The same guy making the thread all the time is starting to suck.

File: 1779798768277667.jpg (40.2 KB)

>>65184994
> t.

/gq/ Infographic Emporium:
https://imgur.com/a/gq-infographic-emporium-1-00-1lZ5xw6
Legacy Infographic Reserve: https://imgur.com/a/k-infographic-reserve-AIKzwWF

>Last time on /gq/, Rook just made some shit up. I made a bunch of infographics, and Botach is simultaneously cringe and based but in the cool crack addict florida uncle kinda way.

>QUICK ARMOR GUIDE 2.166
CODE: * = active NIJ-cert, ^ = NEEDS SOFT ARMOR, DND = do not drop, ** = military.
>Special Rifle Threat (M855A1, no M80 <44mm BFD):
Budget: Hesco T212 or L211
Mid-Range: Hesco M210
High-End: Hesco U210 / U211, LSAPI**, or Tencate CR-6450SA.
>CONUS Minimum (M80, M855, M193):
Budget: Expired Hesco 3611C, surp SAPI**^, or Gilliam 6001
Mid-Range: Hesco 3612* or 3810*
High-End: Hesco 3811* or 3811LV^DND
Elite: Used Cercom CER-EMH**^
>CONUS Medium (M80 + M855A1 or BZ API):
Budget: Used Protech 2120-5
Mid-Range: Hesco 3411* or LTC 19513
High-End: LTC 28780**
Elite: VelSys PBZSA** or LTC 28791** or Hesco SC3812
Elite-Plus: Used Ceradyne MH3 CQB**^DND (10x M995)
>CONUS Optimal (M855A1 + M80A1):
Budget: Highcom 3S9 (SAPI-cut)
Mid-Range: Used LTC 28550** / 28590** or Highcom 3S9M* (SAPI-cut!)
High-End: Used LTC 28595**
Elite: Used LTC 28570** or VelSys TSA**
Elite-Plus: Tyr XHA4/S6/T(DND) or GEN 6 LTC TSA**
>Level IV / CONUS High (.30-06 M2AP):
/pfg/: Used Protech 2014G or Gilliam 1023
Budget: Hesco 4403* (bare minimum)
Mid-Range: Hesco 4601* (+ Level III) or surp ESAPI**^ (REV. G-J preferable, adds M995 / 3x M2AP vs 1x)
High-End: Hesco 4800(DND), 4800LV^DND, or Protech 9812-R1(DND)
Elite: Tencate CXP-800 SA or Ceradyne SOF ESAPI MK.II**^DND or Adept Emperor
Elite-Plus: Ceradyne SAEC**DND(??)
>Level IV+ / CONUS Extreme (Various)
Budget: Protech 2230 (fast M2AP, $300/set used)
Budget-Tungsten: Gilliam 8002 (.300 Winmag Swiss P AP)
Mid-Range: Adept Colossus (7.62x51 Swiss P) or REV. C XSAPI**^ (M993)
High-End: Rev. D XSAPI**^ (M993+)
Elite: ECSAPI** (M993)
Elite-Plus: Ceradyne 96034** (7.62x51 Swiss P)

>>65185021
>avatar posting
Fuck off.

>>65184968
I think it's more they're doing 9x12 instead of 9.5x12.5 like they should and aren't including drop protection. Correct sizing and the numbers check out mostly, nothing crazy like the memoryholed 2.9lb RF2 from Dayton, which is now 3.5lb, and still underperforms. Nonetheless, nominal sizing is still a serious problem.
The Mako just sounds like they ran a bunch of plates until they got one which did the job, hence why they're so WELL AKTSHUALLY NO on the M993 rating.
>how many plates do they actually sell?
On paper I'm sure plenty. Honestly, the company seems like a front.

File: Botach Guide 1.00.png (1.8 MB)

So why was this shit popular five years ago?

>>65184974
I thought that was a Maple Leaf Flag and I stumbled into /cfg/ then I realized its just fellatio

File: aaaaaah.gif (2.9 MB)

>>65185505

>>65185021
>salty ass motherfucker who has plates to shill and can't do it when ARMOR GANG posts 100 times a thread because they'll btfo his shit

File: Screenshot 2026-05-26 at 5.31.39 PM.png (3.6 MB)

Looking for a low profile, light weight chest rig. Narrowed it to the Unobtainum LV and the Spiritus Bank Robber. Any options I'm missing?

>>65185898
Gray man? More like gay man.

File: Sneed.jpg (3.3 MB)

>>65185898
Unity clutch
Arktis LV rig
HPG Chest/Fannypack with inserts
Pile of crye magclips/similar pants based system

Fannypack basically invisible tbqh

>>65185905
>>65185905
Not what was intended. I just want something lightweight for summer night shoots where I don't need more than 2 - 3 magazines.
>>65185918
Not what I had intended but I haven't seen a lot of these products before, thanks.

File: RookArmor-BrandShoot-2.jpg (512.4 KB)

>>65185661
> t. not using the best armor.
(Fug. My nigga, wtf am I supposed to do with these ROOK paperweights? I need to offload them right fucking now. Tell me how I ought to handle this.)

File: guaranteed.png (8.3 KB)

>>65185956
Exploit their infinite plate glitch. Get shot in the line of duty, and they will replace your plate 100% guaranteed. Just hire yourself as a security guard at the abandoned Dunkin off Kensington, then hire a philly jawn to shoot your Bass Reeves with a .22lr every two weeks, then sell the damaged plates to scrubs on ebay as for parts / not working condition.

Once this is complete, purchase VelSys PBZSA, VelSys TSA, or Tencate CXP-800 SA depending on your needs. If you're feeling fruity, SOF ESAPI MK. IIs or Gilliam 9969s. There is no reason to entertain the Adept Archon over the 9969, presuming the 9969 does its job, unless you kidnapped Buffman's kid or something and he's rolling on your ass at 0200 with a full loadout of Nammo AP4.

>>65186046
> then sell the damaged plates to scrubs on ebay as for parts / not working condition.
Expected retail value: $5. Man, that don't even cover eBay/shipping fees, let alone the sticker price of a Tencate CXP-800 SA.

File: ROOK ARMOR GUIDE.png (2.0 MB)

and obligatory Rook Armor infographic post. This is arguably in the top five shadiest American or "American" armor companies. It'd probably go like this:
1. AR500 Armor
2. Second Chance (when Richard Davis did the Zylon fuckery)
3. Rook
4. RMA
5. Pinnacle Armor (ooooh I'm saying RMA is shadier than the old dragonskin guys, spicy!)

File: redacted emperor report.png (79.7 KB)

>>65186049
That's why you need to dress that shit up bro.
>DEVGRU / 24TH STS BLACK OPS PLATE
>COMPLIES WITH NIJ 0101.06
>LEVEL III+++++++++
>"SURPLUS"
And then just exploit the infinite plate glitch. It's infinitely farmable, so if you hire fifty philly jawns that's 25 plates shot and replaced every two weeks, comes out to five bucks a plate, that's $250 a month. In about 14 months you'll be able to afford a pair of CXP-800 SAs or ADEPT EMPEROR 4.55LB LEVEL IVs.

>>65185938
https://www.wtfidea.com/turnkey-rig-01-m4-t15-556-mags-chestrig/
https://www.optactical.com/product/blue-force-gear-ten-speed-m4-chest-rig-with-molle/

>>65185938
>I just want something lightweight for summer night shoots where I don't need more than 2 - 3 magazines.
Your back pocket?
But actual usecase for magclips

File: IMG_0203.jpg (1.2 MB)

Finally got my 3811s. Shooter/SAPI combo. 7.2 lbs lighter than my lvl iv set. The shooter is an inch shorter than the SAPI so I’m probably going to stuff the bottom of my carrier with foam or a pool noodle.

>>65186111
Oh christ, Hesco's playing dirty on sizing with these too? Should only be half an inch. (10x12 vs 9.5x12.5). Would explain why they're so much lighter than 3810s, lol.
Nice plates though.

File: Tactical Hood.png (2.0 MB)

>>65186111
Is it ackshually 11" from top to bottom? That's some bullshit.

>>65186221
If it's an inch shorter than SAPI it's a 10x11.5", which is indeed bullshit but not as bad as RMA / LAPG / TacScorp with the 9.5x11.5 nominal + cheater bottom corners or Highcom with the cheaters + 9x11 "not-10x12."
Nominal sizing is the new cheat ring. Everybody's doing it for shooter cut plates except BASED Gilliam. New trick, same consequence. Reduced coverage.

File: 0eb9c5d9a2cc0ec58a3a1d9153d7b375831cb01a.jpg (139.9 KB)

Are Mechanix and Sports gloves the go to? what kind of gloves, if any would you use?

>>65186235
They are for me, I have 3 pairs of mechanix. They're just gloves, so treat them as such. They will rip, they will tear, the stitching will burst. If you're worried about longevity, you can always get some hide gloves. But they're not great to shoot with, and your hands will get sweaty. If you just want some gloves, just get some mechanix, but know that you will have to replace them.

>>65186235
they're fine
if you just do flat range larping you probably don't even need gloves unless you have soft fairy hands

I like their rubber padded ones, really helps to stop your fingers from getting crushed and fucked up, but I actually dig trenches and cut down trees instead of just walking around the woods in full kit like a fat fuck retard so your use case may vary

>>65186111
>>65186221
New rule of thumb. Since everyone is playing fuckfuck games with shooters cut sizing, buy SAPI M.

>>65186430
already doing that

File: highcom lol.png (306.3 KB)

>>65186433
Solid. From what I can tell, the trick seems to be that since SAPI sizing is actually defined and regulated, there's specific trade usage dictating a SAPI M for example must be exactly 9.5x12.5 and also have the exact same top corner angles every time. There is no agreed trade usage for 10x12 shooters or 8x10, so everybody just makes it the fuck up. Thus, SAPI sizing forces companies to be accurate.
>>65186111
3811 anon, I have concerns if your shooters cut is actually an inch shorter than SAPI M. Again, that means your plate is a 10x11.5. Hesco's manufacturing tolerance per HCC Tactical is as follows:
>Thickness dimensions are ± 1/8 in (± 3 mm). Width and length dimensions are +0.00 to -0.25 in (+0.00 to -6 mm). All weights are ± 5%.
So if you buy a 10x12 the minimum size is 9.75x11.75. That's new but I guess Hesco is getting in on the nominal sizing bullshittery too. If you've really got a 10x11.5 your plate is out of spec, plain and simple. Also check thickness and weight if you can, just want to rule out you didn't get boned with a factory second not-10x12.

File: shooter.png (1.7 MB)

>>65186126
>>65186221
>>65186430
>>65186514
Apologies for the cliffhanger, I was out of the house all day after I posted. The plates are both size L. Shooter is 11.75", SAPI is 12.75".

File: sapi.png (1.7 MB)

>>65186659
L shooter weighs 3 lb 8.3 oz
L SAPI weighs 4 lb 1.7 oz

>>65186659
>both size L
SAPI L, not SAPI M? In that case your SAPI is half an inch shorter than it should be (12.75 vs 13.25). If you mean SAPI M then 0.25 over isn't weird but it's still out of the range HCC has for Hesco plates.
The shooters is fine then, since that's within range as given by HCC.

>>65186666
So the shooter is 3.52lb as a 10x11.75, but was advertised by Hesco as 3.4lb for 10x12. That's actually a pretty major discrepancy because it comes out to 0.2lb if you equalize sizing.
For comparison, the difference between the Hesco 4600 which was permanently removed from the NIJ CPL for unresolved safety concerns and the fixed 4601 is 0.4lb. All of that was added safety margin material.
This is anecdotal, but it sounds like Hesco had to make the plate heavier. You aren't supposed to change a plate after getting it NIJ certified, which the 3811 is, so I'm miffed on whether this would trigger a FIT issue.
Anyways, the plates are fine despite the coverage issues, I'm just autistically miffed about the areal density difference.

>>65186668
They are both size L.
>In that case your SAPI is half an inch shorter than it should be (12.75 vs 13.25).
Well shit, I think you're right. Looks like the SAPI may be out of spec.

>>65186694
Thanks for double checking. A SAPI L should be 10.25x13.25 and per Hesco is 4.1lb. Your plate is 10.25x12.75 and 4.1lb. If corrected to the advertised size it is 4.26lb. That's within 5% weight (3.9%) so not out of spec there, but the sizing is definitely too small.
The plates are most likely fine in terms of performance, you're just down on coverage somewhat.

>>65186723
>you're just down on coverage somewhat.
Irritating because I'm inbetween M/L, so coverage from a lightweight plate was the whole reason I bumped up to L.
You guys weren't kidding when you talk about armor manufacturers being shady.

File: EupTyLgVkAAViYS.jpg (540.9 KB)

>>65184974
thoughts on the MSV?

>>65186934
Looks like something a fat person would wear.

File: IMG_4108.jpg (218.8 KB)

Is chase tactical a chinkshit brand

Are RMA 1155 and 1165 still bad, should I spring for a MIRA plate instead

Is it worth looking for some sort of insulating insert for a chest rig/battle belt canteen pouch or an insulated canteen? I have a milsurp ALICE insulated canteen pouch, but it doesn't always fit what I'm going for.

>>65186741
Nominally sizing a SAPI plate is a new problem. Since SAPI L is industry standardized I would strongly recommend reaching out to Verrett's to try and get an exchange going. You ordered a SAPI L, you got what's basically some kind of SAPI medium-wide labeled as SAPI L.
And yeah, the armor industry is shady as hell.
>>65187240
No, they're Highcom's largest distributor and vendor.
>>65187319
They're still bad, yes. The 10x12s are BADLY undersized. The 1155 is still a dated alumina fiberglass design and the 1165 is strict no drop protection like the old Highcom 4SAS4. You don't get an Alumina plate that light without tricks.
>MIRA
Rebranded Hesco or mystery meat. Which model are you looking at? The 4403 is reliable but falls apart the moment you take it above Level IV spec. No headroom whatsoever. A mere 20-30ft/s above Level IV requirements will result in a passthrough.
Save for the Hesco 4601, that's very reliable and much lighter, just a thick boi at 1.18" or so. Alternatively, if you can't save, track down used Protech 2230s. Lighter than the 4403 (7.5lb vs 7.7lb) and far stronger, but 1.2" thick. Rated to stop M2AP over 3,510ft/s versus max NIJ IV spec of 2,910ft/s. I got a pair of 2230s for under $350 since they were expired, policesurp.

>>65187324
https://www.ebay.com/itm/157320567049
Something like this?
Otherwise cut up some isomat

>>65187352
It's just called the "Mira Level IV Plate" but 403 is the closest to a model number I could find. Rebranded Hesco?
I heard the Gen 2 1165s were better even if they have no drop protection

>>65186235
i've been using Mechanix M-PACT 0.5mm covert gloves; they have great dexterity and decent longevity for larping, they are my favorite. i've tried outdoor research iron sight gloves, Mechanix M-PACT 3, and regular Mechanix M-PACT but i always come back to Mechanix M-PACT 0.5mm covert.

Upgrading pc's cb with a tegris cb. Putting on my flower apc. Want tubes in the front, and velcro panels in back to attach it easily to carrier. Only one I've come across this morning in my briefs search has been from AceTac. Anyone know if their stuff is good quality or not? Do you know of any other brands that are more reputable that offer the same set up i want?Thanks in advance.

File: SMG mags.jpg (1.5 MB)

>>65187465
>Go to pivot tube
>Velcro comes undone
Bravo Nolan

Tubes are dumb btw.

>>65187470
Never had that happen and tubes are nice for easy on/off.

>>65184974
Also, fu you ban happy retarded mods.

>>65187384
Yeah, that's the 4403, just looked and the weight / thickness are a match. Overpriced, too. They should be $200-220 a plate, not $280.
>I heard the Gen 2 1165s were better even if they have no drop protection
The 4403 is a competitor to the RMA 1155 since they're both fiberglass-backed IVs. The 1165 is technically a competitor to the Hesco 4K10, which cannot be purchased outside of Mexico beyond rare surplus or overrun deals.
RMA's reputation is ass outside of astroturfed reddit because they play tricks on every single plate they have. The 1165's shooters cut is 9.5x11.5 nominal, with variance and bottom corner cuts, so you're down big time on coverage. Also, the lack of drop protection is severe. It can be damaged in the mail if improperly packaged. RMA literally told Buffman to not subject it to ANY drop protection.

>>65187384
Also, just as an added point, the 1165 GEN2 is only 0.7" thick. That is DAMN thin for a standalone Level IV plate. A clear tell there's both little safety margin and no drop protection. Additionally, it's only 5.3lb for a 9.5x11.5 but 6.1lb for SAPI M. There should never be more than a 0.2-0.3lb difference between the two. If there is a larger difference, then shit's really nominal and the shooters cut is gonna be tiny.
Sometimes it's better to go with a heavier, more reliable solution than the lightest available. Hesco 4601s or Militech RF3 Black Labels are probably the play here. If you're brave, Gilliam 9969s. If you can source them, REV. G and later ESAPIs with soft armor are very stout and similar in weight to the SAPI M 1165 and 4601.

File: IMG_4110.jpg (232.2 KB)

Ok so as someone said chase tactical is legit, is this a good option then? I was looking at used ones prior but if I can get it new especially with my federal discount then isn’t this probably my best bet? Gotta drill for a shroud but I can always pay someone more qualified to do that I suppose

>>65187750
There's no free lunch with armor. If it's on that deep of a sale then there's probably a reason.

>>65187761
It’s just the black ones, the other colors are all 665

>>65187770
Considering it's Chase, the architects of the whole 4SAS4 debacle from a year and a half back, that should give some pause. Black ones are one third the price all of a sudden? Nobody's buying?
I'd just get a used ACH. "IIIA" does not exist for helmets and stuff like BFD measuring methods are all over the place.

Well, this throws a wrench in the VelSys PBZSA versus Hesco SC3812 versus Protech DT306C debate if Hesco is playing dirty with sizing now.

>>65187775
Not familiar enough with /k/ lore to know what that is but if I should be wary I appreciate the heads up. I've just heard these are all Highcom helmets which I've heard are quite good, as as someone said previously they're Highcom's largest dealer. Let's say I could get the price down to 150 with discounts - would it not be worth it then? Or is the product actual dogshit disguised as armor?

File: 6ds5f46sdf4s68f465fe84s6f5.jpg (2.5 MB)

>>65185898
I've got that Unobtainium rig in SMG flavor. Decent piece of kit. I need to order more stuff from him.

>>65188108
Long story short, mid 2022-2023 Highcom won some major State Department contracts to supply plates to Ukraine. Highcom had a load of overrun strike faces afterwards. These sat on a shelf until about October 2024 when Highcom took them and added very cheap, very crap fiberglass backers and called them the 4SAS4 - pretendjng it's the same plate as the real 0101.04 certified (formerly) 4SAS4 from 2008. It's not.
Chase, as Highcom's master vendor, handled major distribution to the small guys like Titan, TacticalShit, Tactical Edge, etc, and also sold these plates themselves. Apex sold them too. These plates were advertised by Highcom to 0101.06, bombed a simulated 0101.06 test by Buffman, Chase threatened legal action and their CS accused Buff of rigging the test on behalf of "other companies." and there was a huge debate spanning four threads on /k/.
Everyone here got chargebacks because the plates Chase sold had workmanship defects, bad labels, failed tap/torque, etc. Now the 4SAS4 is mostly gone.

>okay so are the helmets good?
Maybe. Highcom recently got caught playing games with the rating on the flagship RCH helmet. It's really just a super overpriced ECH. It is not this level III+ super helmet they advertised it as. If that's the game they play with their best helmet, how do you think they are with the random 66% super discount model?

Highcom does shady shit, so does Chase, end of story. Milsurp helms are held to tight contract standards. These aren't.

>>65188108
>Let's say I could get the price down to 150 with discounts - would it not be worth it then? Or is the product actual dogshit disguised as armor?
Forgot to address this point. 150 is still above police surp helmets on botach surplus, ebay, and other sites. I got a Ceradyne BA3A for well under $100 and it's comparable to that Highcom, and, made by a much more reputable company whose only scandal was a delam problem mostly confined to two USSOCOM plates.
Protech, United Shield, and Busch helmets are also worth consideration. Expiration dates are just the warranty provided they weren't abused or stored improperly for long periods of time.

Fundamentally the issue is how risk-averse you are. If you need dead nuts, milsurp helmet. On the other end of the spectrum, cheap ass chinesium. Policesurp and new-but-sketchy are in the middle.

File: IWBSTANAG.jpg (858.2 KB)

>>65185918
>crye magclip
I love larping just as much as the next guy but I cannot fathom a mall ninja tier scenario you would need IWB stanags.

>>65188278
Gonna save this post so I know what to look out for, thank you anon
>>65188304
Also gonna check out botach surplus, really good call, these are good prices. Ebay has good prices but finding an XL for my fatass head is hard sometimes. Had one I was about to buy (and in coyote no less) a week or so ago for $250 but I slept on it and missed it. Might wait on botach in case something like that pops up again...

>>65188323
Hudson gunner

>>65188323
Glad to help. End of the day, the entire armor industry is shady as hell. There are just different grades of shady. Fundamental reason is that most armor never gets tested, because the only way to test it is to shoot and destroy it. Ergo, a lot of companies can sling garbage, and have done so, for years without getting caught.
Classic example is Dragonskin. Has been around since 1998, took until 2006 for the problems to come out. Another one is Zylon. Debuted for armor in the 1990s but took until 2003 for a fatality to happen.
>Botach
Their own armor is trash but their surplus site is hilariously cracked and I love it. >Want expired, probably recalled Hesco 4400s? $100/set.
>Want a 27 year old boron carbide Protech 4C-9812 for fifty bucks? Sold!
>Want a 50lb mega battering ram for breaching crack castles in the sub-ghetto deep inside the regular ghetto? Forty bucks for shipping please.
>Want a taser riot shield only sold to law enforcement? Two hundred!
>>65188377
Seconded. Hudsongunner has great deals and is the source for cheap Protech plates like the 2014Gs and 2120-5s.

File: paraclete.png (349.5 KB)

>>65188441
A lot of the stuff on botach doesn't have sizes listed, this has been on catalyst surplus for a bit, I guess I can just buy a helmet cover and rails any time?

https://www.catalystsurplus.com/product-page/paraclete-pth-iiia-ach

At any rate I'm at 60-61cm so I assume I should get an XL in any brand. Not sure about the rachet sizing on protech helmets that says it can fit S-XL, seems sketchy

File: AK Spear.jpg (3.1 MB)

>>65188312
>I cannot fathom
Thats why noone will remember your name
[spoiler]Flip it the other way
OWB stanags for casual fucking around on the range as anon requested[/spoiler].

>>65187033
its what the army used to replace the IOTV. I don't understand why they don't use the CPC since the MSV looks like its terrible

>>65188468
what pouch

File: paraclete aka point blank aka the other ten cop shop brands mich sheet.png (963.0 KB)

>>65188462
>A lot of the stuff on botach doesn't have sizes listed
They just list shit man. Whatever's in the PD dumpster.
>this has been on catalyst surplus for a bit, I guess I can just buy a helmet cover and rails any time?
Catalyst is solid except they exaggerate armor ratings on plates like those kinda shitty Protech X-CAL LPs. That's not relevant here, just a side note. Paraclete is very good and has a good rep.
>At any rate I'm at 60-61cm so I assume I should get an XL in any brand.
Always check sizing. This goes double if you ever join chinamaxx gang because their shit is either tiny or they assume Americans are all seven feet tall and everything is huge. Going off pic rel you can do either L or XL. If you're in-between helmet sizes, always size up.
>Not sure about the rachet sizing on protech helmets that says it can fit S-XL, seems sketchy
That's not too uncommon. My BA3A is a one-size-fits-most, you just arrange padding and adjust straps.

>>65188491
KDH has a lot of pull and was a prior manufacturer for the IOTV.

>>65188505
I imagine its better than the IOTV but it feels like the military in general is always 10-15 years behind everyone when adopting something for mass issue and always pick a not so great option

File: rachel.png (292.6 KB)

>>65188323
Also if you want the full Highcom 4SAS4 / Chase Tactical / Tactical Shit aka RACHEL being a shit saga, here are the four legendary Highcom Threads.

THREAD 1:
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/62910354/
THREAD 2:
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/62950094/
THREAD 3:
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/62982073
THREAD 4:
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/63009662

File: velsys 2.png (2.3 MB)

>>65188514
It's a critical component of the VTP program and the whole shebang is making stuff lighter. The plates are lighter, vest is lighter, soft armor is lighter.
>but it feels like the military in general is always 10-15 years behind everyone when adopting something for mass issue
ESAPIs are phenomenal plates for mass issue. I don't know any other country where the current standard issue plate is B4C-SiC hybrid backed by PE and there's like a million of the things in reserve. VTP is now transitioning to a mix of standalone GEN-I LSAPI, GEN-IV ESAPI, and GEN-IV XSAPI which are all excellent plates except for the maximum BFD being 62mm, which is more than double the BFD limit of all European standards and nearly four times that of the Russian standard.
>I imagine its better than the IOTV
Situational but it's probably a better generalist.

>and now the future!
Granted the MSV seems pretty meh, and if we're talking about "pull" then Velocity Systems will be pitching their Wraith carrier with special 20% larger fucknuts plates (pic rel) to USSOCOM pretty hard. Only thing holding them back is that it needs special plates and the only one they've got so far from Tencate is a mediocre 7.62x39mm PS stopper.

>>65188499
Yeah I'm not gonna trust what a website says about armor, just the brand, and I know paraclete is solid. Prices on places like botach and hudson gunner are super fucking good but how am I supposed to know what size is listed? There are helmets I'd buy right now if I knew they were XL for example

File: cape effect.png (755.3 KB)

Side bar, pic rel is a rizzed up comparison of a Russian GOST-BR5 plate versus a REV. A ESAPI against basic 7.62x54R.
The Russian plate has to abide by a 17mm BFD standard while the early ESAPI has to abide by a maximum 44-49mm, close to NIJ. To do this, the GOST plate gets a "CAP" trauma pad (what temu leon kennedy is holding), which is extremely effective and you can buy them on aliexpress for like twenty bucks in exchange for making yourself the Michelin man.
Otherwise both plates had soft armor as required, and yes, if you run the ESAPI with a CAP it would likely have put on an equally good show. Just saying.

File: ap101.png (483.5 KB)

>>65188545
You can always email them - [email protected]

>>65188545
and hudsongunner's email is [email protected] or you can reach him on tacswap

>>65188556
>>65188563
Good call again, thanks dude

>>65188592
No problem. Always check Botach and Hudson every two weeks or so for deals. I missed a phenomenal deal on a portable collapsing Protech tactical ladder on Botach a few weeks ago. Was like $300 but it's no shit worth 6-8 grand and normally credential-blocked.
Also don't knock ebay. I missed a deal on two Hesco 4800LVs (ICW IIIA version) for about $350. Gunbroker is also good.

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>>65188547
>file.nam
Bespoke seamstress identified...

File: BallSadFace.jpg (35.7 KB)

>>65188515
This is brutal. Highcom's stock price never recovered from this.

>>65188682
Get your ass on aliexpress and ask em for a custom man, or taobao if you're ELITE

File: 1763043272974066.gif (540.8 KB)

>>65188556
Show me the link to these loads.

>>65188719
Yeah, but what if I can fuck my seamstress and still get her to stitch for me? Sometimes an irl 3d grrl is better. Just sayin', I don't have the Taobao code for that.

>>65188722
Yes captain!
https://vbrbelgium.be/44-magnum-controlled-fragmentation

>>65188718
An armor company ass beating that bad only happens once every five years. It does happen every five years or so, regularly.
>>65188733
Then get the aliexpress secret links to make your dream a reality!

Hm, from the VBR website:
>"Based on the FBI rapports form shootings. 70% of all shooting victims are first hit trough the hand or through the arm because the arms are almost always in front of the target in a real shootout."
That really makes a compelling case for forearm armor. It's easy to ghetto rig 6x8 soft or hard like that, Jinwudun even sells forearm IIIA wholesale, but weight's an issue here if you want to roll rifle protection.

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>>65188767
>get the aliexpress secret links

File: fargo.png (27.0 KB)

>>65188830
>because the arms are almost always in front of the target

>>65188853
You have to build relationships with Aliexpress sellers in the right fields. Because the Chinese will sell anything for the right price, they have extensive back catalogs for trusted individuals.
You may have to agree to buy on a more neutral platform like MIC or Global Sources instead of Aliex depending on what you're looking at.
Example being signal jammers. You can't buy them straight on Aliex because they're illegal, but ALLEGEDLY with the right secret links SOME PEOPLE MAY HAVE, but you can buy them at your peril anyways on MIC.

I think a guy bought fent a while ago on Aliexpress via a secret link but it got caught on import.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/358483689427?_skw=surplus+ballistic+helmet

if i were to get this where could i send it to be properly drilled for a nvg shroud?

>>65188859
It doesn't have to be a wound!
https://world.taobao.com/item/WVY5dG1VUGdFMVFQdkFDWGJUT2Y0UT09.htm

>>65188873
>LEVEL NIJ-IIIA
>read as LEVEL NINJA
I like it better my way.

File: chinahammer the alihorus heresy.png (871.8 KB)

>>65188878
Agreed. It is clear that Anon was right and Taobao saves money. We're talking $160/set for those Jinwudun NINJA BRACERS versus $179/set direct from JWD. Taobao... is the final frontier of Chinamaxxing...

>"I never wanted this, I never wanted to sell SiC-TiB2 to American civilians and make them able to stop black tips on the cheap with based Gilliam 9969s and Adept Colossi."

>"Together we banished the ignorance of AR500 steel, but you banned me from the NIJ CPL, you banned us all."

>"You stole contract overruns from the Ukrainians and lied to your youtubers."

>"Poorfags have only one chance to prosper, if you will not sell them affordable plates... then I will!"

>"So let it be TAOBAO, from the skies of the Taiwanese Auction House to the Global Sources rimmed LiTai Light Tough Level IV, aka the Hesco 4800 but half the price!"

>"Let the polyethylene boil, let the RMA 1165s fall!"

>"Though it takes the last ping ping of my sweatshop, I will see the poorfags armored once more, and if I can not save it from your failure, NIJ, then let the poorfags buy BOTACH!"

>>65188636
>tactical ladder
>credential-blocked
what

>>65188926
You just can't have anyone running around with tactical ladders!
https://youtu.be/gQVkHNZl7Cs?si=15yis-alP543pi-F

File: INDEED.gif (2.1 MB)

>neetmaster when he wakes up at two in the morning to read the latest chinese armor industry wank and sees the Hesco 3811 is FUCKED.
>>65188926
You need to be a COP to buy these ladders!
https://www.alternateforce.net/protech-tactical-portal-ladder.html

File: the cop.png (65.0 KB)

>mfw I go to a meetup in the middle of a city for some reason and I see someone has a CREDENTIAL-BLOCKED ladder

File: 71PikujBA0L._AC_UY1000_.jpg (149.8 KB)

>tfw you're so gangsta you gotta CRED BLOCKED LADA, NINJA BRACERS and your wallet says BAD MUTHA FUCKA!

File: MIKE_CLOAK.png (164.6 KB)

>>65189000
>CHECK EM
>tfw you got expired cred blocked Protech plates and you're finna cop some Protech DT306Cs, a k a the PBZSA killer, but you can't afford it so you need to do some side missions.
https://www.copquest.com/safariland-hardwire-8000-type-iii-stand-alone_89-2540.htm

Anyways, now that the SC3812 is both CRED BLOCKED and probably nominally sized, the Protech DT306C is hereby the only remaining plate that can CHALLENGE the VelSys PBZSA.

>>65189012
>Anyways
Anyway.

>>65189503
Damn.

File: Surefire bros.jpg (209.4 KB)

>>65188830
People generally shoot at the threat, untrained people will shoot you in the firearm because they see that as the threat. Anytime you do sims you will see a shitload of rifle hits that would be catastrophic to the rifle's functionality. This all feeds back into why you shouldnt fuck with malfunctions and should just rip out a pistol if rifle goes click.
>>65188497
Eagle industries 3x2 m4 mag pouch

File: 1767732077736763.webm (4.0 MB)

>>65189671
I helped somebody!

>>65189790
>Anytime you do sims you will see a shitload of rifle hits
>while larping and mag dumping each other you hit lots of shit you're not trying to fit because you're poorly trained and whoever is running your sim is letting you run around like retards
DARC sounds like some amateur hour shit

File: DTG.jpg (3.6 MB)

>>65189921
>you're poorly trained
Why do you think Matt Pranka rags on cops lack of ability to shoot?

>>65189790
Homes' logic here is making a good case for ballistic shields. If they're tagging your gun they aren't tagging your plates unless you're doomguy holding the gun between your nipples like that one dude from fifteen threads ago.

>>65188377
I'm probably going to commit to the Protech 2014G plates listed here as my first plates. Thanks for the site recommendation. Now onto finding a nice slick carrier for them.

File: Vant.jpg (342.6 KB)

>>65189979
Hence a lot of lights center bias on shields
Short kings with ballistic shields win again???

>>65190001
They're dependable, just keep in mind they're bare minimum Level IV and therefore cannot be expected to have any multi-hit. Protech's marketing material is even pretty explicit about this.
I have a better idea for you, if you don't mind a 1.2" thick plate. This dude here has a set of Protech 2230s for $600 on Gunbroker. He's been sitting on them for months now, so shoot him an offer for $150-200 a plate. This is a MUCH stronger plate with similar weight. Lighter than a Hesco 4403, and stops M2AP at over 3,510ft/s vs the base max requirement of 2,910ft/s. They also simultaneously meet both Level III and IV.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1179981122

If you prioritize a thin plate however then the 2014Gs are solid.
>>65190015
A2 embraces shield meta?!?!

>>65190029
>https://www.gunbroker.com/item/1179981122
I'd been eyeing those too. I'll see if he bites at the offer. Thanks for the input.

>>65190036
No problem. Just keep in mind Level IV plates only have to stop one .30-06 M2AP. Level III plates have to stop six 7.62x51mm M80 with minimum 51mm spacing and 51mm from the plate edges. Lots of Level IV plates will fail the Level III test. The 2230s are one model, among some others, rated for both.

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>>65188547
I need a tactical fur lined cape

>>65190087
Won at $203 a plate.

>>65190108
Welcome to "not gonna sweat about pissing hot loads" gang.

>>65190105
PURCHASE the national style rizz cloak
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256808597198456.html?

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>>65188312
>not rocking the condor cipher jeans with rifle mag pockets and flex waist band for your ccw
legit comfy jeans that have held up for a few years

>>65190142
>C-C-CONDOR!?!?!?

File: chucknorris-583467086.jpg (219.8 KB)

>>65190145
yep, gusseted crotch too
I can chuck norris kick in these bitches

>>65190160
Gun kata pants

File: MV5BNDgzMTA4OWEtYTI2Yi00NDUxLTg5NWMtMjk3ZWQ5OTE1MDM3XkEyXkFqcGdeQWRpZWdtb25n._V1_.jpg (1.1 MB)

>>65190175
Clever.

File: 3463463473473.jpg (1.5 MB)

So, I got my package from Breaking Gear Surplus:
>https://www.instagram.com/breakinggearsurplus/
I was under the impression I was ordering this
>https://solutions.forgelinefieldwear.com/products/wind-shell-jacket-success?variant=44390883197097
But I got the lost arrow version instead, I’m pretty sure they’re exactly the same but he did advertise it was forgeline.
Other than that good comms and fast shipping he is legit but I think he just made a mistake for the post thinking it was forgeline however he deletes posts after they’re sold and I’m pretty sure I remember a photo of the tag which said forgeline

File: 2352362334437347.jpg (1.1 MB)

>>65190211

>>65184974
Didnt see it in the sticky regarding helmet setup, what is the best system for mounting comtacs to helmets? The back flip bars or the regular rail attachment?

>>65190211
>>65190217
Update: he said he called it forgeline since it was the exact same jacket save for the branding & I can't remember for certain if he posted a photo of the tag being forgeline but either way it's fine.
Offered to cut me a deal on the next purchase from him so I recommend him if y'all want anything he's selling.

File: Shoot to Thrill.jpg (242.6 KB)

>>65190266
Its either amp arms or unity marks
The 3M factory arc rail mounts sort of shit.
Amp arms vs marks depends on your helmet and head shape.
>>65190276
Im glad your company is doing well but no need to shill here.

>>65190288
>Im glad your company is doing well but no need to shill here.
I asked if they were legit a few days ago in /arg/, someone wanted me to let them know when I got the package and I'm giving an update in here and /arg/

>>65189946
'because they're poorly trained
like you

>>65190288
Thanks dude, appreciate it, ill look into those

>>65190288
>>65190321
>jewnity
Don't buy from Unity tactical please.

What color gear do you guys usually buy?
For whatever reason I just stick to ranger green/od green/ olive drab, etc.
I was thinking I wouldn’t mind mixing green with woodland camo; or tan/coyote with multicam or desert camo. But I think a lot of people just buy whatever and have a mix match of shit.

>>65190565
Multicam, because it has the most drip.

>>65190565
Depends.
Multicam plate carrier/belt/helmet since it's the most available and works OK everywhere.
You can always throw on alpine/tropic underneath depending on the season and it'll blend nicely.
I like civilian clothes underneath multicam gear though

>>65190565
I've gotten a lot of USMC surplus for cheap in Coyote brown. It blends well enough for the dry south where I live, but I'm trying to blend in some green with woodland camo items.
I probably would have been better off getting multicam items for proper camo in my area, but I think the solid color options don't scream "military" as much and can be used for more things without looking like an autist.

File: frogskin.png (1.3 MB)

>>65190565
Frogskin.

Gilliam is better than Militech and is now the definitive chinamaxxer's armor dealer. Change my mind.
>1. 6.35lb Level IV for $400/set.
https://www.gilliamarms.com/products/model-1635-rf3-multi-curve-armor-plate?
>2. Six-hit heavier Level IV also for $400/set.
https://www.gilliamarms.com/products/model-1023-9-75-x-12-rf3-nij-0101-07-10-x-12-ceramic-armor-plate
>3. $628/set Level IV++ tested against M993, .300 winmag tungsten Swiss P AP, and safari rifles.
https://www.gilliamarms.com/products/model-8002-max-heavy-tungsten-rf3-silicon-carbide-ceramic-armor-plate

>>65190565
>What color gear
UCP, best camo pattern for the dollar.

File: Mullticam Woodland.png (795.4 KB)

LF pics of multicam alpine used with multicam tropic gear
Also, unrelated note man I really wish we got MC woodland instead of standard MC.

I see a lot of slick plate carriers with elastic cummerbunds. What are some of the better options that allow for mounting stuff like side plates?

>>65190773
Something with tegris like the Shaw ARC V2

New plate from Highcom, the SP17 RF2 / III++. 4.1lb for a nominal 9.5x11.5, 1.2" thick, single curve, really more a 9x11.
$336 a plate.
https://www.chasetactical.com/product/sp17-level-iii-rf2-rifle-armor-plate-nij-06-compliant-single-curve?

Initial take, this would have been passable in 2006.

>>65191037
>Spend $336 on a shitty Chinese level III+ plate, that states it's 'nij compliant' to jew retards into thinking that's an nij certification
Or
>Spend $241 for a level 4 hesco
Gee, I wonder what the best choice would be.

>>65191105
>Chinese
It's a Highcom, you can tell from the shape and nominal 9.5x11.5, and made in the USA.
>nij compliant
Technically they're not even supposed to say that. The CPL is the compliant product list. Only the NIJ can declare something compliant. The correct language is "independently tested to" but you can't expect that from Chase or TacShit.
>Spend $241 for a level 4 hesco
Which fails the Level III test and only passes IV by a hair.
>Gee, I wonder what the best choice would be
Used Protech 2230s for $410 a set like what Anon just bought today. He won't get caught flat footed by hypervelocity ammo in the next few years.
I think that's about it for the 2230 supply though. Eh, wait a few months.

>>65190565
I made an entire m81 loadout I just like it
but multicam is the easiest everyone makes gear in that pattern

File: FIRST SHOT FAILURES.png (3.0 MB)

Obligatory "first shot failures" posting for this bread. If the Hesco 4403 and 4800 lose to M2AP as slow as ~2,930ft/s (assuming the lower chrono is correct as you should since this is a passthrough), then future M2AP with a +200ft/s advantage courtesy of new hybrid case tech will be straight up nasty. He's loading this cold too. He can get up to 3,309ft/s out of a .300WM. Add 200ft/s, you're at 3,500, which is still conveniently right below the Protech 2230's rating. The actual v0 number is unknown and remains guarded to this day, Safariland just says no penetrations even when tested in excess of 3,510ft/s. If it can handle M2AP at that speed, stuff like HICAR M855A1+ out of a long barrel won't be an issue. The only thing the 2230 is short on is tungsten core protection, but Protech likes to underpromise with a lot of their ratings, as seen with the DT306C and 2120-5.

I do really think the HICAR stuff will be commercialized and things like "super ARPs" chucking M855 out of a chode braked 8.5" will be future issues for plates to contend with in the next few years.

File: DoD Acquisition.png (558.6 KB)

>>65188514
>>65186934

The MSV is indeed an upgrade from the IOTV from the enduser standpoint of "I have to use this or drop the money for a JPC/CPC because my gear has to have a NSN per unit SOP"

However, as someone who also owns a personal plate carrier, plates, etc. :

Its a meh plate carrier. I absolutely hate the front buckles under the flap and that you cannot remove them, they are sewn in. Please buy any other plate carrier if you are thinking about a front dangler or having cummberbund interchangability. The MSV doesnt offer anything special to warrant that downgrade

File: pepetux.jpg (65.0 KB)

>>65191230
KDH stock price is gonna tank after reading that.

>>65191230
Whatever man, just strap it on and hit the front lines. Israel needs more tax dollars.

File: the bosses.png (955.5 KB)

>>65191264
>ey don they don't like your new vest
>yeah bibi I hear you. We got the best vests. Nobody's got better vests than us. They can't handle the WINNING so we tuned them down a bit to give them something to look forward to! We put the straps in the front. I don't even know what a cummberbund is. Is it something Melania wears, Bibi? I let her do her thing, she lets me do mine. Crye makes me cry bibi.

File: DFNDR Armor Guide.png (1.4 MB)

Alright, one more infographic off the backburner list. DFNDR Armor!
Like Botach, this is just a reference infographic and most of the models here are not really worth your time. Buy the DT306C from CopQuest if you're interested in a 4lb M855A1 stopper. These guys have a neat 0.7" thick 0101.06 Level IV plate but it's very heavy for its price. Rest of the lineup is mediocre, a lot of it 0101.04 holdouts with no drop pro.

>>65186694
>>65186741
3811 anon, did you reach out to Verrett's to get this resolved? Should be a quick exchange if they're at least somewhat honorable.

Anyone have experience with the Crye LPV? I'm torn between the standard and the tactical model. The slick version looks great for compatibility with chest rigs and looks like it would be easier to hide plates under a jacket or something bulky, but the tactical has a lot more utility going on with it. You think that the extra bits the tactical version has would interfere with chest rigs or be harder to hide?

Was talking to my wife about how I want to buy a IIA ACH and a plate carrier with soft armor and while she’s okay with it she asked one simple question
>why?
I honestly didn’t know how to answer, maybe she thinks I plan on being shot at or something, all I could say is “because it’s cool to have” which satisfied her but now it got me thinking…why

>>65193265
it's cool to have is a valid reason on it's own.

>>65193265
because it's cool to have

>>65193265
It's cool to have and you're preparing for another potential 2020 "Summer of Love" or crazy Covid senario.

>>65193270
>>65193271
I mean I guess yeah and she’s fine with that reasoning but I still want to use it

I use my chest rig all the time, when I take her fishing or camping I always put tall boys in the mag pouches and have my ifak and then a dump pouch for whatever supplies I need and she sees the use in that but when would I ever get to actually use a ballistic helmet and plate carrier outside of LARPing for photos

File: PASGT helmet with PVS-14.jpg (813.0 KB)

>>65193283
if you get night vision you have a reason to use your helmet

>>65193292
She knows I want that and that’s the primary reason I’d want a helmet but at that point I’d just get a bump helmet, she thinks it’d be cool for camping though and “as long as I don’t spend like $5000 it’s fine”

Guess I gotta get digis

>>65193265
Cool to have is good. Also use the seatbelt or fire extinguisher analogies. You'll probably never need them, but you still want them because if you need them and don't have them, you're fucked.
Also get her a platecarrier.
>plate carrier with soft armor
and plates I hope. Don't overboard them if you're worried about the wife's reaction. A set of III+ Protech 2120-5s good for 6x M855A1 from Hudsongunner will do more than fine unless this hypervelocity ammo stuff becomes a problem.

File: IBA woodland.jpg (827.4 KB)

>>65193298
look, man. you don't need a reason to get this stuff. I have tons of surplus that serves no practical use to me whatsoever. but I like it, so I buy it.

>>65191037
Probably won't do much better than the Hesco 3611c that were surplus.
Quite comical they still just the compliant lingo after the 4sas4 shit.
>>65191203
You think the buff will ever do a drop test on the new RMA plates or is this the final straw to prove him a shill.

>>65193322
The 3611C is actually a pretty decent Alumina-PE plate. That SP17 is straight up alumina-fiberglass single-curve from 1997 type ass.
Granted, the Protech 2120-5 is also Alumina-glass but it's built harder and is good for 6x M855A1. It's also from 2013, not 2026.
>Quite comical they still just the compliant lingo after the 4sas4 shit.
Did you notice Highcom doesn't officially list the SP17 and SP8? They don't want to be associated with these two sacks of shit like they were with the 4SAS4.
It gets better. Chase calls the SP17 a III++, same designation as the 3S9M without specifying its actual rating. TacShit calls it a III+++. I dunno what the THIRD plus means, but that's pretty serious!
>You think the buff will ever do a drop test on the new RMA plates or is this the final straw to prove him a shill.
He is a shill, that's pretty well proven after the 4SAS4 turncoating he did. Anyways, the new RMA 1155 does have drop pro, but only to 0101.07 single drop spec, hence why it's 0.1lb lighter than the Hesco 4403 when sizing is SAPI M. No reason why he can't drop that one unless it flops the 0101.06 double drop, which Buff simulates, and puts on a worse show than the 4403. He will most likely never drop the new 1165, because in the words of RMA, that's bad optics.
They are working on a new 1165 with drop pro though.

Thoughts on an LBV88 over a low-profile carrier?

>>65193412
Based and modular

>>65193473
gonna need the Colossussy Heavy for that one

Ferro concepts slickster yea or nay?

Also good recs for a bump helmet sub $100? If I’m spending more than that then what the fuck is the point I might as well get a ballistic helmet

>>65193631
> Ferro concepts slickster yea or nay?
It's okay for a meme carrier

>>65188906
Don't buy armor from Taobao, lol.

From dogshit plates and soft armor, to sorta-kinda-maybe Level 3 helmets, 95% of armor on there is certified D-grade chinkshit.

The only vendors that sell "workable" armor are Jinwudun and EDUN tactical (they sell surplus PAP SRT plates).

What Taobao is really good for is nylon gear. Shekkin sells most of their stuff 30% off on Taobao compared to their website(.e.g. their JPC is 110$ compared to 206$) .Also, some of the better repro brands are only available on Taobao like Sunsnow, and Tactical Raiders.

>>65191419
>ICW Elite SRT
I don't get this plate. Velsys PBZSA is literally cheaper and only marginally thicker then this with soft armor.

>SAECs

Why are we considering plates that we no nothing about, and are so esoteric that there's only 2 pictures on the entire internet lol.

>>65193872
Yeah I don't get the ICW Elite SRT either. In fact, this whole squad of "SRT minus" PE plates DFNDR has going are both annoyingly weak and annoyingly overpriced.
Buddy, if I had four grand to spend on PE I'm going straight to VelSys or LTC. I need to figure out how light the LTC 24855 is.
>Why are we considering plates that we no nothing about
Trying to piece together info on ridiculously rare SOF plates is a time-honored /bag/ tradition, lol. We pretty extensively worked out the SAEC's specs. Four pounds, under 0.65" thick, standalone. The only queasy bit is the rating and it points to being equivalent to an Enhanced Concealable SAPI also made at the time. I'm pretty firm it's a super featherweight quasi-IV, but I'm willing to entertain the M2AP velocity might be low and it's really a B-32 API plate.
>>65193860
I like the sound of those EDUNs. How much $$? Jinwudun is pretty shit for plates and helmets. Good for soft and shields. Better than nothing, but Longfri is better. Militech significantly better. LiTai might be better than Militech honestly.

I'd rank Chinese and Chinese-sourced armor brands as follows:
Adept > Gilliam > Militech > Stealth > Longfri > Jinwudun > Aholetech > the d grade shitters

Here's a good one from LiTai. $550 a plate, Level IV standalone, 10x12 actual multi-curve and 0.78" thick. Five pounds. It's down on drop protection but is literally a third of the Hesco 4800's price provided you can get the 5-9 unit rate.
https://www.globalsources.com/Ballistic-plate/Plate-1184940337p.htm

By the way, does anyone else remember when the Hesco 4800 used to be $2.4k a set? Now it's over 3k. They're taking the piss on that. Adept Emperor weighing 4.55lb at ~$3.5k a set is going to roll in and take the 4800 by the nuts.

>>65193889
>Esoteric plates

Any plans on doing a Ceradyne infographic so we can bloat the infographic reserve even more?

>EDUNs

They're the same ones an anon posted a while ago. 1.9kg, no-drop ICW SRT, rated for steel core 5.8 and (I think?) non AP 7.62x54r. They're similar to the ones that buffman tested a while back, but I think these ones are more robust because they use SIC instead of Buffman's plate which uses B4C.

>LiTai

These guys look alright, one of the only Chinese armor companies making B4C plates. Would like to see spec sheets and test reports, might email them. Also their catalog is all over the fucking place, model names even more confusing than Ceradyne...

File: 1000063507.png (1.9 MB)

>>65194088
Forgot picture. 96$ a plate, 192$ a pair

Also, forgot to mention, buying stuff from Taobao and shipping it kinda gets finicky. They don't ship to the US or EU direct so you'll need to use a third party service, and that might skew the final price.

>>65194088
>Ceradyne Infographic
That's planned, but probably the last of the manufacturer-specific infographics. It'll require a lot of digging so it's not just the same ten plates. Ceradyne is tricky because they've got over half a century of history but only a small fraction is preserved. Meanwhile Hesco's entire lineup is the Hesco infographic plus the Mexican Hescos, 3K00, 3K10, and 4K10, then the three VPAM Euro Hescos. That's it.
>so we can bloat the infographic reserve even more?
Emporium. The reserve is a storage bin for effort posts and unmaintained infographics so they never get lost. I need to update it actually with stuff from recent threads.
I do definitely agree the emporium is overwhelmingly armor-focused, but that's why it is separated into sections.
>They're the same ones an anon posted a while ago. 1.9kg, no-drop ICW SRT, rated for steel core 5.8 and (I think?) non AP 7.62x54r.
Okay not a fan of those if that's the case. You need GA141 standard soft armor and that's not easy to source CONUS. Realistically just get a pair of L211s and you've got better plates. How's the price + import?
>These guys look alright, one of the only Chinese armor companies making B4C plates. Would like to see spec sheets and test reports, might email them.
All armor autists seem to be giving them a preliminary thumbs up so far. They've been around longer than Militech and are a larger company (150-200 employees, so like 3x the size of RMA and maybe double Hesco) but haven't moved into the US domestic market.
China doesn't do B4C well and has yet to really master it.
>Also their catalog is all over the fucking place, model names even more confusing than Ceradyne...
It's definitely a "give us your needs and we'll give you a plate" type situation. Gilliam is the same way. The 8002 is actually the result of a custom commission by a buyer that needed multi-hit Swiss P AP protection on the crown (center) of the plate. Wilson then decided to commercialize the 8002.

>>65186235
PIG Delta's or PIG Cold Weather. Mechanix are great but they feel like gardening gloves while the PIG's feel like operator gloves. They also work well for biking bc they're basically MTB gloves.

File: 1000063508.png (1.2 MB)

Hudson gunner selling 2014MC plates for 240 a pair on tacswap.

They're around a quarter of a pound heavier than the 2014Gs, but multicurve now, so they contour to your body better.

Pretty good plates in the sub 300 category, better than what RMA has to offer, at least.

>>65194253
Nice! Numbers-wise they're weaker than the Hesco 4403, so don't expect good lesser threat multi-hit or any appreciable headroom against M2AP, but just over half the price. You can't get new Level IVs this cheap anymore without getting into deep chinesium. Those TitanXP (Longfri) 8.5lb 3x M2AP plates come to mind at $200/set, but are unproven and heavy, plus single curve.

These 2014MCs are still good though for the price. The 2230s are the real prize, at least until the 2240s' warranties expire and they are surplused. I still don't know what the 2240 does better than the 2230. It is a better plate though. Somehow.

Unrelated, Gilliam is now selling his "warehouse" and himself to other armor manufacturers so you ship plates to him and he does inventory / shipping out to customers. The Chinese guys could use this as a certification workaround for the NIJ china ban.

>Gilliam Arms offers secure indoor warehousing and drop-shipping services to fellow ballistic armor manufacturers from our climate-controlled facility on the Crystal Coast of North Carolina. Whether you're a domestic manufacturer looking to position inventory closer to your East Coast customers, or an international supplier in need of a U.S.-based fulfillment partner, our conditioned warehouse space provides a clean, temperature-stable environment purpose-suited to ceramic plates, UHMWPE backers, soft armor panels, and finished hard armor. Stored goods remain in your inventory; we provide the four walls, the climate control, and the hands-on-deck.
>https://www.gilliamarms.com/pages/for-manufacturers

https://youtube.com/shorts/Cckq19OeiMY?si=oKQy6CbqF9lFljq7


This video made me think of you guys. Most of the time people buy those tactical shit for mental ego it's like when women buy stuff they dont need

>>65194391
I think you were looking for the knife general mister supply chain expert.
>>65181283

>>65190565
RG and CB. I only buy solid color gear because it goes well with multicam, m81, dcu, marpat, etc

>>65194391
As much as I find airsoft and larpers lame and gay, they actually do provide a valuable service for gear companies during dry periods. Particularly euro brands are probably majorly supported by airsofters, like WAS for example has always had a decent reputation but before Ukraine I think its fair to say airsofters were the ones keeping their lights on. Spiritus seems to get police and SOF contracts now, but for a good decade their whole customer base was instagram larpers who wanted shit in weird camos and got a dopamine rush from drop marketing. I recall hearing that for several years Australian soldiers weren't allowed to use aftermarket pouches, so Id say platatac is still here off the backs of dentists and accountants buying tactical gear they dont need. Probably a lot of companies in that situation, though of course it would be bad business to admit to such a thing.

>>65194391
Egofags will always exist, I just like to learn about this shit like I like to learn how to transport someone with a broken neck, I'm not fantasizing about getting my dick sucked for learning a skill.

>>65194391
>You vill not buy the gear.
>You vill not learn the skills.
>you vill be subjected to new buzzword by literal who chinese man working "supply chain expert" tvo itty bitty titties and a mini job who will disappear in six months, once he has served his purpose to us.
>you vill be happy.
Not falling for that shit. There are people who genuinely spend themselves into ruin over this, but there is nothing wrong with a man having hobbies, even if it is shitty zombie survival knives you can get for cheap on taobao.

>>65194391
>like when women buy stuff they dont need
I will try to remember that when, I want to feel pretty. Which is a lot. Like a lot a lot. Imma gonna have soo much gear anna feela soo pretty!

>>65195066
Buy some construction paper, cut it into big cat ears, and wrap it in duct tape. Use velcro to stick them onto your helmet so you feel kawaii desu! ;) ;) ;)

>>65193860
>he doesn't know about the taiwanese auction house for exotic plates

>>65189912
Is this real?

>>65189912
his parents died because they wore ICW plates but forgot the soft armor. If they read armor infographic #37 they'd still be here!

File: photo_2026-05-30_20-59-01.jpg (121.7 KB)

>>65194172
>How's the price + import?

Picrel is (I believe) current shipping rates on Cainiao, incl tariffs. Plates are 3.8kg a pair, so shipping should be around 125.8¥ (18.6$).
So final price is around ≈200USD.

Not that bad, actually.

>Speaking of Chinese armor...
UHMWPE panels are pretty hard to fuck up, and the Chinese invested a shit ton into PE manufacturing.

So how cheap can you get until it gets to the "would probably kill you" category? There's a store on Aliexpress called "LPRED XSMS" that sells "3A" soft armor panels for stupid cheap. I have an airsoft LAP panel, and their insert cost 28$.

File: image_2026-05-03_18-34-58.png (475.8 KB)

>>65195075
>hmm yes, I will totally pay 3k$ for a pair of old ass delaminated ceradyne plates

>>65195138
Yeah those 92547s are probably fried. They had 96034s at some point, years ago, and even allegedly 2572575s.
>>65195136
Very interesting. My concern with cheap PE is how it does conditioned.

File: Screenshot 2026-05-30 213942.png (326.6 KB)

>>65195154
Said soft armor plates, and reviews.

Also, how do 3A panels fair against frag?

>>65195178
>how do 3A panells fair against frag?
very well

>>65195178
Is triangle for pp?

>>65195188
Agreed. Milspec soft armor is like Level II without the .357 mag. This PE doesn't look half bad though. I'm a big fan of armor cheap enough to give to dudes as loaners.
>>65195205
Abdominal or pp depending on size. DMGEAR makes flaps so you can put a whole ass 10x12 in there.

>>65195205
I don't have kids yet, so pp protection is of the upmost priority

>>65195188
Depends entirely on the size and speed of the frag.
3A may do well against rice grain-sized pieces of frag from hand grenades, especially from a distance after air resistance has slowed down the frag.
But marble-sized hardened steel ball traveling at mach-fuck will easily rip through both sides of a 3A insert.
And a jagged thumb-sized shell splinter traveling at 4000 m/s won't even be phased by a 3A insert.
For reference, see Valgear's youtube video testing an old German S-mine. The 3A vest he hung a couple meters from the blast had no chance against the chunks of 8mm cut mild-steel wire the mine was stuffed with.

>>65195245
To say nothing of tungsten frag like RUAG's "Pearl" shit. At some point one has to treat both pistol AP and especially strong frag as rifle threats, and roll lotsa plates.

Any of the taobao Level IVs viable? I'd be willing to entertain a no-drop mildly cheat ringed plate as a steel alternative, although the TitanXP 8.5lb for $100 a pop seems viable enough there.
Those GTEagle and CircleLoop plates look horrible. Rice paper crack arrestors and gaps between ceramic tiles. Fuck outta here.

Alright, Taobao Infographic is on the list probably before Dripking Mansions aka china infographic #4.

File: Screenshot 2026-05-30 235007.png (706.1 KB)

>>65195332
Most plates on taobao are your run-of-the-mill C to D grade Chinese plates. Cheat-ringed, low ceramic purity, yada yada. You're taking a gamble because most vendors dont show the inside of the plate.

If you look hard enough you'll find better plates, and maybe some absolutely crazy shit, like this 12.7×108mm AP rated plate from EDUN tactical.

Navigating taobao is pretty hard though. You'll need to switch the language to Chinese and in-app location to mainland China. I use the mobile app and a screen translator and doomscroll until I find anything interesting.

>>65184994
>The same guy making the thread all the time is starting to suck.
What have you done about that, besides complaints?

>>65195386
>NIJ-V+++
Son of a fucking bitch, a Taobao infographic is now REQUIRED. The need is UNEQUAL. Very nice!
I'll look more into this and see if I can work numbers to figure if it's cheat ringed. I know the PLA was interested in a .50 cal plate years ago but it's good to see some business finally show up besides that phone book SERBAN plate.

>>65195386
Alright, so the math maths at 1.44" thick and 8.8lb for 1x 12.7x108mm B-32 API at 2,720ft/s with 50m standoff. Possible small cheat ring and drop protection probably isn't there.
BFD is gonna be a bit fucknuts and not as good as the Colossus Heavy versus .50 M2AP but probably survivable with a CAP.

>>65185505
Whats tbe difference?

>>65195386
>Anti-pharmaceutical Supplies Store
TF?

>>65195639
It's Taobao man, final frontier of chinesium. Honestly I'm liking this .50 cal plate even if shipping / import's a bitch.
8.8lb and still five pounds lighter than Level IV steel.

SARVIP chads are so vindicated.
Remember when everybody told us that .50 Cal stopping plates were all bullshit? Now who has the last laugh?
I don't know about that Taobao plate, and B32 is truly weaker than .50 BMG M2 AP, but I'm feelin good.
About that, B32 is only rated for 20mm RHA at 100 yards:
> https://roe.ru/en/production/land-forces/small-arms-sv/small-arms-ammunition-sv/12-7/57-bz-542/
So I guess it's kind of like 7.62x54mmR B32 vs. .30-06 M2 AP. The American round is tougher.
Still happy though.

>>65190266
otto arms

>>65195870 #
Given that, the 8.8lb weight definitely seems to check out. This EDUN plate is only half a pound heavier and 0.24" or so thicker than the Gilliam 8002. Would be very easy for Gilliam to just beef the 8002 up, then that gets us a domestic version for maybe $420 a plate. I might email Wilson about that.

For a surplus ACH how would you rank the following:

Gentex
Paraclete
Protech
Ceradyne
Busch

Most of the deals I'm seeing are either Protech or Paraclete

>>65196047
Honestly they're all good. Gentex and Ceradyne made military ACH helmets. Paraclete, Protech, and Busch served the cop market. The military ones were probably under stricter quality control.
So like this maybe:
Gentex, Ceradyne, MSA > Busch, Protech, Paraclete >>>>> Armorsource
Armorsource is the C-tier ACH maker, lots of scandals, like they're the RMA of helmets.

>>65196047
>>65196079
The Busch stuff has a reputation for lower BFD, which could be helpful.
>The military ones were probably under stricter quality control.
NIJ doesn't check shit for helmets, so yeah, that's true.

Taobao armor bout to mog the fuck outta RMA with that .50 caliber plate. RMA version would either weigh fifteen pounds or have BFD that shapes it into one of the egyptian pyramids.

File: IMG_3718.jpg (3.0 MB)

>>65190565
>>65190565
I had an OD rig and recently replaced it with RG, bc it seems more versatile. I have RG and MC field wear. If I was gonna go for peak drip, it would be MCB regardless of how impractical.

>>65196108
And a multicam black cloak motherfucker.
https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256808597198456.html

File: IMG_8447.jpg (1.6 MB)

>>65196144
Am I allowed to buy that if I’m not a member or Reddit or Discord? Picrel is my cold/wet weather jacket combo and nobody can stop me.

>>65187465
Still looking for input, thanks.

>>65196171
Yes just buy it you fucker. PUT THE CLOAK ON THE COAT, BUT FIRST SEE IF TAOBAO HAS BETTER PRICE.

File: IMG_2625.jpg (70.2 KB)

>>65196199

>>65196199
>comparative shopping on chinese data mining sites
Yeah, just create accounts from here to pnigpingistan and download thier backdoor apps and enter all your personal.data to save $4.

>>65196221
What kinda sword you buying for $80? mall katana?
>>65196222
Check em but not true. Just make an account on a computer for both sites using a prepaid debit and a fake name. Use the gas station down the street for delivery. Uni Uni don't give a shit.

>>65196257
>Just make an account on a computer for both sites using a prepaid debit and a fake name. Use the gas station down the street for delivery. Uni Uni don't give a shit.
I'm not a computor poly sci majorette. I just eat Pebbles and dranks. I'm lucky I can go outside alone somedays.

File: 1760235460574606.jpg (25.4 KB)

>>65196330
To be fair fruity pebbles are amazing with a fresh gallon of milk, 7:00 AM on a Saturday. That's a vibe.

File: chinkshit.png (24.9 KB)

thank mr. google ai

>>65196556
>domo arigato, mr roboto

>>65196257
I’m sure it’s against the law to not have a sword and melee weapon. The only problem is I’ve seen a vagina so I’m orbited from ordering.

Does FMA actually make decent bump helmets for the price?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0D58L2HYT

Plate carrier camo recommendations for east TX? No multicam, m81, etc anything normal. I'm thinking mossy oak break up or flecktarn.

File: vtjhtw53c74h1.jpg (107.9 KB)

>>65196100
>>65196079
At least the RMA plate will have good quality control and will look like it wasn't slapped together with duct tape. Oh. . . oh no. . .

>>65196946
Lol, try this guy.
>Def got up their customer service. I got a pair of 1192s from them a while back that had similar (and maybe slightly worse) stitching issues. I believe it was a single corner on 2 different plates and the bottom edge was messy and bunched up too.
The 1192 was their flagship and over 1k a set. Granted, RMA offered to switch the plates out, but that's a workmanship issue. If they can't get the cover right then that's not promising for the ballistic components.
Both of my L210s and both of my eleven year old 2230s are perfectly stitched.

File: IMG_1129.jpg (1.2 MB)

For my non-larper /k/ommandos how have you set up your issued gear?

File: cummerbund buckles.png (600.4 KB)

>>65197148
Man the MSV looks like such dogshit.
> unreinforced laser-cut MOLLE, already going sloppy
> bulky af plastic buckles on the shoulders.
> super-light stitching
> non-removable bulky plastic buckles that go under (WTF?) the front flap
Were they joking when they made this, or is wearing it a humiliation ritual for non-SOCOM troops? I don't think you could design a worse carrier.

>>65195870
I never understood the ".50 cal plates are bullshit" argument. Yes, behind armor blunt trauma is an issue. You control it by building the plate so it's proportional to the round. The Colossus Heavy is slightly heavier and slightly thicker than this Taobao EDUN "IV+++" GA-8 plate and has frankly very reasonable BFD.
Yeah, there are fraud .50 cal plates like that Atlas BR-6. Advertised to stop 3x 12.7x108mm B-32 API at 50 meters, gets folded like laundry on the first shot and the round basically tears it in half.

Got to add to this that maybe if you did the Spiritussy/Agilite/Tasmanian Tiger thing and put airmesh everywhere, it would be even worse. That's literally the only thing I see that could make it worse.

>>65197200
They spent all the money on a million LSAPIs and ESAPIs that are effectively 1.3lb lighter than the older ones.

>>65197206
If the carrier sucks, people are going to hate it anyway. Imagine you have magazines on the front flap of your plate carrier, where they belong, and you have to lift the whole damn thing just to take it off. Besides, they're going to give you the Sig M7, so you're going to be carrying more weight anyway.

>>65197207
That's o-o-okay! They'll just uh give everyone more LSAPIs and LSBIs that can't stop current Chinese steel core 5.8mm and will get their ass kicked by DVC-12 from 150 yards!
And if that's too heavy, they'll uh make them lighter with LSAPI GEN-II, and maybe even ULWSAPI!

File: ccgk.png (355.6 KB)

>>65195332
Here's another potentially viable Taobao plate. CCGK's SiC level 4 plate for 100$ per, ceramic tile array, and only slightly cheat ringed! They have a pretty well designed website as well (ccgk.com).

The company's been around since the 90s, so longer than Militech or Litai, but probably not on par with them.

>>65197303
Also emailed them for a test report.

>>65197303
Not too bad, looks like 4.62lb for the Level III and 6.27lb for the IV. Cheat ring is gonna be minor but def still there.
>The company's been around since the 90s, so longer than Militech or Litai, but probably not on par with them.
I've been telling people RMA didn't invent the cheat ring. Mister "Steve Jobs" can't even take credit for that one with the 1189 back in 2013. The NIJ has permitted cheat rings since the 1970s. It's likely they predate the NIJ and can probably be traced to domestic stuff from the 1960s.

>>65197304
Kewl. China will sell anything for the right price. Could ya also ask if they have anything M993 or Swiss P rated?

>>65197391
>China will sell anything for the right price. Could ya also ask if they have anything M993 or Swiss P rated?

They probably could make it, but LiTai would be a better option.

Does the Chinese military have an Xsapi equivalent? What plates do the PLA issue anyway?

File: ccgk2.png (675.8 KB)

>>65197376
>Cheat ring is gonna be minor but def still there.
Actually, I stand corrected. It has no cheat ring

>>65197435
There's still going to be a foam area up top, but only at the corners.
Do you know if they nominally size, ex the 10x12 is like Longfri and it's really 9.5x11.5?
>>65197424
They go off the GA141 scale and cap out at 7.62x54R API 3x at sub-25mm BFD, which is GA "Special Type" above GA-6. There's apparently GA-7 and GA-8 now, with that 12.7x108mm B-32 API EDUN plate GA-8. Stands to reason GA-7 is probably some kind of XSAPI equivalent. The Colossus and Gilliam 8002 are apparently both part-Chinese (8002 is basically all chinese except the adhesive) so they have the tech and capacity. Both of those are also well north of XSAPI level.

>>65197424
>What plates do the PLA issue anyway?
I think LiTai, Longfri, and those EDUNs. To get an XSAPI+, take >>65197303 and beef up to 8.3lb and 31mm so it approximately matches the Gilliam 8002. You'll get an almost identical plate.

>>65193412
I have one and never use it. I'll sell it to you at shipping costs.

>>65197701
I've already got one, actually. Just wasn't sure how well it played with a plate carrier.

>>65197980
Oh I misunderstood. It'll fit fine so long as you increase the size over it. They used to put them over Flak jackets.

File: 20260530_085419.jpg (1.8 MB)

Nocturne industries ship me my fucking alpha mount you jerks

FYI, Botach has a IIIA+ face shield rated for 7.62x25 Tokarev stuff.
https://surplus.botach.com/protech-702mt-ballistic-face-shield-nij-level-iiia-multi-hit-tokarev-police-trade

>>65198017
What is this pouch on the back of your helmet?

>>65190029
Different anon but
Do u know of anyone else selling these?
He says on the site it’s only one plate left

>>65198112
The 2230s or 2014MCs? 2230s come up for sale every few months as they are cop surplused out. 2014MCs seem underbuilt and Gilliam 1023s seem a lot better call.

>>65198123
I only saw he had the 2230s I believe listed. I want to get something to replace my ESAPIs, They’re ancient.

I was thinking on getting the L211s on Midwest cause my only fear is M855A1. But it’s also a struggle cause I do a lot of sitting and standing at my job and it’s hard to justify to my back wearing a 7lb plate 5 days a week

>>65198131
2014MCs would be a downgrade from the ESAPIs unless they're roached. The 2230s are really good but 7.5lb and 1.2" thick.
>I was thinking on getting the L211s on Midwest cause my only fear is M855A1
You're gonna be waiting a minute from Midwest. Try Sierra. The L211s are good. They piss hot on BFD ( over 44mm) versus 7.62x51mm M80 at NIJ spec but do stop 7.62x54 LPS.
My concern is that if HICAR is successful you'll be dealing with M855A1+ with an extra 400ft/s. The L211 doesn't have the backer to catch that, you'll need a good overbuilt IV and the 2230 is perfect, but hard to get.
Wait a few months, the 2230s come up for sale every 4-6. Buy the L211s for low-profile stuff but run another set of plates for if the situation gets real hot. I would not trust the L211 even against "M855+" at HICAR spec absent a good test report. It's an SRT. Very thin backer.

And yep, looks like high pressure everything is on the menu.
Steeltards are fucked beyond measure. Anyone running by the book RF2 plates? You're fine for now, but will eventually be left behind.
https://soldiersystems.net/2026/05/31/federal-signs-landmark-agreement-with-u-s-army-to-accelerate-high-performance-ammunition/

>Federal Ammunition announced it has executed an agreement that allows the United States Army to utilize its patented Peak Alloy ammunition case technology for use in multiple cartridges and weapon systems. The new agreement specifies conditions necessary prior to granting Government Purpose Rights, such as the delivery of 40 million cases featuring technology.
>The agreement with the U.S. Army is inclusive of multiple chamberings including 50-cal and below.
That Taobao 8.8lb SiC-PE plate looking real tasty for down the road stuff, but we need an importer. No confidence versus PEAK .50 BMG but should be okay against enhanced M993 and Swiss P, assuming (big if) the ceramic isn't deficient.

I'm working on assembling my first carrier and plates right now, but doing so makes me think of getting something for my wife. She's under 5ft, so what do I need to consider when getting something for her? Are small sized plates best? What about stuff for female curves? Still new to all of this, I appreciate the input.

>>65198299
Sapi S or XS.
Best bet would be SAPI XS. They were made for 4'11" women. Just buy surp. No vendor makes XS plates as a standard stock item.

>>65198299
Goofy question, but how big is her bust? She's probably an 8x10 or SAPI S (or XS depending on how below 5' she is), but unless she's busty she can get by without female curve plates.
Those limit your options significantly
For the most part, to a shit-tier RMA FSAPI, or cred-blocked point blank or safariland models. Modern VTP SAPI (GEN III / IV) family is partly designed to suit both men and women. If she isn't like Dog the Bounty Hunter's wife then regular multi-curve plates will probably do if the carrier is sized appropriately for her.

>>65198299
If you plan on doing "co-op" home defense or civil unrest situations, consider a ballistic shield as well, that way if you have or will have kids, they got something they can hide behind.

>>65198323
>4 year old son has already loved attending HEMA classes with me.
>Give him a ballistic shield to become Roman Legionary.
I'll add it to the list.

>>65198334
Entrust your BLOODLINE to JINWUDUN.
https://jinwudun.com/collections/bulletproof-shield
Or cheaper used shields from BOTACH, $400 and their shipping is usually pretty light.
https://surplus.botach.com/authentic-police-riot-control-shield-nij-level-iiia-police-trade/

Just keep in mind IIIA ain't shit to rifle rounds.

>>65198061
Shaw BRAIN pouch. 80$, knockoffs are 20$.

File: 1238102.png (1.4 MB)

American shield market is cooked. Can buy 20x30" Level IV chinesium from Botach for less than 18x30" IIIA from Armor Express.

>>65197479
>GA7 and GA8

I think it's another "NIJ III++" situation where the manufacturer just makes it up.

PLA doesn't use GA101 anyway. GA101 is for LE.

>>65198475
>I think it's another "NIJ III++" situation where the manufacturer just makes it up.
Or perhaps it's a recent amendment perhaps to have an equivalent to GOST 34286-2017's BR6, which is the same rating as GA-8 except it's three shots versus one and the BFD limit is 17mm versus 25mm. Legitimate BR6 plates are a no-show for good reason. It's not possible outside of vehicle armor right now, especially not with Russia. If Ceradyne was still around and Zylon performed as advertised with no drawbacks, then yeah, easily doable with those combined with modern tech, but that's far beyond Russia's ability right now.
GA-8 however is more reasonable and reflects the difficulty of stopping multiple B-32 API on the same plate. I don't think it's doing it under 25mm, so either it's a made up rating like you said or the BFD limit is relaxed versus lower levels.
>PLA doesn't use GA101 anyway. GA101 is for LE.
Conceded. I was under the impression they loosely did and both the regular and "enhanced" plates they procured by the shitload in 2020 were "Special Type." Weaker rated for 5.8 DBP87 following GA BFD requirements and the enhanced 7.62x54R API.
It's kinda like how Russia doesn't really use GOST 34286 given their current plates (which they can't procure in serious quantities) are BR3+, BR4+, and BR5+ which have no standard definitions.

>>65198437
Thanks

>>65198207
Much appreciated anon!

I’ll hang back and wait for the 2230s. I’m glad u brought up the HICAR stuff, I’m unaware of what this is but it’ll eventually bleed into the civilian market

File: paraclete.png (273.9 KB)

What sort of NVG shrouds will this screw in the front of the helmet accept? And can I mount a gopro there if I get the right one? Idk how any of this works

>>65198829
This stuff:
https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/ussocom-s-hicar-program-wants-to-double-the-m4-s-effective-range-44828497
Basically new high pressure ammo 80k psi+ standard and stronger upper receivers.

Travelling all day. Can someone summarize the thread? I left it off with armor. Let me guess... also, I swallowed a bug.

File: sdfgsdg84we6rg84sd6g8f4sd68f4we684.jpg (2.1 MB)

>>65198017
Mirin' the flag, Florida fren.

Ok so im trying to square away my backpack shit, im an infantryman, these are the options im considering.
My "doctrine" would be having an assault pack that I can use to just carry what I need for combat (ammo / grenades / explosives / mg ammo / mission specific equipment) but is also big enough that I can fit some sustainment if needed like a winter jacket for cold weather, some water and rations not much.
The ruck would be for patrols and multi day stays, the bigass ruck if im doing extremely long patrols in cold weather carrying alot of shit, or if im mechanized using it as a locker while it stays on the vehicle all the time.
I already have a tt malice pack and mystery ranch satl and I intend on keeping them so my main focus is on the assault pack. I especially like the satls ability to be used as a makeshift assault pack if compressed since its internal frame although its gonna carry weight a bit less well than an external frame like the cf3 or an Alice type, the satl type 1 big pocket lid has a flap on its back that makes it extend further away from your back vs the new daypack 2 pocket lids that have the buckles attached right on the pocket which I find to be better especially when the pack isn't full.

>2/2
The malice is a very good pack only things I'd change are id make the side pockets taller going all the way down vs being half height with the alice attachement points, the clipped bottom pouches get tight af when you fill the pack, the lid is fine but id like a mr type lide with 2 pockets while maintaining the straps for attaching things on top.
I like the bullock but its gonna be too small for sustainment and I dont like the idea of small ass assault packs like hakey flatpack etc when you can just use a normal assault pack and fill it less, the 3 dap is nice just super expensive, already had one but sold it now considering getting a new one, kantamus seems pretty nice, can be used as a rucksack but compresses well, little brother kinda same idea but not lidded so less flexibility to carry stuff, crossfire cf2 seems extremely interesting, basically a mr 3dap but lidded and easier to add and remove pouches but being framed im not sure if it would be annoying as an assault pack, also expensive as hell.


ASSAULT PACK: platatac bullock large / mystery ranch 3dap / savotta kantamus / eberlestock little brother / crossfire cf2

RUCK: crossfire cf3 / mystery ranch satl

BIGASS RUCK: tactical tailor malice pack / platatac long range alice / mystery ranch blackjack 100 / savotta jakaari XL

Are there any good ways to integrate a revolver into modern fighting kit? I don't see a lot of molle attachments for revolvers, speed loaders, or individual rounds of ammo. Obviously a semi-auto is a more sensible choice in most situations, but I'd still like the capability if it's out there.

A while back I got entire set of italian surplus vest with inserts. I since got rid of it but have kept a plates, and now I put them in a new carrier. I was talking with a boot who kept insisting that surplus ceramics that are past their date are worthless. He is not a very smart person, so at first I didnt think much of it - how the fuck is a ceramic tile supposed to be bad just because it's past the date on a sticker? But now I am not sure and it bothers me. Should I sacrifice side plates for testing for a piece of mind?
Them italian plates are supposed to be level 4, but as long as they will stop .308 I think Im good.

>>65199848
>how the fuck is a ceramic tile supposed to be bad just because it's past the date on a sticker? But now I am not sure and it bothers me. Should I sacrifice side plates for testing for a piece of mind?
It's not the ceramic that goes bad, it's the backer and/or the adhesive bonding the backer and other layers to the ceramic. This varies from model to model, how the plates were stored, temperature, rough handling, etc.

>>65198861
https://www.ebay.com/itm/146774637331

>>65199848
>ceramics that are past their date are worthless. He is not a very smart person
Just have him shoot you and teach him a lesson!

Aw fuck, Hesco got another suspension! This time on their strongest ceramic enchilada, the Level IV 4K10 licensed and domestically manufactured by Carolina Performance in Mexico!
https://cjttec.org/nij-advisory-notice-02-2026/

File: Games on your phone.jpg (106.6 KB)

>>65199530
>Assault pack
Youre on the right track.
Assault pack is getting snivel gear, maybe an insulating top if its really cold when its static. But everything else must support the assault (water, powerbars, ammo, mission critical equipment). And it must have space to spare for goodies/other guys shit.
>Ruck
Rucks are for movements to a patrol base. You will be operating hub and spoke not point to point. Patrolling with a ruck on is a dogshit time in terms of force preservation and ability to fight. Good luck ejecting your ruck and assaulting uphill into a near ambush in one fluid motion.
>Big ruck
Yeah basically. But you should be ready to move this dismounted from vehicles. If you are leaving this thing in trucks/atop trucks/etc you need it to be 100% smooth on the outside, no sleeping pad bundled to sides,etc. It needs to be slick and TIGHT otherwise its never making it off the truck.
> platatac bullock large
Honestly the ideal size for an assault pack. That 25-35L space is what you should be shooting for.
>3dap
See below
>savotta kantamus
Too big as an assault pack, too small as a useful ruck. But lack of subdivision means fuck that on an assault. Good luck getting access to anything in a timely fashion
>eberlestock little brother
Honestly see above. Stupid shape as well.
>crossfire cf2
Too much money
Too much frame
You dont need hipstraps on the assault pack. Think more jansport and less ruck


>Mystery ranch this
>Mystery ranch that
Hot take: I dont care for MR at all. The trizip is fucking stupid and if you have a zipper fail you will be suffering since you cant easily safetypin it. Get a proper bucket style ruck for anything over like 50-60L. Im also just not impressed with MR rucks ability to swallow objects, everytime someone has to pack a MR ruck its like a gypsy ruck with shit hanging outside/off the side of it because its 100L or whatever of capacity is too subdivided into pockets to eat things like cammie netting, sleeping pads, etc.


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