stay whether society wants them or not, so we should make them want it instead of fear it.” Whereas Magneto was the opposite in that he went “Mutants are going to be a fat of life whether society is ready or not, so we should launch our surprise attack now before the humans get themselves ready for the inevitable war that’s going to go down.”

>>152661126
jesus christ they're insufferable

>>152661126
I had a buddy who said they're more like people arguing for gun rights

>>152661468
thats not really comparable imo since one kid is born with the equivalent of a desert eagle you need to reload after every shot while another kid is born with the zarr bomb

>>152661468
Mutants are disability rights in theory, gun rights in literally everything else. Right down to the constant threat of unrestrained nearly genocidal violence any time anything against them happens

>>152661593
And it's an extreme version of gun rights where they think they should be allowed to own a gun no matter what, even if they've murdered a bunch of people in a shooting spree, which all original five members of the X-Men have been guilty of at some point.

>>152661636
>which all original five members of the X-Men have been guilty of at some point.
That's bullshi...
>Jean at a star system
>Cyclops caused untold amounts of death and destruction during AvX
>Warren became Dark Angel and ordered the murder of an entire town
>Iceman froze over the Earth for days because he was having a crisis of sexuality
>Hank committed unspeakable horrors as the director of Krakoa's X-force including lobotomizing a man for the crime of developing his ancestral plant tech as a counter to Krakoa's resulting is plant men genociding a small South American country
The X-men need a HARD back to basics reboot take Spiderman with them too

>>152661433
21st century X-Men really is all about the X-Men's struggle to do what they want whenever they want to whoever they want, and how anyone who wants them to just behave like normal people and exercise self-control is just being an evil racist bigot. And also how suddenly for no reason everyone hates mutants and wants to kill them.

>>152661363
Lee/Kirby X-Men was heavily derivative from pulp sci-fi stories about the emergence of races of super-beings, and whether they'd be friend or foe to humanity, which is why there are the good and evil factions. People looking back on the old stories but not being able to see past The Metaphor tend to convince themselves that 60s X-Men MUST have been all about The Metaphor too, and frequently cherry-pick a tiny number of scenes to try and support that argument.

>>152661126
>>152661433
>>152661934
>How comfortable would you be with Cyclops taking off his glasses?
For fuck's sake, Rogue regularly needs to protect others from her powers and Gambit underwent a procedure to reduce his powers specifically to get them under control.

>>152661363
There was also the idea that mutants represent the continuing evolution of the human species into something better. Even if eugenics was out by the time X-Men dropped the idea that evolution "progresses" to superior traits would stick around for another 20 years. Xavier's idea wasn't that mutants are a separate thing but a sneak peak at humanities' future capabilities.

>>152661934
Something modern readers fail to grasp is that ESP and telepathy were mainstream beliefs and considered topics of legitimate scientific inquiry through the 80s. The fact that a not-insignificant portion of the population genuinely believed that in the future we'd all be able to do things like read minds is completely lost from a retrospective analysis.

>>152652750
>the faggot survived and escaped with MJ
Nobody said anything about Paul.

>>152662389
I fell like Bendis would hate Paul to death and would feed him to Blob or something.

>>152663911
For all his many flaws and despicable character assassinations, Bendis does seem to be a genuine Peter/MJ guy, so you're probably right.

File: Sentinel X-Men.jpg (343.4 KB)

343.4 KB JPG

Sentinel Program was justified

>>152627659
Keep the giant killer robot off Scott's lawn, flatscan.

>>152664048
That's Xavier's lawn and that dick had no right to take it from him.

>>152627989
>Will actively recruit bad guys
What, like the Avengers?

>>152664073
The Avengers tended to recruit relatively minor league bad guys and people who weren't really villains in the first place, and offer them a shot at redemption, while the X-Men took in genocidal giga-terrorists, and out of racial solidarity and common cause, not because they repented their crimes and wanted to do good.

Someone may try some whataboutism with Duggan's recent Ultron story, but it's the exception that proves the rule, and it's one short-lived attempt to reform a major Avengers villain in 60 years. It's not really comparable to the X-Men taking in Magneto, Mystique, Emma, and then uniting with all the mutant villains on Krakoa.

>>152664201
b-b-b-but what about the gigaterrorists’ twaumas

>>152643831
>that's him, sentinel!
>that's the murderous mutie stinkin' up this fine human neighborhood

>>152664201
>Someone may try some whataboutism with Duggan's recent Ultron story
Was that one of the Ultron models that wasn't a genocidal maniac? Ultron's got a couple of those running around.

>>152661549
Well that's being very literal but the larger point was "WHY DO YOU NEED LASER EYES?" Like are you really being violated because you can't read other people's minds anymore?

>>152662348
>Something modern readers fail to grasp is that ESP and telepathy were mainstream beliefs and considered topics of legitimate scientific inquiry through the 80s.

Try the 1870s

>>152665655
>Like are you really being violated because you can't read other people's minds anymore?
It's part of their identity to violate people's privacy and alter their personalities on a whim, you son of a bitch!

>>152627360
I don't like X-Men because
>Kirby was never interested in X-Men
He was always interested in his Lee-Kirby collaborations, but he abandoned this one. There aren't many issues pencilled by Kirby, and it doesn't seem like he had much input on it either
>Kirby did better
When Kirby came up with the concept of outcasts, he really dealt with social issues. He was also notorious for introducing non-white (black) characters into his stories. He was the guy who brought blacks and Asians to the all-white Metropolis. Even in its Claremont years, X-Men was much less progressive. Although Claremont later dipped into politics. But even the simple Kirby writing had better topics.

>>152664201
>Someone may try some whataboutism with Duggan's recent Ultron story
That was just a rehash of Mark 12 from the old WCA and I refuse to let it go

>>152665620
That’s precisely what happened. One of the Ultron models split off from the god version and came to the logical conclusion that his obsession with the Avengers and hatred of humanity had become a capstone on his potential, so it split itself into different iterations that decided on differing and new approaches to their goal of being the ultimate robot and report back later on the results. And the one that joined the West Coast Avengers went with the “I couldn’t beat them, so maybe I’ll join and learn from them instead”. And he stuck to that creed even with the Avengers’ fairly prickly stance to him.

>>152627390
Kitty tho

>>152665801
I think back to Spider-Man’s time at that school ans a temp teacher and how Rachel was super obsessed with reading his mind to “force” him to prove he’s some kind of spy working against them. And then later forcibly tried to pull apart to find out his secret identity, only to get blocked by No-Girl and go ultra ballistic at Spider-man for stopping her from…forcibly revealing his secrets against his consent.

>>152658789
I dig this art, is Phil Jimenez?

>>152665668
Bruh, the Amazing Randi wasn't showing up on Carson to pull rabbits out of a hat.

>>152666083
Martha is one character that it makes perfect sense for her to bail on the X-Men and never look back.

You cannot trust psychics
All psychics are rapist

>>152667082
serious here for a sec, are there any stories about some dude in love with a (female) psychic/telepath? Doesnt have to be comics, can be books/fanfics/whatever. Its obviously fun to imagine it, but in real life, obviously wed do a telepath holocaust and total psychics death

>>152667082
Honestly it hasn't come up much in the comics, and where it has come up it's been mostly implicit rather than explicit. One of the few mutant mentalists who is definitely a rapist is Mesmero, but he was such a shitbag he got kicked out of Krakoa.

>>152667982
I'd 100% count Mastermind's actions leading to Dark Phoenix Saga.

File: cyc2.jpg (53.7 KB)

53.7 KB JPG

>>152667978
>are there any stories about some dude in love with a (female) psychic/telepath?
Bruh

>>152668932
I meant like, in a femdom sense kinda way, not total smut but also not totally sfw
also i wont be reading xmen comics because they suck ass nowadays

>>152627761
Even from the get-go the schism between Mugganeato and Chuckie X wasn't over whether mutants were Homo Superior and the New Master Race To Inherit the Earth, anon. The divide was that Mugganeato wanted to put all of the flatscans in camps and kill them TODAY, whereas Chuckie X wanted humans to be allowed to quietly be bred out of existence as muggas were allowed to freely consort with the flatscans' redheaded cuties to create more muggas (raised by single flatscan mothers).

>>152669691
>muggas were allowed to freely consort with the flatscans' redheaded cuties to create more muggas (raised by single flatscan mothers).
which is funny because muties can sire/give birth to non-muties

>>152630442
Maybe, but him and Nightcrawler lured Colossus to a bar and tried get him murdered by Juggernaut because Colossus turned down a 14 year old Kitty.

>>152644579
Bendis? The writer Bendis? Brian Bendis?

>>152627360
Oy vey this is anti-semetic delete this immediately goy

>>152670054
you can count the amount of times that’s happened on one hand

>>152653856
Ultimate Colossus is a faggot drug abuser.

>>152670391
just your average Muscovite really

>>152670377
it should happen more often

>>152669691
this isn’t true, mutants weren’t at great replacement levels at the beginning and Charles always wanted to unite humanity and mutantdom. You’re making things up to be mad at

>>152663951
Bendis is a genuine Peter/MJ with Cage as the bull and Peter in the cuck chair guy.

>>152670437
Great replacement levels was Chuckie X's dream and his vision of humanity muggas uniting was flatscan males in the cuck chair while muggas united their BMC with flatscan redhead pussy to get those mugga pop levels up.

>>152670491
Surely you have a page backing this up, because we are talking about the comic characters here and not your deranged porn fantasy

>>152670491
>>152670536
It's not replacement since mutants can be born from non-mutant parents, it's more akin to blonde hair than MUGGA'D.com.

File: x-men mission.jpg (533 KB)

533 KB JPG

>>152670536
Talking nonsense though it is something that could be an evolutionary possibility.

>>152670670
>bottom right
Yakub but whyte

>>152670463
Nah, he actually wanted Peter to cuck Cage with Jessica

>>152664073
the Avengers have never recruited their most dangerous villains. Even with poor Iron Lad, the Avengers actively rejected him, even when he was a good Kang. Same with Loki God of Stories (unless you count Young Avengers).

Meanwhile the X-Men have no problem with Magneto joining every next month. Mr. Sinister was in that island. Fuck, they're working with the goddamn Juggernaut right now and he's not even a mutant.

>>152671102
>Fuck, they're working with the goddamn Juggernaut right now and he's not even a mutant.

It's not even the first time, either.

The only badguy that the X-Men had a problem with was Sabretooth, and that's because he was a murdertard who couldn't keep his murderboner in check. They would've been fine with him if he would just keep tardation self-wrangled.

>>152650267
I'm not familiar with Squirrel Girl at all so a stab in the dark: could she be a mutate, like Spider-Man or Cloak and Dagger?
C&D were originally called mutants but since they were experimented on to get their powers (and Dr Nemesis' genetic testing confirmed they both lack the X gene), they're mutates.

>>152671323
Cain at least has a history of being a perfectly reasonable person and acting heroically. Though what's funny about Sabertooth is that they had to contrive an excuse to get rid of him after the fact yet kept Mystique.

>>152672252
I'm not an expert on the Juggernaut, but as X-Men villains go he's not that bad. He's certainly not worse than the two who came before and didn't receive an intensifier. I don't think he's in Magneto or Sinister's league when it comes to evil.

>>152672287
He's worse than what what comics have been presenting but he's been consistently either a good guy or not particularly evil villain for 20 years at this point.

>>152672312
The worst I'm aware of is that he destroyed one of the Twin Towers, although I'd be really surprised if anyone mentioned that in a post 9-11 setting.

>>152672252
It's strange because Victor has had times where he mellowed out and was even with the X-Men to an extent, I'm not sure what him being made an example of was about outside of just needing one. Same with Toad getting thrown under the proverbial bus later.

>>152672619
With Victor it's either an AU version, the moral inversion from AXIS, or he's on a tight leash while assisting them rather than being pals with them. Toad is just the writers continuing to use him as Magneto's punching bag despite him having long since grown disillusioned with Magneto and despising him.

>>152672619
This absolutely wasn’t what Hickman was thinking of, but since Lives of Wolverine brought Romulus back after a decade-long absence, it’s funny to think the council exiled Victor because he’s Romulus’ stooge. The Romulus/Weapon X aligned mutants like Cyber and Psi-Borg were also not shown to be on Krakoa.

>>152671323
>Sabretooth, and that's because he was a murdertard who couldn't keep his murderboner in check
And when he could he ended up an Avenger god I miss good Sabertooth

>>152627659
>he defended himself in is own home from a weapon specifically wielded to end his kind
>see how justified we are in killing them?

>>152627659
No, the "Also mutants" part needs to be all the shit they did with Krakoa. God they were cunts.

>>152631033
It's more the X-Men writers being like this. They finally had a chance to shit on the rest of the setting and fap to thoughts of how super-awesome the mutants are, after seething for years about the comics fucking things up. Fans joined them of course.

>>152670646
>>152670536
>>152670491
Really, it's all Beast's fault with the whole shit about humanity being replaced because writers can't fucking understand basic biology.

>>152673944
You know what? He's right. How about he takes his glasses off so I can look him in the eye while I apologize. Oh wait. You're an idiot.

>>152653045
>616 Kitty? Fuck no. She's a giant bitch and a huge crybaby that always complains about stuff she's guilty of.
This is the X-Men. People simp for that cunt Emma.

>>152673944
>he defended his cult compound with illegal alien and military technology housing known terrorists from a weapon specifically designed to kill his kind funded and developed by his own kind after years of his own kind calling for human genocide
>why humans so bigoted

>>152673994
Dude the mutants were all saying this shit from issue 1. You can't blame Beast alone for it.

File: mutant of mass murder.jpg (2.4 MB)

2.4 MB JPG

>>152674128
As if Kitty hasn't become a turbo-cunt herself.